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Warrington Wolves - laughing stock


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14 minutes ago, Dallas Mead said:

My club are garbage, from top to bottom.  That’s all really.

Have you only just realised? Sorry i couldn't resist that. They certainly don't live up  to their expectations.

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23 minutes ago, Fevrover said:

Have you only just realised? Sorry i couldn't resist that. They certainly don't live up  to their expectations.

It’s been a slow burner really, last 2/3 years.  Been a season ticket holder since 1991 so I’ve seen some garbage 😂 but this is seriously bad.

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Just now, Dallas Mead said:

It’s been a slow burner really, last 2/3 years.  Been a season ticket holder since 1991 so I’ve seen some garbage 😂 but this is seriously bad.

What are your thoughts on Powell?

From the outside several commentators and fans have been saying that he must be close to being sacked, given the results.

That said, having listened to him and thinking in a broader context of Warrington Wolves over the past 5 or so years, do you think a bigger overhaul is needed and Powell as a fresh pair of eyes has seen that? 

Warrington strike me as a club that has become too comfortable, almost overnight, both on the pitch and off it; or at least that they have taken their eye off the ball to some extent. My own club has been and is going through something similar. A fresh set of eyes are often what triggers radical change.

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6 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

What are your thoughts on Powell?

From the outside several commentators and fans have been saying that he must be close to being sacked, given the results.

That said, having listened to him and thinking in a broader context of Warrington Wolves over the past 5 or so years, do you think a bigger overhaul is needed and Powell as a fresh pair of eyes has seen that? 

Warrington strike me as a club that has become too comfortable, almost overnight, both on the pitch and off it; or at least that they have taken their eye off the ball to some extent. My own club has been and is going through something similar. A fresh set of eyes are often what triggers radical change.

He needs another off season and then we’ll judge him this time next year, I think that makes sense.  The big problems stem from the clown of a CEO - recruitment has been an absolute shambles for 5 years now and he needs to go ASAP.  Greg Inglis?  Luther Burrell?  Jason Clark?  Latu? Just wow 😂

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1 minute ago, Tommygilf said:

What are your thoughts on Powell?

From the outside several commentators and fans have been saying that he must be close to being sacked, given the results.

That said, having listened to him and thinking in a broader context of Warrington Wolves over the past 5 or so years, do you think a bigger overhaul is needed and Powell as a fresh pair of eyes has seen that? 

Warrington strike me as a club that has become too comfortable, almost overnight, both on the pitch and off it; or at least that they have taken their eye off the ball to some extent. My own club has been and is going through something similar. A fresh set of eyes are often what triggers radical change.

Warrington is a funny one because they've not actually won SL to justify getting that comfortable like some of the other clubs you could level that at. I know over the last decade they've won a couple of Challenge Cups and lost Grand Finals but for me they've under achieved considering some of the teams they've had. I think they've had some outstanding teams and players but they always seem to be lacking something when it counts. The hunger should certainly be there.

I do think the comfortable thing that you allude to and which we have seen at some of the big clubs, mine included, is another symptom of the problems in SL and teams not being pushed.

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Even though I've mocked Warrington, especially yesterday, I do seem similarities with Huddersfield and Ian Watson.

Watson and Powell both took over teams who had flattered to deceive, although Warrington had enjoyed more relative success than Huddersfield.

But they're both faced with the task of rebuilding not just the playing squads but the entire culture of the club, Wigan and Saints seem to have a good culture and whoever comes into the coaching seats already have that culture in place.

Watson and Powell (indeed any new coaches) are also faced with having players who they may not fancy, players who don't or (in Watto's case) won't fit into their processes and ways of working.

RL fans in general and some Huddersfield fans were critical of Watson last year, critical of the results and some even suggested he was in trouble, now he's lauded as one of the best in the business because, he's been given time, patience and the backing to get his own players and his own methods in.

I suspect Warrington, under Powell could see the same bounce once he gets his own players in, I don't particularly like Powell as a coach but can't deny that he seems to get the best out of certain players, hence the reason he wants to bring in players that may appear a lesser quality of what Warrington fans may expect.

Again, Watson is the same, he seems to have got the best out of players like Lolohea, Yates, Jones, who are experienced but probably not hit the heights people expected of them, he also seems to be getting the very best out of Olly Russell, who despite being a good player, was in danger of getting a bit stale.

But while we've all had to enjoy the Warrington fans giving it the big licks, like Leeds, it's always amusing to see these big clubs' arrogant fans fail, they will come good again, just need the patience.

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   For the first 60 min there was nothing between the teams apart from a couple of silly penalties conceded by Wire.But no excuse for the way they fell apart in the final 20 min.Think they are missing a leader in the pack,judge Powell by the end of next season when he should have had time to sort them out.Of the two coaches mentioned above in my opinion Watson comes out slightly on top.

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Wire have got some great young players but also plenty of dead wood. Most of that dead wood was inherited by Powell . For instance all the hype in Williams , he was useless yesterday.  Think wire will just tread water this season and then have a massive rebuild for next year.

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21 minutes ago, Agbrigg said:

Wire have got some great young players but also plenty of dead wood. Most of that dead wood was inherited by Powell . For instance all the hype in Williams , he was useless yesterday.  Think wire will just tread water this season and then have a massive rebuild for next year.

No biggy though, he’s probably the highest paid player in the country too 🙄

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Whoever let hill go needs his bumps feeling,and the coaching staff should of had lee briers and benny westwood involved from the off,and why the hell they let game go and then bring in walker when its too late for the lad. you cant bring change by doing the same thing game after game.i remember when wire were a tough team to get to grips with.a while back..:kolobok_download:

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22 minutes ago, Agbrigg said:

Wire have got some great young players but also plenty of dead wood. Most of that dead wood was inherited by Powell . For instance all the hype in Williams , he was useless yesterday.  Think wire will just tread water this season and then have a massive rebuild for next year.

I have to say I'm really glad we didn't re-sign Williams. I dont believe in taking these players back, in most cases anyway, and I think he would have really stifled our attack this year. He runs himself, often down blind alleys, and relies on short kicks too often for my liking.

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I think sometimes it can be looked at a little more simply. I think there are two key reasons we are having a poor season. 

Firstly, our recruitment just hasn't worked this year. Losing a coupke of big forwards and not replacing them with the quality needed is costing us. Holmes is a bad signing and tbh identikit to Hughes and J Clark - very lacklustre really. The balance just isn't there. 

Secondly, we've had a bad run with injuries, probably the worst we have had as a club for quite a few years. You can sometimes handle these if your core is playing well, but when in a poor run of form and then you have different halves, fullback, three quarters each week it makes the recovery much more difficult. 

I think there is the added challenge that whilst our homegrown development is improving, it isn't good enough for us to rely on yet. 

I think the challenges are less about Powell, I don't see any reason to panic on that front yet. 

The next 6m recruitment is crucial, we have some real aging players and if we move them on like Hill, we need to properly replace them. 

For all the criticism the likes of Williams will get, he isn't anywhere near being the main problem. 

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8 minutes ago, Dave T said:

I think sometimes it can be looked at a little more simply. I think there are two key reasons we are having a poor season. 

Firstly, our recruitment just hasn't worked this year. Losing a coupke of big forwards and not replacing them with the quality needed is costing us. Holmes is a bad signing and tbh identikit to Hughes and J Clark - very lacklustre really. The balance just isn't there. 

Secondly, we've had a bad run with injuries, probably the worst we have had as a club for quite a few years. You can sometimes handle these if your core is playing well, but when in a poor run of form and then you have different halves, fullback, three quarters each week it makes the recovery much more difficult. 

I think there is the added challenge that whilst our homegrown development is improving, it isn't good enough for us to rely on yet. 

I think the challenges are less about Powell, I don't see any reason to panic on that front yet. 

The next 6m recruitment is crucial, we have some real aging players and if we move them on like Hill, we need to properly replace them. 

For all the criticism the likes of Williams will get, he isn't anywhere near being the main problem. 

My criticism is the fact he’s a marquee player, on apparently £350,000 a year, one of the highest paid players in the country (probably only behind Widdop!) and he just doesn’t “own” the result enough.  How many times for us has he bossed a game and really grabbed it by the scruff of the neck?  I’m struggling to think of ANY.

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8 minutes ago, Dallas Mead said:

My criticism is the fact he’s a marquee player, on apparently £350,000 a year, one of the highest paid players in the country (probably only behind Widdop!) and he just doesn’t “own” the result enough.  How many times for us has he bossed a game and really grabbed it by the scruff of the neck?  I’m struggling to think of ANY.

Williams has had a few good games for us, but in reality, he ain't gonna boss games when your pack is doing nowt. 

Against Wigan, Williams was our biggest metre maker iirc, when you are relying kn your half for the yards, it sort of shows the inbalance if the team. 

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Williams is not going to boss a game because that is not in his skill set.  He is not an organiser or a talker.  He is capable of off the cuff quality... running, passing and short kicking and if you build that into your game plan then he will deliver.

Ricky Stuart tried to turn him into an organiser but he never got there despite showing some real quality in the NRL.

"The history of the world is the history of the triumph of the heartless over the mindless." — Sir Humphrey Appleby.

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1 minute ago, Dunbar said:

Williams is not going to boss a game because that is not in his skill set.  He is not an organiser or a talker.  He is capable of off the cuff quality... running, passing and short kicking and if you build that into your game plan then he will deliver.

Ricky Stuart tried to turn him into an organiser but he never got there despite showing some real quality in the NRL.

This ^^^^^

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So Dallas mead, 5 CC 4 wins, 2LLs, 4GF all lost, and because were are going through a bad patch all the toys are thrown out of the pram. In RL success takes time and squad overalls are done over a few seasons. Give Powell time and though its tough at the moment have faith. Look at the fall from grace of other big clubs like Bradford, thats a disaster, not whats happening to Warrington. 

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1 minute ago, ELBOWSEYE said:

So Dallas mead, 5 CC 4 wins, 2LLs, 4GF all lost, and because were are going through a bad patch all the toys are thrown out of the pram. In RL success takes time and squad overalls are done over a few seasons. Give Powell time and though its tough at the moment have faith. Look at the fall from grace of other big clubs like Bradford, thats a disaster, not whats happening to Warrington. 

No toys being thrown mate, I’m just sick to death of all the off field BS and our diabolical recruitment for the last 5 years.  It’s truly a mess.  I’ve been to every one of those CC finals and SL grand finals and stayed until the last minute in all of them.  Also as a season ticket holder since 1991 I’ve seen some true dross and this is getting close to being as bad as I’ve seen.  I’m allowed a Victor Meldrew moment I think!  Grrrrrrrr……

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I didn't watch the game yesterday so I can't comment specifically on that. But what I have observed when I have seen them is that their pack is very very poor. One of the worst in the league and easily the worst of all the teams with realistic playoff aspirations. Williams and Widdop get a lot of stick, some of it is probably justified, but realistically they are on a hiding to nothing against the good teams because they are playing behind a set of forwards that are more often than not getting bullied. It also stifles Clark who can't snipe from dummy half because he isn't getting those quick ptbs.

To compete they need to play high risk rugby, and sometimes that will work because they obviously do have some really talented players, but more often than not you are going to make mistakes and put yourselves in an even bigger hole. You can't win against good teams without a decent forward pack. Powell needs to recruit heavily for next year.

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6 hours ago, Dallas Mead said:

It’s been a slow burner really, last 2/3 years.  Been a season ticket holder since 1991 so I’ve seen some garbage 😂 but this is seriously bad.

The problem always starts at the top

 

Ralph rimmer

Karl fitzpatrick 

James rule

Gary hetherington 

Adam pearson

 

Although these people are are rarely held to account

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Their recruitment and retention has been poor, as pointed out above. The lack of size in the pack was evident to us as fans, I’m not sure how or why it was ignored by Warrington’s staff. 

I don’t think they should sack Powell though, he’s inherited this mess, he should be allowed to attempt to overhaul it.

Their fans seems to have deserted and the whole PR thing doesn’t appear to have yielded better crowds, maybe they’ve brought in better sponsors and commercial revenue but they’re struggling to get bums on seats and a child driving a toy car is an odd route to take. 

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5 minutes ago, Jughead said:

Their recruitment and retention has been poor, as pointed out above. The lack of size in the pack was evident to us as fans, I’m not sure how or why it was ignored by Warrington’s staff. 

I don’t think they should sack Powell though, he’s inherited this mess, he should be allowed to attempt to overhaul it.

Their fans seems to have deserted and the whole PR thing doesn’t appear to have yielded better crowds, maybe they’ve brought in better sponsors and commercial revenue but they’re struggling to get bums on seats and a child driving a toy car is an odd route to take. 

I do always think you miss the point about the Wire promotional activity. We've been lively and relatively sharp in this area for the last few years (in RL terms) and our crowds have been good. We've done pretty much zip this year and crowds are well down. 

It shows that we need to work hard to be getting that 10 to 12k average, and if we drop the ball on it we soon drop down to a core of 7.5k to 8k.

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