Scotland RL

[hw88]

The only way you will get RL off the ground in Scotland is if the Borders clubs like Hawick, Kelso, et al can be persuaded to set up a RL team in the summer months. Then you would have a ready made pool of players, ready made facilities and a viable league structure. A successful team would get 500 or so spectators, a losing one rather less - remember these places aren't very big. Would the SRU allow it? Would they do it? Who knows - it depends on how much of a financial return they would get from the venture I suppose.

One thing is for certain - getting 20 or so players whose only connection with Scotland is that their 3x great-grandmothers' dog was once in kennels in Largs isn't cutting it.

[MatthewWoody]

39 minutes ago, hw88 said:

The only way you will get RL off the ground in Scotland is if the Borders clubs like Hawick, Kelso, et al can be persuaded to set up a RL team in the summer months. Then you would have a ready made pool of players, ready made facilities and a viable league structure. A successful team would get 500 or so spectators, a losing one rather less - remember these places aren't very big. Would the SRU allow it? Would they do it? Who knows - it depends on how much of a financial return they would get from the venture I suppose.

One thing is for certain - getting 20 or so players whose only connection with Scotland is that their 3x great-grandmothers' dog was once in kennels in Largs isn't cutting it.

Very very respectful. 

[EggFace]

3 hours ago, hw88 said:

The only way you will get RL off the ground in Scotland is if the Borders clubs like Hawick, Kelso, et al can be persuaded to set up a RL team in the summer months. Then you would have a ready made pool of players, ready made facilities and a viable league structure. A successful team would get 500 or so spectators, a losing one rather less - remember these places aren't very big. Would the SRU allow it? Would they do it? Who knows - it depends on how much of a financial return they would get from the venture I suppose.

One thing is for certain - getting 20 or so players whose only connection with Scotland is that their 3x great-grandmothers' dog was once in kennels in Largs isn't cutting it.

I'm sure Hawick, Melrose and a few others of the Borders clubs would see the financial benefits and opportunity's of promotion if they just switched over to Rugby League inside of playing in a Limbo League and goes for most Welsh Premier clubs cut off from the URC but then it should of happened back in 1895.

[hw88]

2 hours ago, MatthewWoody said:

Very very respectful. 

I sense you think I am being disrespectful. Not at all, on the contrary I applaud the efforts of the people trying to make RL work in Scotland. My suggestion was just a possible solution to that. What we have now, and indeed ever have had, are a few teams that last a couple of seasons then fold despite the best efforts of the people involved. I suspect they fold for many reasons - not enough fixtures, too far to travel, difficulty in recruiting/holding players, lack of a proper club house, etc. All of this means there can be little or no organic growth from the roots up.

I also think my scenario could work in Wales too. In fact it would work better there because rugby in general is more ingrained in the culture and the Welsh 'regions' have alienated a lot of people who follow their local team like Neath, Aberavon or Bridgend.

[SuperNoob]

I actually support SRL trying to persuade few Union clubs to play league in the off season. Helps develop more players for both codes. But RFL should assist not just Scotland but Wales & Ireland as well financially to at least get a Semi-Pro competition going as an amateur competition won't be good enough to develop players in the long run 

[Eddie]

22 minutes ago, SuperNoob said:

I actually support SRL trying to persuade few Union clubs to play league in the off season. Helps develop more players for both codes. But RFL should assist not just Scotland but Wales & Ireland as well financially to at least get a Semi-Pro competition going as an amateur competition won't be good enough to develop players in the long run 

The RFL have barely got enough money to do that in the heartlands, let alone other countries. 

[2blackrooks]

Strathmore RU have and hopefully in the coming season will re start their RL outfit and many RU players join the RL teams as conditioning. What we need to build is a group of players who focus solely on RL

As for borders teams looking at RL is a great idea, either within Scotland or joining the NE league as Edinburgh do or a Cumbrian set up

Meanwhile Scotland RL U16/U18 program for the coming year 

Open trial/training days - 20th Nov, Dec -Jan tbc, 26th Feb Bradford Bulls Academy, 26th March, 23rd April, 28th May, 16th July

Matches - 18th June vs England Community lions, 13th Aug tbc, Sept tbc

Scotland Students - trial/training days - 20th Nov, Dec - Jan tbc, 30th Apr, 28th May

Training camps + match - 19th Feb vs Police (in Rochdale), 26th March home opponent tbc, 10th - 17th June student 4 nations in Wales

[Hopping Mad]

19 hours ago, 2blackrooks said:

Strathmore RU have and hopefully in the coming season will re start their RL outfit and many RU players join the RL teams as conditioning. What we need to build is a group of players who focus solely on RL

As for borders teams looking at RL is a great idea, either within Scotland or joining the NE league as Edinburgh do or a Cumbrian set up

Meanwhile Scotland RL U16/U18 program for the coming year 

Open trial/training days - 20th Nov, Dec -Jan tbc, 26th Feb Bradford Bulls Academy, 26th March, 23rd April, 28th May, 16th July

Matches - 18th June vs England Community lions, 13th Aug tbc, Sept tbc

Scotland Students - trial/training days - 20th Nov, Dec - Jan tbc, 30th Apr, 28th May

Training camps + match - 19th Feb vs Police (in Rochdale), 26th March home opponent tbc, 10th - 17th June student 4 nations in Wales

Maybe five years ago, I was up in Galashiels. Went down to Netherdale to have a nosy at the rugby union and football grounds. The guy who let me in the RU ground turned out to be one of Gala's first XV coaches. He told me he LOVED rugby league. Be nice to think there was scope for setting up some rugby league in places like Galashiels and Hawick.

However, anyone who has watched Borders rugby union will know crowds are small - reflecting the size of the communities and, to an extent, the highly parochial nature of the sport up there. Stayed in a Peebles holiday cottage a few summers ago. Went to watch a season-opening, top-flight game at Mansfield Park between Hawick and Melrose. During the breaks in play, I did a rough headcount of spectators. It was about 350.

During the same holiday, I went to the RU at Jed-Forest (Jedburgh). Got talking to a woman who turned out to be the mum of a couple of the visiting Peebles players. She said they'd played rugby league at university and, IIRC, had represented Scottish Universities. They really enjoyed league, she told me.

[Midlands hobo]

Gretna is a great option. Easy travel links and test the south coast. Give the locals some English bashing and they'll love it. Galashiels is nice as is Kelso but they're miles from anywhere.

[Number 16]

Gretna and Annan are villages, with neither being large enough to sustain a RL club. 

Union 7s is still big in the Borders, and it's this that RL could build on, via our 9s.

Why couldn't the RFL, with willing union clubs, organise four 9s competitions over the course of the summer. One each in (for example only!) Hawick, Gala, Jedforest and Melrose, and four invited Sassenach teams to each. Start simple in 2023 and 2024, and try and expand in the next WC year. 

Costs would be negligible. Benefits could be huge.

 

[2blackrooks]

5 hours ago, Number 16 said:

Gretna and Annan are villages, with neither being large enough to sustain a RL club. 

Union 7s is still big in the Borders, and it's this that RL could build on, via our 9s.

Why couldn't the RFL, with willing union clubs, organise four 9s competitions over the course of the summer. One each in (for example only!) Hawick, Gala, Jedforest and Melrose, and four invited Sassenach teams to each. Start simple in 2023 and 2024, and try and expand in the next WC year. 

Costs would be negligible. Benefits could be huge.

 

Or the SRL with the RFL’s help, in the current climate I’m sure RU clubs would embrace the potential cash injection this could offer plus off season conditioning for some of their Union players, The SRU certainly don’t care about anything outside the super 6 series or Glasgow/Edinburgh pro teams 

[EggFace]

Edinburgh is king with International Rugby but the Borders are like Cumbria and seeing Melrose packed a few years back when the USA had Carlin Isle was great but these Borders teams shouldn't not be ignored.

[EggFace]

26 minutes ago, 2blackrooks said:

Or the SRL with the RFL’s help, in the current climate I’m sure RU clubs would embrace the potential cash injection this could offer plus off season conditioning for some of their Union players, The SRU certainly don’t care about anything outside the super 6 series or Glasgow/Edinburgh pro teams 

The SRU are like English Rugby Union but so much smaller and in pathetic.

Super 6 crowds are like my local club Percy Park

[Damien]

I can't help but think that this sums up everything that is wrong with developing the game in countries like Scotland. If u16s is being padded out by heritage players then there is little point:

 

[Phil W]

33 minutes ago, Damien said:

I can't help but think that this sums up everything that is wrong with developing the game in countries like Scotland. If u16s is being padded out by heritage players then there is little point:

 

Tend to agree to be honest. I know Edinburgh are doing some good work at community level. But it would be good to see what is being done in Scotland itself to grow the game.

[Eddie]

1 hour ago, City RL said:

Would like to see the Scottish League & all other regional development  league sitting under (and hopefully feeding into when Players & Facilities ready) League One. In the current climate of no money, a demerger of Carlisle from Barrow to play in the Scottish League might be the best we can hope for.

What league are Carlisle in now?

[Eddie]

6 minutes ago, City RL said:

None. Merged with Barrow in 1997.

Are you saying that Barrow Raiders should split up and a Carlisle team should be formed from them to play in the Scottish League? 

[welshmagpie]

On 09/11/2022 at 19:55, 2blackrooks said:

Strathmore RU have and hopefully in the coming season will re start their RL outfit and many RU players join the RL teams as conditioning. What we need to build is a group of players who focus solely on RL

As for borders teams looking at RL is a great idea, either within Scotland or joining the NE league as Edinburgh do or a Cumbrian set up

Meanwhile Scotland RL U16/U18 program for the coming year 

Open trial/training days - 20th Nov, Dec -Jan tbc, 26th Feb Bradford Bulls Academy, 26th March, 23rd April, 28th May, 16th July

Matches - 18th June vs England Community lions, 13th Aug tbc, Sept tbc

Scotland Students - trial/training days - 20th Nov, Dec - Jan tbc, 30th Apr, 28th May

Training camps + match - 19th Feb vs Police (in Rochdale), 26th March home opponent tbc, 10th - 17th June student 4 nations in Wales

Good to see. In general, I think too much emphasis is placed on getting clubs up and running for adults who have a low-capacity for growth and development when finance isn’t so readily available.

Scotland would be best served setting up or targeting 3 U14/U16 clubs in neighbouring population areas such as Glasgow, Kilmarnock and Ayr. This can then be grown over the years and/or replicated elsewhere such as Edinburgh, Dunfermline, Falkirk.

The reality is, is that these sides can only operate through the summer before other sports like football or RU take over and dominate weekends for teenagers.

To fill the void, Scottish RL should replicate Wales’ efforts in offering regional academy sessions such as ‘West of Scotland’ twice a month to further develop skills and opportunities. The more RL-specific practise kids are tasked with, the better RL players they become but equally they aren’t lost to the game due to lack of opportunity. 

 

Edited January 2 by welshmagpie

[Number 16]

7 hours ago, City RL said:

Would like to see the Scottish League & all other regional development  league sitting under (and hopefully feeding into when Players & Facilities ready) League One. In the current climate of no money, a demerger of Carlisle from Barrow to play in the Scottish League might be the best we can hope for.

Can you confirm you posted this in 2023.

[Niels]

7 hours ago, Phil W said:

Tend to agree to be honest. I know Edinburgh are doing some good work at community level. But it would be good to see what is being done in Scotland itself to grow the game.

I think there will be some under 16s in England who are half English and Scottish who can attend the Bradford trials. 

They are entitled to play for either so I think it's a good idea to try to attract them for Scotland. 

 

 

[Eddie]

8 minutes ago, Niels said:

I think there will be some under 16s in England who are half English and Scottish who can attend the Bradford trials. 

They are entitled to play for either so I think it's a good idea to try to attract them for Scotland. 

 

 

To what purpose? I’m not trying to be cantankerous, I’ve got a lot of time for your posts @Niels, but what would some 15 year old lads from Bradford or Halifax playing for Scotland do for the game?  

[Niels]

4 minutes ago, Eddie said:

To what purpose? I’m not trying to be cantankerous, I’ve got a lot of time for your posts @Niels, but what would some 15 year old lads from Bradford or Halifax playing for Scotland do for the game?  

Thank you Eddie, I appreciate your kind words. I enjoy reading your posts too.

I think you raise a good question. I am not sure to be honest. The only thing I can think of is that it would benefit boys who are half Scottish and really wanted to play for Scotland? If they could find a few they would be able develop them together?

But if they became too good then presumably they could opt for England or Great Britain instead? 

 

 

[dealwithit]

I see little point in having ‘clubs’ in a nation like Scotland that has had a hard time breaking into the established “institutions”.

I’d much rather a call to action for a weekend round robin format in Edinburgh that attracts 30 lads that want to play socially. Divide in half and have a game. Make it fun and a way to make friends. Use it as a way to scout players for the Eagles that play in the North East English competition. 

Having standalone ‘clubs’ just spreads the volunteers to thin and is further from what adults are looking for: something to keep fit, have fun and make friends. 

[welshmagpie]

44 minutes ago, Eddie said:

To what purpose? I’m not trying to be cantankerous, I’ve got a lot of time for your posts @Niels, but what would some 15 year old lads from Bradford or Halifax playing for Scotland do for the game?  

There’s a 15 year old from Dundee who has the makings of a good half back but needs to learn the game more after only ever playing two games and a dozen training sessions. 
 

There’s a 15 year old from Halifax who is half-Scottish who has played since he was 6, over 100 games and 200 sessions to his name. 
 

One wears 6, the other wears 7. 7 teaches 6 things that 6 could never learn alone. 

[Damien]

1 hour ago, welshmagpie said:

There’s a 15 year old from Dundee who has the makings of a good half back but needs to learn the game more after only ever playing two games and a dozen training sessions. 
 

There’s a 15 year old from Halifax who is half-Scottish who has played since he was 6, over 100 games and 200 sessions to his name. 
 

One wears 6, the other wears 7. 7 teaches 6 things that 6 could never learn alone. 

Or 6 simply doesn't get picked.