England Squad Announced

[graveyard johnny]

when is the game? is on t'telly?

[muckymunksy]

2 hours ago, Jim Prendle said:

The fact that he spends more time suspended than he does playing might also have something to do with it.

Watts as settled down now he as got away from the Hull thugs. 

[Lowdesert]

4 hours ago, Leyther_Matt said:

Bit harsh putting 30 year old Hill alongside 35 year old O'Loughlin. Hill will still be in with a shout for the next World Cup given his level of fitness and the general lifespan of a prop.

Only taking one hooker could be a mistake given the expected temperatures. Surprised to Daryl Clark miss out on that score.

I don’t think it is and what is the general lifespan of a player, never mind a prop?  Everyone is different and it’s dependant on a myriad of things.

Hill rabbiting at refs and players shows common signs of a player getting past his best.  He’s still an excellent player, but what I’ve seen this season, that firm has been too sporadic.

Lomax, Williams could fill in at Hooker.  It’s a one off game.

[bobbruce]

29 minutes ago, Saint 1 said:

He isn't playing well enough. McMeeken, Millington, Holmes, Milner and Cook have all made more metres than him and that is limited to the Cas forwards, nevermind the rest of the league. 

Comparing him to Thompson (the least well established prop selected), he has 50% of Thompson's metres, 57% of Thompson's tackles, 54% of his tackle busts, and an average gain that is 0.13m more than Thompson. How does any of this balance out his terrible discipline? 

Makinson is awful as a modern day fullback because to be a modern-day fullback you have to be able to be a ballplayer. He would have been a great fullback 10-15 years ago though.

As I said he’d be a different type of fullback to what Bennett’s after but he’s still a decent fullback. Depends how your teams set up just off the top of my head I can think of Hardacre,Shaul,Duffy and Duggan who are excellent fullback but aren’t picked on their ball playing ability. 

[DavidM]

5 minutes ago, bobbruce said:

As I said he’d be a different type of fullback to what Bennett’s after but he’s still a decent fullback. Depends how your teams set up just off the top of my head I can think of Hardacre,Shaul,Duffy and Duggan who are excellent fullback but aren’t picked on their ball playing ability. 

Agreed . There’s fullbacks who can link up play as well in the line , but  there’s fullbacks who are just there primarily as an xfactor attacking weapon with blistering pace and elusiveness from the back . If you’re lucky you’ve someone like ponga and a few others who have everything 

[Wiltshire Warrior Dragon]

54 minutes ago, graveyard johnny said:

when is the game? is on t'telly?

Saturday, 23rd June, 9.10pm BST ko.  Live on BBC2.  Surprised that info has passed you by, GJ, but glad to pass it on.

[Lowdesert]

5 hours ago, MZH said:

Taylor has been nursing his shoulder for a month or two now. Missed a couple of games because of it and being playing jabbed up. Reckon that is as much a reason for his absense as anything.

Could be.  If fit, he he deserves to be in the squad at least.  I hope he doesn’t end up neglected the same as Houghton.

[bobbruce]

1 minute ago, Saint 1 said:

Hardaker's ballplaying wasn't a strong feature of his game but it was at least serviceable, and I'd probably say the same for Dufty. Dugan's lack of ballplaying is why St. George got rid, and even at Cronulla he has been selected at fullback for less than half of the games he has played (despite battling for the spot partly with Valentine Holmes, another weak ballplayer). Shaul is extremely limited as a fullback, hence him being completely ignored at representative level. To be a top-level fullback today, you have to be able to ballplay - look at Barba, Tedesco, Slater, Ponga, Tedesco, even RTS who started as a winger. 

You’ve named Tedesco twice and neither of them is a ball player plus RTS that’s three more for my camp.

[Dunbar]

I'm pretty happy with the squad.  It is the 17 I selected on the other thread plus Hill and Makinson who I rate very highly.

I expect the spine to be 

1. Ratchford

6. Widdop

7. Lomax

9. Roby

Probably Williams on the bench as he covers both the half back and hooker options although I think he is a little lucky to be in on form and his versatility wins through.

I hope Bennett goes with Connor and Percival in the centres as they are provide a more attacking threat than Bateman but I won't hold my breath.

I hope that Makinson and Thompson get some game time but I suspect they will be the two to miss out.

I know that people want us to leave out players like O'Loughlin and blood youngsters but I am a big advocate of picking your best squad and team available and build a winning culture and mentality.  I expect this squad to naturally evolve over the next few years to the next world cup but you should be the best option in your position to make the England team.  Younger players coming into a settled team and system will benefit hugely - probably more than throwing a bunch more into a test match.  The Knights can help the player development for the next generation.

[graveyard johnny]

18 minutes ago, Wiltshire Warrior Dragon said:

Saturday, 23rd June, 9.10pm BST ko.  Live on BBC2.  Surprised that info has passed you by, GJ, but glad to pass it on.

at a wedding but will tape it,  the night before origin 2?

[Harry Stottle]

When does the geriatric Aussie's contract expire?

I may be wrong but I would say with that squad he has selected there is not much thought of preperation for the 2021 World Cup, more like a cautious way of cutting another notch in his pole of victories, alternatively if he is in it for the "long run" he is sadly lacking any imagination.

Really, the selection of O'Loughlin, Hill, Roby, and Graham who will all most probably play in Denver is not by any stretch of the imagination giving a semblance of consideration for the future, Hall and McGillivary will be 34 come 2021 but the rigours of their position comes nowhere near than that of those aforementioned, this is great opportunity to set out on the path that could culminate with a victory in the final in November/December 2021 at home, in this country, what could be better for the sport here than that?

 

 

[Lowdesert]

22 minutes ago, Dunbar said:

I'm pretty happy with the squad.  It is the 17 I selected on the other thread plus Hill and Makinson who I rate very highly.

I expect the spine to be 

1. Ratchford

6. Widdop

7. Lomax

9. Roby

Probably Williams on the bench as he covers both the half back and hooker options although I think he is a little lucky to be in on form and his versatility wins through.

I hope Bennett goes with Connor and Percival in the centres as they are provide a more attacking threat than Bateman but I won't hold my breath.

I hope that Makinson and Thompson get some game time but I suspect they will be the two to miss out.

I know that people want us to leave out players like O'Loughlin and blood youngsters but I am a big advocate of picking your best squad and team available and build a winning culture and mentality.  I expect this squad to naturally evolve over the next few years to the next world cup but you should be the best option in your position to make the England team.  Younger players coming into a settled team and system will benefit hugely - probably more than throwing a bunch more into a test match.  The Knights can help the player development for the next generation.

People are indicating SoL will play 13.  He can’t get around the pitch like he could.  He’s been a great player, but not now.  

Youre right in that the team will naturally evolve and WB has to pick the best team to win.  Winning breeds success and we’ve got to win.

[Harry Stottle]

3 minutes ago, graveyard johnny said:

at a wedding but will tape it,  the night before origin 2?

Is that a colloquial slip johnny? do you mean record it or do you still use VHS cassettes?

Just asking because somewhere I have a box full (or 2) of RL tapes going back to the  mid 80's, albeit I have not seen them in long time, not had a VHS player for 15 years or more, her indoors (not here to ask at the moment) could have thrown them or sent to the charity shop, if you have a player and they are still in existance you are welcome to them.

[Harry Stottle]

8 minutes ago, Saint 1 said:

He has picked 3 new players in the squad with them having an average age of 24. Doing that while aiming to build a winning culture means more than tokenistic selection of any players that happen to be under 25 years old. When was the last time Australia banned anyone 30 years old from selection? We have a tour by NZ to win this year and further internationals to win next year first. 

Opinions Saint, proper preperation and all that will build up to perfect practise, you have it your way lets go the same way we did between 2013 and 17, I have had a lifetime of supporting underprepared GB/England teams, time to try something different, my last victory drink excluding Kiwi tours was in 1971, I suspect you have never tasted that sweet drink, time for a different approach I think!

[snapski]

21 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said:

Is that a colloquial slip johnny? do you mean record it or do you still use VHS cassettes?

Just asking because somewhere I have a box full (or 2) of RL tapes going back to the  mid 80's, albeit I have not seen them in long time, not had a VHS player for 15 years or more, her indoors (not here to ask at the moment) could have thrown them or sent to the charity shop, if you have a player and they are still in existance you are welcome to them.

Get em transferred to DVD before passing them on.

[Dunbar]

49 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said:

When does the geriatric Aussie's contract expire?

I may be wrong but I would say with that squad he has selected there is not much thought of preperation for the 2021 World Cup, more like a cautious way of cutting another notch in his pole of victories, alternatively if he is in it for the "long run" he is sadly lacking any imagination.

Really, the selection of O'Loughlin, Hill, Roby, and Graham who will all most probably play in Denver is not by any stretch of the imagination giving a semblance of consideration for the future, Hall and McGillivary will be 34 come 2021 but the rigours of their position comes nowhere near than that of those aforementioned, this is great opportunity to set out on the path that could culminate with a victory in the final in November/December 2021 at home, in this country, what could be better for the sport here than that?

 

 

It's a tricky one. I know we don't play a lot of internationals and it is tempting to blood some promising youngsters. But will 4 - 0 to the Kiwis this year do a lot for their development?

I would prefer to see England building a winning culture and firmly establish themselves as a team to beat... any youngster entering a high quality winning set up will surely benefit.

As for the geriatric Aussie. He took us to within 6 points of Australia in a world cup final in Australia.  I have seen us get spanked often enough in finals to know that is real progress. I think he has earned a bit more time to work on this team.

[Jim Prendle]

3 hours ago, Gates1 said:

True.  He ought to save his aggression and direct it at his team mates after a few shandies if he wants to play for England. 

Oh please. I am not getting into a discussion about player behaviour with a Cas fan.

[Jim Prendle]

3 hours ago, snapski said:

So Hardaker doesn't get a clean slate when he starts at Wigan then. When he is being pushed for international honours Wigan fans will be judging him on his Wigan form and behaviour. Guarantee it.

No, not from me he doesn't. I have been very vocal in my condemnation of Wigan for taking this clown on.

[Chris22]

3 hours ago, Wellsy4HullFC said:

I hope Chris Hill has to room with Jake Connor

If they do that, Wayne Bennett will probably have to put a baby monitor in the room for when Connor makes Hill cry again! 

[Jim Prendle]

3 minutes ago, Chris22 said:

If they do that, Wayne Bennett will probably have to put a baby monitor in the room for when Connor makes Hill cry again! 

Chris will probably headbutt him, as it seems no-one can resist Connor's sublime skills in that regard.

[graveyard johnny]

2 hours ago, Harry Stottle said:

Is that a colloquial slip johnny? do you mean record it or do you still use VHS cassettes?

Just asking because somewhere I have a box full (or 2) of RL tapes going back to the  mid 80's, albeit I have not seen them in long time, not had a VHS player for 15 years or more, her indoors (not here to ask at the moment) could have thrown them or sent to the charity shop, if you have a player and they are still in existance you are welcome to them.

only got Betamax -can u convert them?

[MZH]

1 hour ago, Jim Prendle said:

Chris will probably headbutt him, as it seems no-one can resist Connor's sublime skills in that regard.

Not really sure why you picked up on that so much. You claimed that guys at this level will see straight through his sledging etc, as if everyone who plays international RL is some perfect professional who never gets fazed by anything. I used Burrow as an example of someone who in theory should know better but couldnt help get wound up to the point that he stuck the nut on him.

His persona is irrelevant to me. I like him for his rugby playing ability. You were the one who brought up his wind up tactics.

[Lowdesert]

1 hour ago, Jim Prendle said:

Chris will probably headbutt him, as it seems no-one can resist Connor's sublime skills in that regard.

Come on Jim.  It’s not as if some international teams haven’t had their own pain in the arrises.  Gary Freeman, Boyd, Bird, Stuart and at times Fulton, all set out to destabilise teams.  All had skill.  

[Jim Prendle]

8 minutes ago, Lowdesert said:

Come on Jim.  It’s not as if some international teams haven’t had their own pain in the arrises.  Gary Freeman, Boyd, Bird, Stuart and at times Fulton, all set out to destabilise teams.  All had skill.  

Yes, they did, and it's way too early to have Connor in the same skill bracket as any of those in your list.

I hope he goes well, but i'm far from convinced that he will.

[marklaspalmas]

5 hours ago, bobbruce said:

Makinson does a very good job at fullback just not in the ball playing way that Bennett usually goes for. 

But he plays on the wing....