England Vs Samoa - Your Team

[GeordieSaint]

I think he’ll go with this (but choices are in brackets where different):

1. Tomkins (Welsby)

2. Young

3. Watkins 

4. Farnworth

5. Makinson

6. Williams 

7. Sneyd

8. Hill

9. McIllorum (Ackers)

10. Oldezki

11. McMeekan

12. Whitehead

13. Radley

14. Welsby (Pearce-Paul)

15. Thompson

16. Burgess

17. Knowles

 

[Bedfordshire Bronco]

13 hours ago, saintspete83 said:

Phil "Gus" Gould on twitter when asked about England v Samoa "England can't beat Samoa"             to say I'm up for Saturday is an understatement. They really do not respect us.

 

 

 

 

 

 

That fat alcoholic is as clueless as the bookies 

I'll keep saying it....we'll win by 12 at least

 

[OMEGA]

It’s not going to be an easy game for either team

I think it’ll come down to who handles the occasion better and settles into their game plan the earliest.

England 22 - 14 Samoa

[Bedfordshire Bronco]

2 minutes ago, OMEGA said:

It’s not going to be an easy game for either team

I think it’ll come down to who handles the occasion better and settles into their game plan the earliest.

England 22 - 14 Samoa

I think the crowd, weather and home advantage is worth 10 at least 

[latchford albion]

7 hours ago, Mojo said:

Since I'm Samoan and seeing all the strong English line ups I'll put up my samoan prediction squad

1 Joseph Suaali'i- Pretty obvious he'll be the starting fullback. I think he'll slot right in with the Panthers boys and do well. Pretty much everyone who watches the NRL will be keeping an eye on him especially to see if he lives up to the hype.

2 Tylan May- Similar to Brian To'o has a very big engine to run over 15 hit ups a game. Doesn't shy away from contact and I'm looking forward to his battle with Dominic Young.

3 Izack Tago- Another young prospect from the panthers. Did very well in his debut season in the nrl and didn't shy away from the big occasion. Also another exciting match up against Farnworth.

4 Stephen Crichton- One of the smartest and safest Center in the Nrl. His main strengths is Defense. Reads the game well on the defensive and offensive end. And threatening when competing for the high kicks on attack.

5 Brian To’o- The best winger in the Nrl without a doubt. Combination with Stephen Critchon will be crucial against England. Has the ability to break the whole game open on the wing and dominate.

6 Jarome Luai- Panthers left side edge has been the most dominant edge for the last 2 years in the nrl and that's thanks to Jarome Luai's footwork, vision and kicking game. He's always judged because he's next to Cleary, the best halfback in the world but now it's his chance to prove that he can shine without being in Clearys shadow.

7 Anthony Milford- Has a underrated kicking game and the leader of this team. Samoa needs him to be at his best to have any chance to beat England.

8 Junior Paulo- Would've slotted in the kangaroos starting line up easily. Very strong ball runner and on his day can be the best prop in the world.

9 Danny Levi- Playing in the SL will give the samoan forward pack some insight on what to expect. Has a good passing game and good vision.

10 Josh Papali'i- Another one that would've made the the kangaroos squad. Has huge experience in big matches and has played alot of games with junior paulo in the samoan team.

11 Kelma Tuilagi- Started off with a bang for the Tigers at the start of the season and he was their best player. But than dropped off form in the 2nd half of the season that probably came down to the Tigers management letting players go during the season and ruined any chemistry the tigers had left. He should do well and has the ability to do what kikau did on the left edge for the samoan team running off Luai.

12 Jayd'n Sua- A very strong defensive player. Who's also good on the offensive end. Played Origin last year and he was in the Rabbitohs squad that made the grand final against the Panthers last year.

13 Martin Taupau- Played at lock for the Kiwis in the past so has a lot experience. Also played lock when Aloiai came off injured against the cook islands and was the best forward in that game. Needs to be at his best for samoa to have a chance against England.

14 Tyrone May- I can see Taupau going hard for 25 mins and than they put May on at lock to play the playmaking type style at the back to spread the ball to the backline. Another Panthers player that was part of the title win last season. Knows Luai's game more than anyone in that forward pack.

15 Josh Aloiai- Strong ball runner and was one of Manlys best forward this season.

16 Spencer Leniu- Probably the best impact player off the bench in the nrl. Damaging ball runner and brings alot of energy off the bench.

17 Braden Hamlin-Uele- Very underrated prop. Has a big engine to make 30+ tackles and run all day. Will be the key on the defensive end against the big English pack early in that 2nd half.

That looks a very strong team on paper.  Is Matt Parrish still the coach?

I still think England will win with home advantage.

[Mojo]

33 minutes ago, latchford albion said:

That looks a very strong team on paper.  Is Matt Parrish still the coach?

I still think England will win with home advantage.

Yup Matt Parish is still the coach. I was very critical of him but I think he's turned it around with the players. He's hired some very good assistant coaches to help him. Daniel Holdsworth the Sharks attacking coach, Richard Agar, Castleford Tigers Coach Lee Radford and Geoff Toovey. That opening game will definitely tell if they'll make a difference. It'll be a close game I'm going for Samoa because I'm bias lol but England will be very tough at home

[Dunbar]

I think England will win and these are the areas of the Samoan team that we can exploit.

1. The middles are good for Samoa but I think we will outlast them.  They may not go with the 6 middles listed on the previous page by Mojo but, if they do, they have played an average of 39 minutes a game each in the NRL in 2022.  The middles that England have from the NRL (Burgess, Thompson and Radley) play an average of 52 minutes while the likes of Oledzki and Knowles also have big engines.

In the modern game with the potential for HIA absences and injury, having a middle unit that can play big minutes is critical. 

2. Sorry, but I can't help but think this spine for Samoa is being vastly overated.  Milford is a very average first grade player and the fullback has literally never started a first grade game there!  Let's see how Luai performs away from the advantages the Penrith system gives them and we will see how he goes.

Put it this way, Luai and Milford have played 13 times for Samoa between them, only winning against PNG, France and Cook Islands, never beating a tier 1 team and losing 3 times to Fiji.

3. Lack of preparation.  Some of those middle forwards haven't played for quite a few weeks and the spine would really benefit from time together.  Expecting them to come together and play a structured game is a very big ask.  And that is before we look at the quality of coach.

I don't want to go down the cliché of saying that the Samoan players won't be fit enough (although they clearly weren't in 2017) but they will need to keep up the standards of the NRL in the camp.  Will they?

I feel that if England play a tough, disciplined, attritional game we will see a tough first 40 or 50 minutes then England will take control. 

Edited October 9, 2022 by Dunbar

[Mr Frisky]

England have too much quality and at home will win by 3 trys - after a tough first half.

Despite all the Tomkins doubts on here, he has matured into a real leader, was Man of Steel in 2021 and is the England captain so I think he will have a cracking tournament. 

[leytherz]

i hope england win but i just cant see it.jerome luai will tear us to peices.i think samoa by 10 whoever plays for england

[SydneyRoosters]

13 minutes ago, Mr Frisky said:

England have too much quality and at home will win by 3 trys - after a tough first half.

Despite all the Tomkins doubts on here, he has matured into a real leader, was Man of Steel in 2021 and is the England captain so I think he will have a cracking tournament. 

I agree my prediction 22-4 England

Oledzki, Radley, Young, Watkins Try scorers.

[Dunbar]

13 minutes ago, leytherz said:

i hope england win but i just cant see it.jerome luai will tear us to peices.i think samoa by 10 whoever plays for england

Samoa lost against Tonga and Fiji and drew with Scotland with Luai playing.  Why would he tear England to pieces? 

[Mojo]

11 minutes ago, Dunbar said:

I think England will win and these are the areas of the Samoan team that we can exploit.

1. The middles are good for Samoa but I think we will outlast them.  They may got go with the 6 middles listed on the previous page by Mojo but, if they do, they have played an average of 39 minutes a game each in the NRL in 2022.  The middles that England have from the NRL (Burgess, Thompson and Radley) play an average of 52 minutes while the likes of Oledzki and Knowles also have big engines.

In the modern game with the potential for HIA absences and injury, having a middle unit that can play big minutes is critical. 

2. Sorry, but I can't help but think this spine for Samoa is being vastly overated.  Milford is a very average first grade player and the fullback has literally never started a first grade game there!  Let's see how Luai performs away from the advantages the Penrith system gives them and we will see how he goes.

Put it this way, Luai and Milford have played 13 times for Samoa between them, only winning against PNG, France and Cook Islands, never beating a tier 1 team and losing 3 times to Fiji.

3. Lack of preparation.  Some of those middle forwards haven't played for quite a few weeks and the spine would really benefit from time together.  Expecting them to come together and play a structured game is a very big ask.  And that is before we look at the quality of coach.

I don't want to go down the cliché of saying that the Samoan players won't be fit enough (although they clearly weren't in 2017) but they will need to keep up the standards of the NRL in camp.  Will they?

I feel that if England play a tough, disciplined, attritional game we will see a tough first 40 or 50 minutes then England will take control. 

I respectfully disagree on the fitness of the samoan middles. The props samoa has consistently plays solid minutes in the NRL and most of them are starting props. Junior Paulo plays solid minutes in the nrl and Origin with no problem. Braden Hamlin-Uele and Royce Hunt are the starting props for the Sharks who also plays decent minutes in the nrl week in week out. Spencer Leniu comes off the bench to cover the Kiwis front row Fisher-Harris and Leota with no problem all season for the panthers. I'm a big fan of Luke Thompson but he's been coming off the bench for most of the season and that goes for Tom Burgess as well. So they're in the same boat Leniu and Kaufusi. I do worry about who samoa plays at lock that's for sure. And you've also got to remember samoa has a very fit backline that can take alot of hit ups on attack to give the forward pack some good rest throughout the game. Suaali'i at fullback is the one position that everyone's curious about. I honestly think he'll shine on his preferred position at this World Cup.

You guys keep doubting the halves but I think this is the strongest halves out of all the island nations. Jarome Luai is actually a good player but everyone likes to bring up the "Cleary" theory that he can't play at all. If anyone watched the 9s a few years ago he was the reason samoa played well in that tournament. He directed the team well and he was the one setting up all the tries. And they competed well against the kangaroos in the quarter finals.

I also disagree on the lack of preparation. The samoan backline combination is already there because of the Panthers connection. The forward pack i feel will click straight away. The only new name in that forward pack is Tuilagi all the others have played together before. Paulo and Papali'i are the leaders in that forward pack.

The past results aren't pretty for the samoan team. But you bring them up like we we've played international consistently every year. No ones played international for the last 3 years because of covid except for the mid test this year. The last world cup the samoan team was terrible and no one took that team seriously. This world cup for is different because the players look focused and you can tell they're hungry to get started.

I'm not over looking England because they're always a tough team to beat especially at home. But I think you guys are overlooking this samoan team too much.

[Mojo]

1 minute ago, Dunbar said:

Samoa lost against Tonga and Fiji and drew with Scotland with Luai playing.  Why would he tear England to pieces? 

The Luai at the last world cup that lost to those team was playing under 20s for the Panthers and wasn't even in the nrl yet. The one that played against Fiji, that team was terrible. They had Seve playing 6 next to him in that match because they had no halves to partner him. Seve is a center. Enough said lol

[leytherz]

25 minutes ago, Dunbar said:

Samoa lost against Tonga and Fiji and drew with Scotland with Luai playing.  Why would he tear England to pieces? 

have you watched penrith this year.samoa are better now

[Dunbar]

14 minutes ago, Mojo said:

The Luai at the last world cup that lost to those team was playing under 20s for the Panthers and wasn't even in the nrl yet. The one that played against Fiji, that team was terrible. They had Seve playing 6 next to him in that match because they had no halves to partner him. Seve is a center. Enough said lol

Jarome Luai plays for the most dominent team in the NRL - by absolute miles.

Here is where he ranks on players who have played five eight this year in the NRL (not all players, this is just players who have played at 6).

He is 9th for tries and 11th for linebreaks.

So, maybe he is there for creativity.

He is 5th for try assists and 17th for linebreak assists.

This is for a five eight who is playing behind the most dominant forward pack in the NRL and with a set of backs that means almost every single set starts on the front foot.

The Panthers spine is incredible with Edwards, Cleary, Koroisau and Yeo.  Luai won the lottery when he got a chance to play alongside them.  Let's look at him without the Panthers system and these incredible players around him.

[Dunbar]

7 minutes ago, leytherz said:

have you watched penrith this year.samoa are better now

Yes, I have seen every game that Penrith have played this year.

They are fantastic outfit, superbly coached and execute a game plan fantastically.  They also have a number of players who are either the best or very close to the best in their position in the NRL.  One of these is Samoan (Brian To'o).

[DavidM]

Samoa are much strengthened , they have a very good team on paper . England have played a warm up game , have home comforts and have a good team of our own . I expect England to beat Samoa 

[Toby Chopra]

2 hours ago, Bedfordshire Bronco said:

I think the crowd, weather and home advantage is worth 10 at least 

Crowd and home advantage should help England as long as they handle the emotion properly. Most of the squad have played in grand finals or world Cups so i hope they can channel it effectively into a strong performance. 

Weather won't be an issue for the opener by the looks of it: forecast is sunny, dry, moderate breeze and about 11 degrees. Perfect weather both to play and watch rugby in. 

England by 10 I reckon. Cant wait! 

[Dunbar]

1 hour ago, Mojo said:

I respectfully disagree on the fitness of the samoan middles. The props samoa has consistently plays solid minutes in the NRL and most of them are starting props. Junior Paulo plays solid minutes in the nrl and Origin with no problem. Braden Hamlin-Uele and Royce Hunt are the starting props for the Sharks who also plays decent minutes in the nrl week in week out. Spencer Leniu comes off the bench to cover the Kiwis front row Fisher-Harris and Leota with no problem all season for the panthers. I'm a big fan of Luke Thompson but he's been coming off the bench for most of the season and that goes for Tom Burgess as well. So they're in the same boat Leniu and Kaufusi. I do worry about who samoa plays at lock that's for sure. And you've also got to remember samoa has a very fit backline that can take alot of hit ups on attack to give the forward pack some good rest throughout the game. Suaali'i at fullback is the one position that everyone's curious about. I honestly think he'll shine on his preferred position at this World Cup.

You guys keep doubting the halves but I think this is the strongest halves out of all the island nations. Jarome Luai is actually a good player but everyone likes to bring up the "Cleary" theory that he can't play at all. If anyone watched the 9s a few years ago he was the reason samoa played well in that tournament. He directed the team well and he was the one setting up all the tries. And they competed well against the kangaroos in the quarter finals.

I also disagree on the lack of preparation. The samoan backline combination is already there because of the Panthers connection. The forward pack i feel will click straight away. The only new name in that forward pack is Tuilagi all the others have played together before. Paulo and Papali'i are the leaders in that forward pack.

The past results aren't pretty for the samoan team. But you bring them up like we we've played international consistently every year. No ones played international for the last 3 years because of covid except for the mid test this year. The last world cup the samoan team was terrible and no one took that team seriously. This world cup for is different because the players look focused and you can tell they're hungry to get started.

I'm not over looking England because they're always a tough team to beat especially at home. But I think you guys are overlooking this samoan team too much.

Yes, I agree Samoa are much improved.

And England are far from infallible of course.

I can't wait for the game so we can see how this goes down.  Whoever wins will deserve it.

[Bedfordshire Bronco]

46 minutes ago, Dunbar said:

Yes, I agree Samoa are much improved.

And England are far from infallible of course.

I can't wait for the game so we can see how this goes down.  Whoever wins will deserve it.

Yeah can't wait too.......

6 sleeps to go

[anjado]

1 hour ago, Dunbar said:

Jarome Luai plays for the most dominent team in the NRL - by absolute miles.

Here is where he ranks on players who have played five eight this year in the NRL (not all players, this is just players who have played at 6).

He is 9th for tries and 11th for linebreaks.

So, maybe he is there for creativity.

He is 5th for try assists and 17th for linebreak assists.

This is for a five eight who is playing behind the most dominant forward pack in the NRL and with a set of backs that means almost every single set starts on the front foot.

The Panthers spine is incredible with Edwards, Cleary, Koroisau and Yeo.  Luai won the lottery when he got a chance to play alongside them.  Let's look at him without the Panthers system and these incredible players around him.

This is where stats don't tell the whole story. 

Penrith's left side of attack has been the dominant side of attack in the NRL with the exception of Souths. 

In that time it's been 

2020 - Luai,Kikau,Crichton Mansour

2021 - Luai,Kikau,Burton,To'o 

2022 - Luai,Kikau,Tago,May 

Now Kikau is a superb and unique player and he obviously is a huge help, but one of the strengths of Luai is he plays within himself. He replaced James Maloney who would be one of the top 5 stand off's of the previous decade and he has done a far better job because he doesn't try and do too much. 

It doesn't mean he can't or won't or doesn't have the ability he is an excellent player. We have had wholesale changes on the left side of our attack every season with 4 of those players being rookies Crichton, Burton, Tago and May and the fact we haven't had a drop in standards is a huge credit to Luai who runs that side of the pitch. 

As for the game I think England will win, purely for one of the reasons you stated which is cohesion I feel Samoa will grow into the tournament. England are at home Infront of a big crowd I would expect them to play really well Samoa will be caught a bit cold but should be a great game. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Bedfordshire Bronco]

3 hours ago, Dunbar said:

Samoa lost against Tonga and Fiji and drew with Scotland with Luai playing.  Why would he tear England to pieces? 

I haven't bet on any sport in 15 years....scared to as I can see me having an addiction to it..

However, the hysteria some people are whipping up about Samoa and the resultant extremely generous odds on England are bringing me close. 

England in my opinion are at least 2-1 on to win maybe smaller odds.yet I can get 6-4 at the bookies......I might just have to make an exception and stick a ton on them 

 

[bobbruce]

3 hours ago, Dunbar said:

Jarome Luai plays for the most dominent team in the NRL - by absolute miles.

Here is where he ranks on players who have played five eight this year in the NRL (not all players, this is just players who have played at 6).

He is 9th for tries and 11th for linebreaks.

So, maybe he is there for creativity.

He is 5th for try assists and 17th for linebreak assists.

This is for a five eight who is playing behind the most dominant forward pack in the NRL and with a set of backs that means almost every single set starts on the front foot.

The Panthers spine is incredible with Edwards, Cleary, Koroisau and Yeo.  Luai won the lottery when he got a chance to play alongside them.  Let's look at him without the Panthers system and these incredible players around him.

I bet he’s top in the stats for head rubbing and third man flops. 

[LeeF]

18 hours ago, Cumbrian Fanatic said:

And if we do I hope they ask him about the game and his thoughts on why he was wrong

When he will block you which will be a shame for when Australia lose and he goes off to sulk and dream about his pre season friendlies in February 

[LeeF]

5 hours ago, Mojo said:

Yup Matt Parish is still the coach. I was very critical of him but I think he's turned it around with the players. He's hired some very good assistant coaches to help him. Daniel Holdsworth the Sharks attacking coach, Richard Agar, Castleford Tigers Coach Lee Radford and Geoff Toovey. That opening game will definitely tell if they'll make a difference. It'll be a close game I'm going for Samoa because I'm bias lol but England will be very tough at home

There’s a couple of those names who might not be considered “very good assistant coaches”