Roses series

[RP London]

21 minutes ago, redjonn said:

No problem with the answer... you gave some reasons as to why it's a different situation but to me original inter-state plus the first/earlier SoO were not greatly attractive to fans/media I still wonder how they turned it around to being the golden goose it is now...

a large amount of good fortune.. some proper rivalry, hatred between players, biff and Queensland winning early on, then it was a case of it growing year on year due to old scores not being settled until it grew to what it is... any of those things not happening and it would have been a bit of a damp squib and faded away.

massive oversimplification but... 

[Damien]

43 minutes ago, redjonn said:

No problem with the answer... you gave some reasons as to why it's a different situation but to me original inter-state plus the first/earlier SoO were not greatly attractive to fans/media I still wonder how they turned it around to being the golden goose it is now...

NSW didn't care initially because the old interstate was that uncompetitive and they had won the previous 20 series (and only won 4 matches v 56 for NSW in those series) and a total of 50 of the 66 series played. Queensland won the first SOO game, were passionate about it and could pick Queenslanders playing in the NSWRL so were competitive as I've said. There was a real rivalry and resentment there to be built on. All of that translated into intense matches that were a cut above, and lets face it plenty of biff.

Absolutely none of this is applicable to any Roses series here. Players don't care and fans don't care.

Edited June 6, 2023 by Damien

[Sports Prophet]

I think what makes any idea of Yorks v Lancs as average an enticement as England v France will be the exact same issue. There will be headline England star players missing from that fixture.

Heaven forbid England had a full compliment including NRL players when they played France a few weeks ago.

On the other hand, you tell me 4 years ago, the Burgess brothers, Graham, Hodgson, Sutton, Williams and Whitehead would all return for a War of the Roses match, I reckon for a one off match, you’d have sold 20-30k tickets.

Maybe a single one off fixture at the end of the season is all it needs to be. Set it up as a last chance to impress before England selection. Post season would be the only way the NRL releases your players.

Edited June 6, 2023 by Sports Prophet

[RigbyLuger]

24 minutes ago, Sports Prophet said:

On the other hand, you tell me 4 years ago, the Burgess brothers, Graham, Hodgson, Sutton, Williams and Whitehead would all return for a War of the Roses match, I reckon for a one off match, you’d have sold 40k tickets.

40k???

[The Legend]

Yorkshire would batter them. They've always produced the best players. Like Hanley, Schofield, Robinson and Burgess.

Yorkshire is just a superior place and Lancashire don't even want to take us on. They're afraid.

[JM2010]

Potential teams including NRL players. 

Pryce

Johnstone

Wardle

Newman

Young

Lewis

Abdull

Walmsley

Hodgson

Oledski

Bateman

Whitehead

Smith

 

Subs

Burgess

Leeming

Holroyd

King

 

Welsby

Makinson

Farnworth

Percival

Marshall

Williams

Smith

Lees

Clarke

Thompson

Farrell

Bachelor

Sutton

 

Subs

Havard

Hill

D. Walker

Watkins

[bobbruce]

1 hour ago, JM2010 said:

Potential teams including NRL players. 

Pryce

Johnstone

Wardle

Newman

Young

Lewis

Abdull

Walmsley

Hodgson

Oledski

Bateman

Whitehead

Smith

 

Subs

Burgess

Leeming

Holroyd

King

 

Welsby

Makinson

Farnworth

Percival

Marshall

Williams

Smith

Lees

Clarke

Thompson

Farrell

Bachelor

Sutton

 

Subs

Havard

Hill

D. Walker

Watkins

Is Batchelor not from Yorkshire. 

[bobbruce]

1 minute ago, bobbruce said:

Is Batchelor not from Yorkshire. 

And Clarke. 

[JM2010]

8 minutes ago, bobbruce said:

Is Batchelor not from Yorkshire. 

 

6 minutes ago, bobbruce said:

And Clarke. 

Good point. Have to take them two out and add them to Yorkshire. 
Need to find two replacements now

[bobbruce]

3 minutes ago, JM2010 said:

 

Good point. Have to take them two out and add them to Yorkshire. 
Need to find two replacements now

Walker or Ackers for the hooking role. 

[JM2010]

5 minutes ago, bobbruce said:

Walker or Ackers for the hooking role. 

I had Walker on the bench so put him to 9 and Ackers on the bench. I need another 2nd rower too

[EggFace]

No and this ###### need to stop.

We need to go back to the mid 1980s to 1994 to see what we can too.

[ghost crayfish]

Having a game like this played in isolation won't be any good, definitely agree with that. But position it in the calendar as a genuine selection trial and it might help to create rivalry and a sense of context. So for me, it's not about either a roses game or a test, it's about having both.

I think England should kick off its season with an England v International All Stars game - it not only gives England a hit out, it introduces new overseas players and could be a higher profile a vehicle to promote the new Super League season.

Then later in the year, a roses game, then a few weeks later, a test against France, or if they refuse to take it seriously, Ireland. The roses game becomes a selection trial, which in itself creates talking points that fuel rivalry - who is under pressure after a poor All Stars game? Who is gunning for their spot? etc.

If the SL season is reduced as IMG has suggested, there is room for more events like this.

Edited June 9, 2023 by ghost crayfish

[Anita Bath]

7 hours ago, bobbruce said:

Is Batchelor not from Yorkshire. 

Not many Batchelors in Yorkshire...by the same principle thats why Roy Virgin played cricket for Northants.

[JM2010]

8 hours ago, ghost crayfish said:

Having a game like this played in isolation won't be any good, definitely agree with that. But position it in the calendar as a genuine selection trial and it might help to create rivalry and a sense of context. So for me, it's not about either a roses game or a test, it's about having both.

I think England should kick off its season with an England v International All Stars game - it not only gives England a hit out, it introduces new overseas players and could be a higher profile a vehicle to promote the new Super League season.

Then later in the year, a roses game, then a few weeks later, a test against France, or if they refuse to take it seriously, Ireland. The roses game becomes a selection trial, which in itself creates talking points that fuel rivalry - who is under pressure after a poor All Stars game? Who is gunning for their spot? etc.

If the SL season is reduced as IMG has suggested, there is wrong for more events like this.

Think this could work. Like the idea of an England vs All Stars season opener

[JM2010]

Should players such as Knowles, Singleton, Pearce-Paul and Griffin be included or should a Cumbria vs London/South game be played as well?

[yipyee]

On 06/06/2023 at 16:49, Sports Prophet said:

I think what makes any idea of Yorks v Lancs as average an enticement as England v France will be the exact same issue. There will be headline England star players missing from that fixture.

Heaven forbid England had a full compliment including NRL players when they played France a few weeks ago.

On the other hand, you tell me 4 years ago, the Burgess brothers, Graham, Hodgson, Sutton, Williams and Whitehead would all return for a War of the Roses match, I reckon for a one off match, you’d have sold 20-30k tickets.

Maybe a single one off fixture at the end of the season is all it needs to be. Set it up as a last chance to impress before England selection. Post season would be the only way the NRL releases your players.

Graham wouldn't qualify for Yorkshire or Lancashire though, might as well ask Konrad Hurrell to play as he's lived in Yorkshire.

Does Williams come from Yorkshire? Thought he was from GM ?

[yipyee]

6 hours ago, JM2010 said:

Should players such as Knowles, Singleton, Pearce-Paul and Griffin be included or should a Cumbria vs London/South game be played as well?

And this is the nonesense why this outdated concept won't work 

Unless there's a city vs country team they could play for which is an even more ridiculous concept

[yipyee]

22 hours ago, JM2010 said:

Potential teams including NRL players. 

Pryce

Johnstone

Wardle

Newman

Young

Lewis

Abdull

Walmsley

Hodgson

Oledski

Bateman

Whitehead

Smith

 

Subs

Burgess

Leeming

Holroyd

King

 

Welsby

Makinson

Farnworth

Percival

Marshall

Williams

Smith

Lees

Clarke

Thompson

Farrell

Bachelor

Sutton

 

Subs

Havard

Hill

D. Walker

Watkins

Is that Yorkshire vs the North west counties ?

Thought the idea was Yorkshire vs Lancashire??

Theres more rivalry between st helens and Wigan than Yorkshire vs some historical boundary County no one this side of the pennines under the age of 60 cares about.

[Sports Prophet]

4 hours ago, yipyee said:

Graham wouldn't qualify for Yorkshire or Lancashire though, might as well ask Konrad Hurrell to play as he's lived in Yorkshire.

Does Williams come from Yorkshire? Thought he was from GM ?

Isn’t Graham an out and out Lancastrian?

GM is Lancashire too.

You aren’t playing the “these places aren’t even in Lancashire any more” card are you?