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Sir Kevin Sinfield

World Rankings

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Rankings in most sports are pretty meaningless, R L particularly so, after the top five or six. PNG 10th...really?

Edited by HawkMan
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13 minutes ago, Dave W said:

Why would England fall in the rankings because of the ineptness of Great Britain?

I was under the impression that the GB results count as England.


My blog: https://rugbyl.blogspot.co.nz/

It takes wisdom to know when a discussion has run its course.

It takes reasonableness to end that discussion. 

 

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13 minutes ago, Dave W said:

Why would England fall in the rankings because of the ineptness of Great Britain?

Because England have not played any games this year due to GB getting games, So no opportunity for England to hold or gain rankings.

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Just now, RayCee said:

I was under the impression that the GB results count as England.

So how does that work then? Would Wales and Scotland's rankings also suffer as a consequence? Maybe on a notional pro-rata basis? 

I'm being flippant but the point remains. 

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2 minutes ago, kiwis 13 6 said:

Because England have not played any games this year due to GB getting games, So no opportunity for England to hold or gain rankings.

Great Britain need to appear in the ranking table, prefereably at the bottom. 

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16 minutes ago, Dave W said:

So how does that work then? Would Wales and Scotland's rankings also suffer as a consequence? Maybe on a notional pro-rata basis? 

I'm being flippant but the point remains. 

Yes, there have been rumours in media circles that ranking points for GB will be awarded on a proportional basis, based on nationality. If that is the case, you couldn't make it up. Some players have never played for England (and still technically qualify for Australia). One player, Philbin, is an Irish international - who don't appear to be part of GB anymore. 

Edited by Scubby
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NZ should take the 2nd spot.

Their last 5 tests have seen them beat England, Tonga, GB and GB with a loss versus the Kangaroos, the ranked 1 team.

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2 minutes ago, Scubby said:

Yes, there have been rumours in media circles that ranking points for GB will be awarded on a proportional basis, based on nationality. If that is the case, you couldn't make it up. Some players have never played for England (and still technically qualify for Australia). One player, Philbin, is an Irish international - who don't appear to be part of GB anymore. 

Just adds to the farce and obfuscation. As someone rightly pointed out, at the end of the day rankings are meaningless but the criteria for the rankings should be transparent. 

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There's a change in the rankings system I've mentioned before. Teams used to get points based on result and quality of opposition and it was a straight points tally. Now it's a % with the #1 team ranked at 100% and everyone else assessed, presumably as a percentage of the #1 team's points. I have no idea why. One result of this might be that, since Oz lost to Tonga, other teams may not move much, since the 100% is now "worth less," if you catch my drift.

As for PNG, they wouldn't move far because they also lost to Fiji.

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Also, under the old system, all the calculations were done at the end of each month so we won't know the answer until then. (If they still do that.)

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1 minute ago, Farmduck said:

There's a change in the rankings system I've mentioned before. Teams used to get points based on result and quality of opposition and it was a straight points tally. Now it's a % with the #1 team ranked at 100% and everyone else assessed, presumably as a percentage of the #1 team's points. I have no idea why. One result of this might be that, since Oz lost to Tonga, other teams may not move much, since the 100% is now "worth less," if you catch my drift.

As for PNG, they wouldn't move far because they also lost to Fiji.

Why can't it just be a straight forward algorithm that if 7th beat 2nd you give them X points?

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4 minutes ago, Dave T said:

NZ should take the 2nd spot.

Their last 5 tests have seen them beat England, Tonga, GB and GB with a loss versus the Kangaroos, the ranked 1 team.

Alternatively you could say New Zealand have lost to Australia in 2017 and 2019, lost to Tonga in 2017, lost to Fiji in 2017 and lost to England 3 times in 2018. I believe the rankings take into account results from the last 3 years. 

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Just now, Scubby said:

Why can't it just be a straight forward algorithm that if 7th beat 2nd you give them X points?

There are extra points for away wins or big margins or games in WCs. (Well, there were.) Here's how it stands now:

750758418_IRLWorldRankings.thumb.png.ae1b04d5fbdcf69e7cc7888fe7e574b2.png

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1 minute ago, Sir Kevin Sinfield said:

Alternatively you could say New Zealand have lost to Australia in 2017 and 2019, lost to Tonga in 2017, lost to Fiji in 2017 and lost to England 3 times in 2018. I believe the rankings take into account results from the last 3 years. 

It used to be 5 years with declining weight each year. Purely hypothetically, if you got 10pts for a win today, in a year that would be worth 8, then 6, etc.

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If it was done like a tennis/squash ladder ie beat someone and you go a place above them with everyone else shunting down one by my reckoning it would now be

Tonga

Australia

NZ

PNG

England / GB 

 

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13 minutes ago, headtackle said:

If it was done like a tennis/squash ladder ie beat someone and you go a place above them with everyone else shunting down one by my reckoning it would now be

Tonga

Australia

NZ

PNG

England / GB 

 

It's obvious at present. Big three Aussies, nz and england then Tonga and Fiji and png not far behind. Samoa has some work to do as does france and rest of home nations. 

Edited by winnyason

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1 hour ago, Sir Kevin Sinfield said:

Alternatively you could say New Zealand have lost to Australia in 2017 and 2019, lost to Tonga in 2017, lost to Fiji in 2017 and lost to England 3 times in 2018. I believe the rankings take into account results from the last 3 years. 

But they were in 3rd this time last year after those bad results. They have improved the results out of sight whilst England havent played.

It should be a no-brainer.

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1 hour ago, Farmduck said:

There are extra points for away wins or big margins or games in WCs. (Well, there were.) Here's how it stands now:

750758418_IRLWorldRankings.thumb.png.ae1b04d5fbdcf69e7cc7888fe7e574b2.png

No idea how they work this out but I imagine NZ beating GB twice will close the 2% gap on England, so they could rise to second. 

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1 hour ago, Dave W said:

So how does that work then? Would Wales and Scotland's rankings also suffer as a consequence? Maybe on a notional pro-rata basis? 

I'm being flippant but the point remains. 

Because .... because..... rugby league!

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20 minutes ago, Dave T said:

But they were in 3rd this time last year after those bad results. They have improved the results out of sight whilst England havent played.

It should be a no-brainer.

Perhaps Nigel is introducing ranking points for winning the second half now? 😄 That was one of his ideas for SL!

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31 minutes ago, winnyason said:

It's obvious at present. Big three Aussies, nz and england then Tonga and Fiji and png not far behind. Samoa has some work to do as does france and rest of home nations. 

Obvious? I’d say Tonga are now firmly above England having beaten Australia and GB/England/Great England.

I’d rank the top seven right now as Australia, Tonga, New Zealand, England, Fiji, Samoa, PNG. 

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