England vs Samoa Series

[Mojo]

This is the only way I see Samoa wanting to to tour England. They need to play Tonga next year. If they have a one off test before touring, Samoa will be happy. It's the one match they need to play every year

Edited November 28, 2023 by Mojo

[Jparrish]

A mid season game away in France and a series against Samoa would be a pretty decent year I'd say hopefully something comes of this.

 

As for bookingstadiums, London,  Elland Road or Etihad, and Newcastle would be my preferences but how feasible is it to book football stadiums during the season at less than 12 months notice ? 

[Jack GB]

8 minutes ago, Mojo said:

This is the only way I see Samoa wanting to to tour England. They need to play Tonga next year. If they have a one off test before touring Samoa will be happy. It's the one match they need to play every year

 

I think this could be a best of both worlds scenario. I would also like to see England play france as long as it doesn't compromise Frances chances in their own tournament (if that happens)

[BristolDevonCharlie]

17 hours ago, JonM said:

I wonder whether there's an argument for a one-off England v Samoa game rather than a 3 match series. It clearly reduces costs and potentially allows Samoa to still take part in the series with Australia, NZ etc. If we're going to get an aggregate of below 40K for 3 games anyway, then a one-off at say Bolton or Elland Road might be more profitable.

Flying Samoa over for one Test makes less financial sense than three Tests. Plus you are putting all your eggs in one basket based on that one game's attendance. 

[nadera78]

If anything describes the, perhaps irreversible, shift in power in RL it's the RFL being rejected by Samoa and then asking the NRL-run IRL to ask the Samoans to change their mind. Even the sternest critics of the RFL failed to see this coming.

Edited November 28, 2023 by nadera78

[JonM]

Just now, BristolDevonCharlie said:

Flying Samoa over for one Test makes less financial sense than three Tests. Plus you are putting all your eggs in one basket based on that one game's attendance. 

I'd expect 22x (return flights + 1 week in a hotel) + 1x (cost of renting stadia and putting on a game) probably comes to below 40% of 25x (return flights + 3 weeks in a hotel) + 3x (cost of renting stadia and putting on a game). The hotel and gameday costs will be higher than the cost of flights. Plus they could, you know, actually make an effort to sell one game.

Of course, I assume tv revenue would be less for one game rather than 3 and probably that's true for sponsorships etc.  but we don't seem to be setting the world on fire there either. 

I'd rather we had a 3 match series. But if the RFL are not able to organise that in a way that makes money, I'd rather a well promoted and staged world cup semi-final rematch than nothing at all.

[Gerrumonside ref]

I hope if we do play Samoa then, as others have said, we should try and scale it up as much as possible.

If the argument is that Magic needs a big stadium and is a worthwhile event because more people have a vested interest than finalists at a Challenge Cup final for example.

Then I’m sure we can apply the same logic to an England match that the majority of RL fans can get behind and engage with especially with a good calibre opponent like Samoa.

I’ll be disappointed if this is played at a club RL ground and we don’t think big.

Edited November 28, 2023 by Gerrumonside ref

[BristolDevonCharlie]

6 hours ago, nadera78 said:

If anything describes the, perhaps irreversible, shift in power in RL it's the RFL being rejected by Samoa and then asking the NRL-run IRL to ask the Samoans to change their mind. Even the sternest critics of the RFL failed to see this coming.

If the read the narrative from before the cancellation and then through to last week's meeting, it is actually the IRL who wanted Samoa to come, and who wanted England to have meaningful decent fixtures. It also keep the Pacific Championships in a nice neat format and doesn't impinge on European World Cup qualifying, which needs to take place next year.  

Both Brad Walter and Troy Grant were quoted as saying the IRL wanted Samoa to come. So actually, this latest move is less of the RFL asking and more of the IRL telling. 

[BristolDevonCharlie]

9 hours ago, Jack GB said:

 

I think this could be a best of both worlds scenario. I would also like to see England play france as long as it doesn't compromise Frances chances in their own tournament (if that happens)

Why would Europe (including France) not have a tournament? They need to qualify a team for the World Series in 2025, to have a shot at the World Cup 2026.

I think of all the things to happen next year, a European Cup type tournament is the most likely to occur. 

[Jack GB]

54 minutes ago, BristolDevonCharlie said:

Why would Europe (including France) not have a tournament? They need to qualify a team for the World Series in 2025, to have a shot at the World Cup 2026.

I think of all the things to happen next year, a European Cup type tournament is the most likely to occur. 

I'm hopeful it happens too - but i haven't seen any plans set in place or announcements... but i think as all things RL for these countries it will be a last minute thrown together affair - but as i say im hopeful we have a meaningful european tournament in Oct/Nov next year 

[BristolDevonCharlie]

51 minutes ago, Jack GB said:

I'm hopeful it happens too - but i haven't seen any plans set in place or announcements... but i think as all things RL for these countries it will be a last minute thrown together affair - but as i say im hopeful we have a meaningful european tournament in Oct/Nov next year 

Surely it will just copy the format they had for this year but binned when the World Cup in France got canned, because the funding disappeared.

Seeing as it is World Cup quals, and there are seven teams eligible (maybe eight in March), I see no reason why they wouldn't just copy this:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2023_Rugby_League_European_Championships

However, you say last minute... They can't really finalise the teams until the 31st March 2024 deadline they have set for RLWC 2026 eligibility (full-member status). So it will seem last minute, even if they have planned to do it now. 31st March will still leave six-months until the October / November window.  

https://www.intrl.sport/news/irl-board-update-details-confirmed-for-world-series-world-cups/

[Mathius Hellwege]

22 hours ago, BristolDevonCharlie said:

Surely it will just copy the format they had for this year but binned when the World Cup in France got canned, because the funding disappeared.

Seeing as it is World Cup quals, and there are seven teams eligible (maybe eight in March), I see no reason why they wouldn't just copy this:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2023_Rugby_League_European_Championships

However, you say last minute... They can't really finalise the teams until the 31st March 2024 deadline they have set for RLWC 2026 eligibility (full-member status). So it will seem last minute, even if they have planned to do it now. 31st March will still leave six-months until the October / November window.  

https://www.intrl.sport/news/irl-board-update-details-confirmed-for-world-series-world-cups/

you could thake the eight teams irrelevant of full membership announve the dates

Only teams that have full time membership by then can qualify

[Hopie]

Any news/rumours about dates for England v Samoa this year? i'd like to book the days off work...

[JonM]

1 hour ago, Hopie said:

Any news/rumours about dates for England v Samoa this year? i'd like to book the days off work...

Lol. Come back in August. 

[Lowdesert]

2 hours ago, Hopie said:

Any news/rumours about dates for England v Samoa this year? i'd like to book the days off work...

Strangely, I just read this.  Unsure if it’s actually on the RFL site!

https://www.wigantoday.net/sport/rugby-league/rl-commercial-boss-provides-latest-on-englands-2024-international-calendar-including-mid-season-test-and-end-of-year-series-4479263

[Archie Gordon]

45 minutes ago, Lowdesert said:

Strangely, I just read this.  Unsure if it’s actually on the RFL site!

https://www.wigantoday.net/sport/rugby-league/rl-commercial-boss-provides-latest-on-englands-2024-international-calendar-including-mid-season-test-and-end-of-year-series-4479263

It sounds as if poor old Rhodri Jones knows less than I do.

[Mathius Hellwege]

15 hours ago, Archie Gordon said:

It sounds as if poor old Rhodri Jones knows less than I do.

France he knows a lot

Samoa they were not able to talk before Christmas, unbelievable....

now they have to oray and beg

But the NRL seems very helpful for Samoa to go and give them before departure an extra home game against Tonga

[Dave T]

16 hours ago, Archie Gordon said:

It sounds as if poor old Rhodri Jones knows less than I do.

Jones really doesn't portray any level of control. He gives no confidence really in anything he is saying, same point on the TV deal one.

He says they expected a call with stakeholders before Christmas, but it got delayed. Why? Christmas wasn't a surprise that was sprung on us.

He says he is expecting a call with them in the next fortnight. Is he just sitting and waiting for his phone to ring?

He knows the IRL and NRL have spoken to them, but he hasn't?

On the France game, he says he "thinks it will be in Toulouse".

The guy doesn't speak like a leader.

[welshmagpie]

12 minutes ago, Dave T said:

Jones really doesn't portray any level of control. He gives no confidence really in anything he is saying, same point on the TV deal one.

He says they expected a call with stakeholders before Christmas, but it got delayed. Why? Christmas wasn't a surprise that was sprung on us.

He says he is expecting a call with them in the next fortnight. Is he just sitting and waiting for his phone to ring?

He knows the IRL and NRL have spoken to them, but he hasn't?

On the France game, he says he "thinks it will be in Toulouse".

The guy doesn't speak like a leader.

Nailed it. Nothing about him screams “I’ve got a plan, I’m delivering it.”

[JonM]

19 hours ago, Lowdesert said:

Strangely, I just read this.  Unsure if it’s actually on the RFL site!

https://www.wigantoday.net/sport/rugby-league/rl-commercial-boss-provides-latest-on-englands-2024-international-calendar-including-mid-season-test-and-end-of-year-series-4479263

I don't know. It does seem plausible that England's international calendar for the year would be announced in an exclusive interview with Wigan Today. That's how other sports operate, after all.

[DoubleD]

3 hours ago, Dave T said:

Jones really doesn't portray any level of control. He gives no confidence really in anything he is saying, same point on the TV deal one.

He says they expected a call with stakeholders before Christmas, but it got delayed. Why? Christmas wasn't a surprise that was sprung on us.

He says he is expecting a call with them in the next fortnight. Is he just sitting and waiting for his phone to ring?

He knows the IRL and NRL have spoken to them, but he hasn't?

On the France game, he says he "thinks it will be in Toulouse".

The guy doesn't speak like a leader.

 

3 hours ago, welshmagpie said:

Nailed it. Nothing about him screams “I’ve got a plan, I’m delivering it.”

Nothing I've heard from Jones has left me with a positive impression of him. In fact, as much as I don't wish to be derogatry about someone I don't know, his comments often come across as him being clueless. This being the latest one - the fact he's blown away by a WCC getting over 20k fans is mind boggling. These are premier events and should sell out. I really have no more confidence with him at the helm, as I did with Rimmer or even Wood

https://www.loverugbyleague.com/post/wigan-warriors-rl-commercial-chief-blown-away-by-world-club-challenge-ticket-sales-hints-at-taking-spectacle-overseas-in-2025

[Dave T]

51 minutes ago, DoubleD said:

 

Nothing I've heard from Jones has left me with a positive impression of him. In fact, as much as I don't wish to be derogatry about someone I don't know, his comments often come across as him being clueless. This being the latest one - the fact he's blown away by a WCC getting over 20k fans is mind boggling. These are premier events and should sell out. I really have no more confidence with him at the helm, as I did with Rimmer or even Wood

https://www.loverugbyleague.com/post/wigan-warriors-rl-commercial-chief-blown-away-by-world-club-challenge-ticket-sales-hints-at-taking-spectacle-overseas-in-2025

The bit j didn't like about the WCC comments is that it was all a bit small time. Pretty much saying it's up to the clubs to organise it, promote it and sell it, it doesn't really present RLCom in a professional light. 

Everything I've read recently is really wishy-washy from him. 

[DoubleD]

14 minutes ago, Dave T said:

The bit j didn't like about the WCC comments is that it was all a bit small time. Pretty much saying it's up to the clubs to organise it, promote it and sell it, it doesn't really present RLCom in a professional light. 

Everything I've read recently is really wishy-washy from him. 

By being blown away by it, it also reveals that he doesn’t understand his market. For a Commercial Director, who has been with the organisation for a number of years, not to know the market is astonishing and should send alarm bells ringing. But then the Tonga series demonstrated that

Edited January 16 by DoubleD

[gingerjon]

35 minutes ago, Dave T said:

The bit j didn't like about the WCC comments is that it was all a bit small time. Pretty much saying it's up to the clubs to organise it, promote it and sell it, it doesn't really present RLCom in a professional light. 

Everything I've read recently is really wishy-washy from him. 

I'm not defending him because I think you're right but sometimes bad comms and perceptions are unavoidable because everything you're trying to communicate really is a poopshow.

And I think that's the case with a lot of the things he's the figurehead for. I also don't think that's all going to be his fault because we see this time and again with the organisation.

[Dave T]

1 hour ago, gingerjon said:

I'm not defending him because I think you're right but sometimes bad comms and perceptions are unavoidable because everything you're trying to communicate really is a poopshow.

And I think that's the case with a lot of the things he's the figurehead for. I also don't think that's all going to be his fault because we see this time and again with the organisation.

Knowing what to say should be a basic skill for him though. Even the positive stories are a bit naff from him.