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Fielden Vs McDermott


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6 hours ago, M j M said:

I think Brian can hold a vendetta against most people to be fair.

Prop stories.

Peter Sterling said all good props should hold grudges against other props. He spoke of how he bumped into Bob O`Reilly a couple of years back and how he was still nursing grudges from 40 years ago. Now that`s a grudge.

Former Australian Coach and Kangaroo Chris Anderson said every first grade squad should contain 4 props, with at least 1 suspended at any one time, if not they weren`t doing their job.

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14 hours ago, Harry Stottle said:

Yeah, but wasn't that expectation of what is he going to do next really entertaining, there are guys who are infamous for the way they went about the way they played the game, love them or loathe them they were a big part of the game, and yes I miss their like in today's game, the McDermotts, Tamati's, Boyd's, Hogan's, etc.

There was nothing entertaining about his numerous use use of the elbow,the one on Sironen was just a cowardly act that should have resulted in a very long ban.

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10 hours ago, Johnoco said:

Burgess was much better than Graham. Which is not to suggest he’s not a great player too but Sam Burgess was always a special talent. It was obvious from his early days at Bradford. 

I disagree, I think Graham had more to his game than Burgess, I still think Grahams ability to pass at the tackle is the best IVe ever seen for a forward.

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5 minutes ago, dkw said:

I disagree, I think Graham had more to his game than Burgess, I still think Grahams ability to pass at the tackle is the best IVe ever seen for a forward.

I definitely aren't saying Graham wasn't a fantastic player and I agree about your offload comment, he was great at getting impossible passes away. 

But I think Burgess had more of the 'X Factor' in his overall game. I remember seeing him kick a touchline conversion at Odsal when he had only just broken into the first team. It's hard to say what it is but you sometimes see players and you know they are just a cut above. 

But of course, these things are subject to things like hating St Helens 😁

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18 minutes ago, Johnoco said:

I definitely aren't saying Graham wasn't a fantastic player and I agree about your offload comment, he was great at getting impossible passes away. 

But I think Burgess had more of the 'X Factor' in his overall game. I remember seeing him kick a touchline conversion at Odsal when he had only just broken into the first team. It's hard to say what it is but you sometimes see players and you know they are just a cut above. 

But of course, these things are subject to things like hating St Helens 😁

Yeah, I agree with all that, Burgess was something else, his impact on the game was immense. I just think as a player Graham had more to his game. Realistically there was so little between them, as seen in the Grand final where both were immense. 

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14 hours ago, JM2010 said:

What about Burgess or Graham? Who would you have?

Big Sam . At his peak he was as good as it gets , athletic , versatile , granite tough , good skill set ( barring err the odd handling error )  and just a fantastic leader by example in a team . Souths ( and opposition players)  view of him in that team says it all 

Edited by DavidM
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I always thought that in the WC semi in '13 Sam's performance was as good as any individual I have seen for a one off game in a GB/England shirt, and in the same game James was not that far behind him.

But in answer to @dkw that James is the best passer of the ball at the tackle for a forward he has ever seen is a big call, this is what is good about sport the differing opinions, there are a lot in my time watching the sport who I would say are the equal of James and quite a few who would surpass him, taking nothing away from James he was up there for me in that skill set.

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It's a shame that the forward v forward situation isn't being played out much nowadays.

Bradford Northern were a good team but could be bullied. Then we signed Jimmy Thompson, Ian van Bellen and Jeff Grayshon. Problem solved.

I can't remember Jimmy Thompson ever starting off any rough play ... but he always remembered; especially remembering Mike Nicholas.

In the age of semi-pro players, he and Jeff Grayshon had really honed physiques.

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2 hours ago, FearTheVee said:

Even as a Saints fan I'd say Burgess was a class above Graham.  A special player.

Yeap Sam had the ability to change a game with or without the ball & Graham although a great player/leader just lacked the physical presence of Burgess.

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Fielden was a very good player but he needed to play off the back of other very good players to be his best. The momentum created by Anderson, Vangana, Peacock, Mackay, etc was great for a player like Fielden who could time his runs so that he took the ball in full stride after a quick PTB following Vangana scattering the defence. He played a similar role in the GB side, again with other great players around him. 

He didn’t have those players around him at Wigan where ‘he’ was expected to be the front runner who created forward momentum and as a result he didn’t have the same impact.

He should never have been on the tour with GB when Mason cheap shotted him, his mother had just died (the day they flew out) and I don’t think Rugby League 12,500 miles away was the Nō1 thing on his mind. The Mason incident just sickened him off I think and he never loved it the same after that.

McDermott played his game wherever he went and it wouldn’t have mattered whether it was for Oldham, Wigan, Leeds, Great Britain or Saddleworth Rangers, he would have still been the same.

There’s some value in that, he was never intimidated and saw other props as a challenge to his reputation as the apex predator on the field. He had good leg speed for a prop and a pretty good step just ahead of the collision which often saw him make busts or win a quick play the ball.

Id take Barry over Fielden as he didn’t rely on others to make his impact

 

Edited by OMEGA
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3 hours ago, Wolford6 said:

Kelvin Skerret v Harvey Howard would be a good contrast.

Kevin Ward v Anyone? Only one winner.

Kevin Ward v Andy Platt which would you pick for GB

Ward was great going forward and had a decent ‘around the man’ offload 

Platt had more pace, got involved more and was a brick wall in defence!

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Just now, OMEGA said:

Kevin Ward v Andy Platt which would you pick for GB

Ward was great going forward and had a decent ‘around the man’ offload 

Platt had more pace, got involved more and was a brick wall in defence!

Kevin ward was a brick wall in defence and attack. Broke his leg then stamped on it to see if it was just a sprain.

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2 minutes ago, Wolford6 said:

Kevin ward was a brick wall in defence and attack. Broke his leg then stamped on it to see if it was just a sprain.

He wasn’t a noted defender like Platt was, a hard man for sure but Platt was cast iron and had superb defensive technique & timing. 

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6 minutes ago, OMEGA said:

He wasn’t a noted defender like Platt was ...

Well, it was a long way around Kevin. And you only had to look at him to see that he was huge, hard and knew his job.

 

We'll have to agree to differ on this. Not that I would any way wish to deny the abilities of Andy Platt.

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5 hours ago, Wolford6 said:

Kelvin Skerret v Harvey Howard would be a good contrast.

Kevin Ward v Anyone? Only one winner.

 

1 hour ago, Wolford6 said:

Kevin ward was a brick wall in defence and attack. Broke his leg then stamped on it to see if it was just a sprain.

Kevin Ward, IMHO, is the best prop I've seen in a Cas shirt. 

When he left to go to Saints I was gutted.

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Wibble

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2 hours ago, Wolford6 said:

Well, it was a long way around Kevin. And you only had to look at him to see that he was huge, hard and knew his job.

 

We'll have to agree to differ on this. Not that I would any way wish to deny the abilities of Andy Platt.

I played against both and I’d rather tackle Platt and run at Ward than the other wat around

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You can throw Adrian Morley into the mix, long career, top level in both hemispheres, opposition both respected and feared him. And could mix it with the best. 

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2 hours ago, ELBOWSEYE said:

You can throw Adrian Morley into the mix, long career, top level in both hemispheres, opposition both respected and feared him. And could mix it with the best. 

Yeah even as a Saints Fan I would go Morley, Burgess and then Graham. All greats and not as much between them as some are making out. Anyone who thinks that Graham was miles behind Burgess or that Burgess was in a different league to Graham is allowing bias to cloud their judgement. 
 

oh and Kevin Ward was just incredible IMHO. Only played for my side for a short time but what an impact. I always like Ward, Sampson and Crooks at Cas, terrific props.

Edited by Waynebennettswinger
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On 11/01/2022 at 09:43, Sir Kevin Sinfield said:

Completely agree, Burgess was in a different league to Graham imo.

As a Saints fan I’d be interested to know how you rate Alex Walmsley compared to James Graham?

Very different players and both incredibly important to us.

I'm tempted to say Alex Walmsley is the most effective prop I've seen play for Saints in my lifetime.

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