The General 'Toronto Wolfpack' Discussion Thread

[Gerrumonside ref]

Whether you agree or disagree with the Toronto decision the governance aspect of the sport in the U.K. is coming in for a lot of stick now.

 

[Damien]

1 minute ago, Tommygilf said:

Within 24 hours, 2 of the clubs that voted Toronto out for failing to fulfil fixtures and not paying bills have been shown to do just that. Oh the irony

The timeline of events has been no mistake has it? Kick Toronto out, Hull KR withdraw from league, season gets cut short, salford don't pay debts. Literally everything that people have complained about with Toronto has then been announced after with other clubs.

[Tommygilf]

1 minute ago, Damien said:

The timeline of events has been no mistake has it? Kick Toronto out, Hull KR withdraw from league, season gets cut short, salford don't pay debts. Literally everything that people have complained about with Toronto has then been announced after with other clubs.

Its painful how it has been managed.

[Tommygilf]

3 minutes ago, Gerrumonside ref said:

Whether you agree or disagree with the Toronto decision the governance aspect of the sport in the U.K. is coming in for a lot of stick now.

 

100% very few are coming out of this positively in "the RL family"

[Hela Wigmen]

Time for licensing to return. 

[Robin Evans]

2 minutes ago, Damien said:

The timeline of events has been no mistake has it? Kick Toronto out, Hull KR withdraw from league, season gets cut short, salford don't pay debts. Literally everything that people have complained about with Toronto has then been announced after with other clubs.

Pretty much. It doesn't make the Toronto decision wrong. But bloody hell.... we can't afe shoot ourselves in the head

[Liverpool Rover]

6 hours ago, Tommygilf said:

I wholeheartedly hope so, but the Super League have themselves stated they see no benefit (zero) in Canada.

After reading the article about the report it looked like they saw no benefit because they didn’t want to see any.

[ATLANTISMAN]

Pushing TW aside I personally think the SL/RFL/SKY SPORTS have done a brilliant job in getting as many matches on as possible given the circumstances also TOP MARKS to the Catalan Dragons for ALL the extra effort.

 

Paul

[Damien]

7 minutes ago, ATLANTISMAN said:

Pushing TW aside I personally think the SL/RFL/SKY SPORTS have done a brilliant job in getting as many matches on as possible given the circumstances also TOP MARKS to the Catalan Dragons for ALL the extra effort.

 

Paul

Why push them aside, this is literally the Toronto thread.

[Red Willow]

33 minutes ago, Damien said:

The timeline of events has been no mistake has it? Kick Toronto out, Hull KR withdraw from league, season gets cut short, salford don't pay debts. Literally everything that people have complained about with Toronto has then been announced after with other clubs.

Salford have met their liabilities since 2013, but don't let the truth get in the way of a rant.

The RFL and Nigel Wood did this deal with Marwen at the time. Salford should have had the deduction at that time 

[Tommygilf]

12 minutes ago, Liverpool Rover said:

After reading the article about the report it looked like they saw no benefit because they didn’t want to see any.

Absolutely. You can tell because it says zero. That's not small, minimal, slight or even negative, that's not even looking.

I'm annoyed that when they stated the crowded Toronto sports market they didn't look to how TWP had succeeded there in L1 and the Championship. They also didn't reference how rugby League's affordability compared to those other sports (often half or even a quarter of the standard ticket price) was a major factor in drawing in a diverse crowd in the city that were priced out of the other live sports. As I said, its clear they didn't look, because they didn't want to find anything.

[Tommygilf]

4 minutes ago, Red Willow said:

Salford have met their liabilities since 2013, but don't let the truth get in the way of a rant.

The RFL and Nigel Wood did this deal with Marwen at the time. Salford should have had the deduction at that time 

So why announce it now. Its been 7 years! 

[Damien]

1 minute ago, Red Willow said:

Salford have met their liabilities since 2013, but don't let the truth get in the way of a rant.

The RFL and Nigel Wood did this deal with Marwen at the time. Salford should have had the deduction at that time 

I like Salford and have said that teams should get a lot of leeway this season but don't let that stop you getting your knickers in a twist. Salford are guilty and have got a 6 points deduction, that is the only fact that is relevant here. What has happened the last 24 hours stinks, simple as.

One of the criticisms of LiVolsi was that he wanted a 2 points deduction next season. He was slated on here then Salford magically get a 6 points deduction applied in a meaningless season.

[Damien]

4 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

Absolutely. You can tell because it says zero. That's not small, minimal, slight or even negative, that's not even looking.

I'm annoyed that when they stated the crowded Toronto sports market they didn't look to how TWP had succeeded there in L1 and the Championship. They also didn't reference how rugby League's affordability compared to those other sports (often half or even a quarter of the standard ticket price) was a major factor in drawing in a diverse crowd in the city that were priced out of the other live sports. As I said, its clear they didn't look, because they didn't want to find anything.

Crowded is a joke, they were getting bigger crowds than SL clubs in the Championship with few away fans at that. If that is crowded I'll have more of it. Toronto is also a huge city, if that is crowded what does that make Wakefield? Some of these excuses stand up to no scrutiny at all.

[Red Willow]

6 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

So why announce it now. Its been 7 years! 

Because the CVA has only just defaulted. The 1914 ltd company kept the debts in a CVA. New company 2013 has been meeting its liabilities as they arise. The 2013 club is run within means.  I suspect this was a deliberate move by the supervisor/owner of 1913 ltd.

If Toronto had but together a package to meet the debts of the Argyle club and run the 2020 Ltd in the same way maybe they would still be in the league

[Tommygilf]

4 minutes ago, Damien said:

Crowded is a joke, they were getting bigger crowds than SL clubs in the Championship with few away fans at that. If that is crowded I'll have more of it. Toronto is also a huge city, if that is crowded what does that make Wakefield? Some of these excuses stand up to no scrutiny at all.

Its a total joke. We all know it. "Crowded sports market" is used as an excuse over here why clubs get lower crowds etc. Even if it is crowded, they still do better than all but 7 of our existing clubs, so either we're small time and our standards reflect that, or they're doing something right in Toronto. Or both.

I await to see the viability reports into having 2 clubs in Hull and 2 in the Wakefield MDC, and 4 in West Yorkshire.

[Tommygilf]

3 minutes ago, Red Willow said:

Because the CVA has only just defaulted. The 1914 ltd company kept the debts in a CVA. New company 2013 has been meeting its liabilities as they arise. The 2013 club is run within means.  I suspect this was a deliberate move by the supervisor/owner of 1913 ltd.

If Toronto had but together a package to meet the debts of the Argyle club and run the 2020 Ltd in the same way maybe they would still be in the league

How ironic!

[Damien]

9 minutes ago, Red Willow said:

Because the CVA has only just defaulted. The 1914 ltd company kept the debts in a CVA. New company 2013 has been meeting its liabilities as they arise. The 2013 club is run within means.  I suspect this was a deliberate move by the supervisor/owner of 1913 ltd.

If Toronto had but together a package to meet the debts of the Argyle club and run the 2020 Ltd in the same way maybe they would still be in the league

Jesus wept I know you are defending your club but that is priceless in the context of the Toronto complaints seen in this thread.

[westlondonfan]

Now that this decision has really sunk in I can’t help feeling that this outcome might have really long term adverse affects on the credibility of the sport. I feel really deflated about it.  I mean there was the build up of all this interest in Toronto from 2017 onwards, BBC coverage, getting promotion, coming back after we pipped them in the MPG, and then signing SBW for them to be knocked back at this stage now at this late stage. Can a sport keep enduring these sort of disappointments? I wonder. The only really successful expansion team since the foundation of the SL, despite all the talk, has been Catalan Dragons.

Let’s at least have a good look at Toulouse coming up now at the very minimum? 

[Wakefield Ram]

Losing Toronto is a backward step for the game as a whole.

[wilsontown]

I've always been a bit ambivalent about the whole Wolfpack project, but to me if there's thousands of people in Toronto who want to watch RL, we should be playing there.

[Hela Wigmen]

Anyone know if Toronto have an option to appeal?

[Tex Evans Thigh]

21 minutes ago, westlondonfan said:

Now that this decision has really sunk in I can’t help feeling that this outcome might have really long term adverse affects on the credibility of the sport. I feel really deflated about it.  I mean there was the build up of all this interest in Toronto from 2017 onwards, BBC coverage, getting promotion, coming back after we pipped them in the MPG, and then signing SBW for them to be knocked back at this stage now at this late stage. Can a sport keep enduring these sort of disappointments? I wonder. The only really successful expansion team since the foundation of the SL, despite all the talk, has been Catalan Dragons.

Let’s at least have a good look at Toulouse coming up now at the very minimum? 

Catalan of course being from RL heartlands.

[Phil]

37 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

Its a total joke. We all know it. "Crowded sports market" is used as an excuse over here why clubs get lower crowds etc. Even if it is crowded, they still do better than all but 7 of our existing clubs, so either we're small time and our standards reflect that, or they're doing something right in Toronto. Or both.

I await to see the viability reports into having 2 clubs in Hull and 2 in the Wakefield MDC, and 4 in West Yorkshire.

Five in the WF postcode area, Trinity, Cas, Fev, Dewsbury and Batley 

[Chrispmartha]

21 minutes ago, westlondonfan said:

Now that this decision has really sunk in I can’t help feeling that this outcome might have really long term adverse affects on the credibility of the sport. I feel really deflated about it.  I mean there was the build up of all this interest in Toronto from 2017 onwards, BBC coverage, getting promotion, coming back after we pipped them in the MPG, and then signing SBW for them to be knocked back at this stage now at this late stage. Can a sport keep enduring these sort of disappointments? I wonder. The only really successful expansion team since the foundation of the SL, despite all the talk, has been Catalan Dragons.

Let’s at least have a good look at Toulouse coming up now at the very minimum? 

I disagree, TWP not being in SL will hardly mean anything to the profile of the sport outside RL circles and unfortunately that’s because we don’t really have a presence in the wider sporting community or press. I think Toronto’s presence in the SL is being overstated by both the supporters snd detractors