England vs Samoa Series

[Dave T]

31 minutes ago, londonrlfan said:

I think the US will be their target over the next decade or so, providing how profitable Las Vegas is. If it goes well, they won't be coming to England to play in 3 small venues in the M62, and you can't really blame them. 

We need to stop speaking about RL in England in such negative terms. The North of England is an amazing part of the world. 

That of course isn't to say we stage a series in the likes of St Helens, but coming to England to play RL is a very good thing. 

[Dave T]

25 minutes ago, Bedfordshire Bronco said:

 

Didn't they show the last one in France?

That was the end of year test wasn't it? I may be wrong. 

[OriginalMrC]

I'm shocked and surprised after the very successful Tonga tour where they played in front of huge crowds here that Samoa have turned this down. The RFL will have to cancel their bookings for St Helens, Huddersfield and Leeds if they can't find a replacement. 

[londonrlfan]

1 minute ago, Dave T said:

We need to stop speaking about RL in England in such negative terms. The North of England is an amazing part of the world. 

That of course isn't to say we stage a series in the likes of St Helens, but coming to England to play RL is a very good thing. 

It is, but unfortunately the RFL have zero ambition and don't want to grow the sport outside of the M62.

[crashmon]

9 minutes ago, Dave T said:

We need to stop speaking about RL in England in such negative terms. The North of England is an amazing part of the world. 

That of course isn't to say we stage a series in the likes of St Helens, but coming to England to play RL is a very good thing. 

https://youtu.be/5UXnulANF8g?feature=shared

[gingerjon]

11 minutes ago, Dave T said:

The North of England is an amazing part of the world. 

 

It absolutely is. The world famous cities of Liverpool, Manchester and Newcastle with their well-known and commanding grounds, each holding more than 40,000 people, would be an enticement for any sports team.

If you're not doing that though, it's a waste of time.

[Griff]

9 minutes ago, londonrlfan said:

It is, but unfortunately the RFL have zero ambition and don't want to grow the sport outside of the M62.

What do you think they should do?

Run Broncos and Skolars?

[gingerjon]

Just now, Griff said:

What do you think they should do?

Put on a decent Test series that entices other countries over.

They have failed.

[Dave T]

Just now, gingerjon said:

It absolutely is. The world famous cities of Liverpool, Manchester and Newcastle with their well-known and commanding grounds, each holding more than 40,000 people, would be an enticement for any sports team.

If you're not doing that though, it's a waste of time.

Funnily enough, they were the three cities I was thinking of. 

[Griff]

1 minute ago, gingerjon said:

Put on a decent Test series that entices other countries over.

They have failed.

Against whom?

Given that, apparently, hardly anyone wants to come.

[Dave T]

2 minutes ago, gingerjon said:

It absolutely is. The world famous cities of Liverpool, Manchester and Newcastle with their well-known and commanding grounds, each holding more than 40,000 people, would be an enticement for any sports team.

If you're not doing that though, it's a waste of time.

I would add, I think every series could probably run with one marquee event from three tests. For me, there always has to be an event that whets the juices, usually that should be London, but you could probably stretch that to Newcastle or similar. 

[gingerjon]

Just now, Griff said:

Against whom?

Tonga. It just happened. Did you not notice it?

The failure there is why Samoa aren't coming and nor is anyone else.

[gingerjon]

2 minutes ago, Dave T said:

Funnily enough, they were the three cities I was thinking of. 

We have been doing this a long time.

[londonrlfan]

3 minutes ago, Griff said:

What do you think they should do?

Run Broncos and Skolars?

No lol. We're badly run enough as it is. 

The RFL abandoning Wembley for England games was a huge mistake. 67k in 2013 and not been back since. Regardless how of rubbish the New Wembley is, it brings prestige to the international game. 

[Dave T]

1 minute ago, londonrlfan said:

No lol. We're badly run enough as it is. 

The RFL abandoning Wembley for England games was a huge mistake. 67k in 2013 and not been back since. Regardless how of rubbish the New Wembley is, it brings prestige to the international game. 

I partly agree, but they did follow up that Wembley match with Olympic St (which I thought was awful), Spurs was planned for the Ashes and Arsenal for the World Cup. I'm OK with that tbh. 

The mistakes imo was ignoring London in 2018 and 2023.

[Hopie]

Real punch in the gut moment, it was crumbs we were hoping for with a Samoa tour, and even those have been snatched away by the NRL/Aussies snapping up all the major teams to their tournaments.

RFL could no doubt have done better with the opportunity they had this autumn, but we also know in the past that those who run the game down under have regularly scuppered the progress of the international game, and I feel like there actions have more malice to them than incompetence.

If you were expanding a tournament which featured the 3 highest ranked teams, why would you not invite the 4th highest ranked team? (England might even be back up to 3 after recent results). As noted this is an NRL tournament and England are being deliberately excluded and I fear for the future schedule of any SH teams taking tours of this country. We need 2 high quality international windows a year, and England are going to struggle to average one every 2 years.

[Coastal_Geordie]

This is very sad.  I was hopeful we might have England v Samoa the rematch at St James Park again.  France?  PNG?  I think Fiji is probably the best replacement if it is a three game series, with v France mid season.

This will have come down to money.  The RFL must see it as too big a risk to try bigger venues, and the smaller venues don’t provide the revenue to pay a touring side properly (or even to fly English NRL players properly).

It’s a vicious cycle you need the ambition/revenue to get the better teams over and for marquee events.  If you get the pricing/ticketing wrong though you could bankrupt the RFL.

You either play it safe or have ambition.  The RFL are in such a weak position commercially they must feel they have to play it safe.

[Dunbar]

I mentioned to my wife a little while back after the international calendar was announced that I was going to go to Australia for the English ashes series and / or the next World Cup in 2025/26.  I had allocated a bit of cash from our savings to do this.

But I am not going to bother now, I am not spending money to support a sport that doesn't care about itself and constantly let's itself down.  Not least because I have absolutely no confidence that any of the future plans will be delivered.

I can spend that money providing for my family, holidays and such, and I will.

[GeordieSaint]

Fascinated to see what it is going to get drummed up by the RFL now. 

I know the NRL are doing bucket loads of stuff in the Pacific, but I really despise their leadership and their need to control everything to suit their agenda. 

[Bedfordshire Bronco]

1 hour ago, HawkMan said:

Problem is paying to bring NRL Lebanon players over to Europe or Qatar or wherever. The RFL couldn't make a profit from three games in the heartlands against Tonga, so it'll be a loss maker against Lebanon.

I may be in a minority but I enjoyed the Combined Nations games. How about renaming them Pacific All Stars and playing them,  " AllStars" could even appeal to Londoners, though admittedly "All Stars" is doing a lot of heavy lifting here.

Yeah I didn't hate the all stars /Exiles ...some close games 

[Bedfordshire Bronco]

2 hours ago, RugbyLeagueGeek said:

Just realised, with nothing currently scheduled for 2024, an Ashes tour in 2025, and a World Cup down under in 2026, it could be 2027 before we get to see England play anyone decent over here. And that's assuming the remaining calendar is adhered to (a very long shot given the first thing that England were supposed to do has now been cancelled...). 

Looking at the atmosphere and crowds not sure too many people really give a toss 

The Tonga series was clearly a test of the appetite for expanding international league and clearly nothing like the 70,000 or so regular weekly SL/champ attenders wanted to go and see it 

So be it ....and in a way it can be used to make the Samoa news less of a blow for us all

Let's concentrate on building the club game 

Edited November 9, 2023 by Bedfordshire Bronco

[Bedfordshire Bronco]

1 hour ago, Dave T said:

That was the end of year test wasn't it? I may be wrong. 

I think maybe it was.....I remember the second half being pretty exciting and maybe they won the second half? 

[Bedfordshire Bronco]

1 hour ago, Dave T said:

Funnily enough, they were the three cities I was thinking of. 

I was thinking of Ripon.....now that I know from this forum it is a city 

[Bedfordshire Bronco]

1 hour ago, londonrlfan said:

No lol. We're badly run enough as it is. 

The RFL abandoning Wembley for England games was a huge mistake. 67k in 2013 and not been back since. Regardless how of rubbish the New Wembley is, it brings prestige to the international game. 

That was some game to.be at.....maybe the last truly big international match we'll see.on these shores in retrospect 

I disagree about Wembley....it's a great stadium 

[UTK]

There's no reason that England couldn't join the top tier of a Euro A competition next year, there are structures that could be utilised allowing a Euro A comp to double as the WCQ they are currently intended to be.

What is likely to preclude it from happening is that England believe the European Championships are beneath them, hence why they have ignored the competition for 2 decades.

Unfortunately a golden opportunity had been handed to secure future SH post-season competition and it has subsequently been bottled. Everybody knew this situation was only a matter of time post-2017, there are no surprises that teams prefer to play in front of their home fans rather than halfway across the World in entirely incompatible timezones, this is an unfortunate geographic reality of our sport. 

The notion that Samoa should regret this decision is quite hilarious, the onus was on England to establish an appealing opportunity with the Tonga series - both financially and otherwise, this did not occur as has been well-discussed on this forum. The notion of England being positioned as some form of altruistic body offering potential independence from the NRL is a very fanciful interpretation of the circumstances, as if Samoa or Tonga won't be treated as the distant 3rd option after AUS/NZ every year.