RLWC Attendance-O-Meter

[Madrileño]

8 hours ago, Exiled Wiganer said:

Who stole the copper box and put it in Pontefract?

If not, that’s more than a bit insulting. 

It was wheelchair stuff in the copperbox.

He was clearly talking about real rugby league. 

I am a big fan of wheelchair rugby league, but it is a different world cup in a different version of the sport. 

 

[Bedfordshire Bronco]

6 hours ago, Leonard said:

Strawman.

What??? In what sense is that a strawman argument?

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, Bedfordshire Bronco said:

What??? In what sense is that a strawman argument?

Enjoy the rest of your evening and have a good week.

Edited November 6, 2022 by Leonard

[Griff]

4 hours ago, Leonard said:

It's not easy counting the empty seats in the Copperbox with those coloured seats.

That's why they're randomly coloured. LNER stadium is the same.

[Guest]

1 minute ago, Griff said:

That's why they're randomly coloured. LNER stadium is the same.

I remember in covid that they sometimes had pictures of people in seats too.

Now that would be tough - like a double sided jigsaw i have.

[Griff]

2 minutes ago, Leonard said:

I remember in covid that they sometimes had pictures of people in seats too.

Now that would be tough - like a double sided jigsaw i have.

Well, laugh if you wish.

But it is true.

[Anita Bath]

2 hours ago, Chrispmartha said:

Is Warrington always  this much of a nightmare yo get out of? Total gridlock

Shudda got the train (unless you live in Leigh)…..they are sooooo reliable

I was back in manchester before 5pm

[David Shepherd]

2 hours ago, Chrispmartha said:

Is Warrington always  this much of a nightmare yo get out of? Total gridlock

Tell me about it. Took at least 45 mins to get to the motorway. 

[Big Picture]

3 hours ago, Leonard said:

12,674

That boosts the total to 287,585 and bumps the average up a smidge to 10,270.

[Londonbornirishbred]

2021(2) QF's 5,000 more attended than 2017 but 10k fewer than 2013?
Shocking turn out for both the Aussies and Kiwis, very good for the other 2.

I sincerely hope that if England do host this tournament again, lessons will be learnt, because whilst people can go on about pricing/recession etc, 200,000 people paid a lot to watch friendly Union games in Cardiff, Edinburgh and London at the weekend and another 400,000 paid considerably more to watch Premiership football!
As fans, WE have an obligation to turn up rather than whine about the lack of internationals in the game. Organisers seem to have don little other than ensure they have not lost money. I suspect the organisers of France 25 will do everything in their power to fill stadiums.
Let's hope Elland Road is rocking on Friday Night!

[Tommygilf]

9 minutes ago, Londonbornirishbred said:

2021(2) QF's 5,000 more attended than 2017 but 10k fewer than 2013?
Shocking turn out for both the Aussies and Kiwis, very good for the other 2.

I sincerely hope that if England do host this tournament again, lessons will be learnt, because whilst people can go on about pricing/recession etc, 200,000 people paid a lot to watch friendly Union games in Cardiff, Edinburgh and London at the weekend and another 400,000 paid considerably more to watch Premiership football!
As fans, WE have an obligation to turn up rather than whine about the lack of internationals in the game. Organisers seem to have don little other than ensure they have not lost money. I suspect the organisers of France 25 will do everything in their power to fill stadiums.
Let's hope Elland Road is rocking on Friday Night!

France 25 should learn from 21:

Don't pitch your tournament at a way higher price than any previous person in your audience has paid for similar in the recent past whilst concentrating over a third of your matches in a small area at said higher price point; thus discouraging multiple attendees when you're already pitching to a small pre-existing market. 

And get a ticket website that is up to scratch.

I suspect that France '25 will be a lot more like 2013. Some rustic and left field settings in the group stages, some marquee stadiums for the big matches, pricing aimed at getting eyeballs on events rather than just charging the most possible.

[The Hallucinating Goose]

1 hour ago, Tommygilf said:

France 25 should learn from 21:

Don't pitch your tournament at a way higher price than any previous person in your audience has paid for similar in the recent past whilst concentrating over a third of your matches in a small area at said higher price point; thus discouraging multiple attendees when you're already pitching to a small pre-existing market. 

And get a ticket website that is up to scratch.

I suspect that France '25 will be a lot more like 2013. Some rustic and left field settings in the group stages, some marquee stadiums for the big matches, pricing aimed at getting eyeballs on events rather than just charging the most possible.

I'm encouraged by the little bits of detail we've been given by the French bid. They said they're gonna concentrate on areas that will not be touched by the yawnion cup or the Olympics and focus on towns and smaller cities and grounds around 10,000 in capacity for the groups and larger stadiums in bigger cities for the marquee games.

The provisional list of places they released were all small cities, medium sized towns and a lot of towns that were essentially suburbs of larger metropolitan areas with a wide spread across the entire country, suggesting that most venues would perhaps only host a single game thus avoiding the over saturation we've seen this year. If I remember rightly they did say they wanted to use a lot of venues for the three cups, citing potentially up to 40 different locations. 

[RL Tragic]

1 hour ago, Londonbornirishbred said:

2021(2) QF's 5,000 more attended than 2017 but 10k fewer than 2013?
Shocking turn out for both the Aussies and Kiwis, very good for the other 2.

I sincerely hope that if England do host this tournament again, lessons will be learnt, because whilst people can go on about pricing/recession etc, 200,000 people paid a lot to watch friendly Union games in Cardiff, Edinburgh and London at the weekend and another 400,000 paid considerably more to watch Premiership football!
As fans, WE have an obligation to turn up rather than whine about the lack of internationals in the game. Organisers seem to have don little other than ensure they have not lost money. I suspect the organisers of France 25 will do everything in their power to fill stadiums.
Let's hope Elland Road is rocking on Friday Night!

I agree with some of your points . I think for me though .

Aus v Lebanon was bad but there is some argument that people knew the outcome .

NZ v Fiji , Was an appalling attendance and an embarrassment to the game and tournament organisers.

England V PNG , was broadly in line with 2013 quarter final against lesser opponents,and should have been a sell out .

Tonga v Samoa, was less than a NZ v Samoa group game in 2013 and should have been a lock out for that fixture.

I don’t think any attendance at this edition has been very good based on what the organisers promised,the whole comp stands at 6000 on average less than 9 years ago . 
 

I also hope we host again but my point is we had ample opportunity to Kerr lessons in 2013 , a phenomenal tournament . If something worked well you tweak it and make it better not radically change it .

[Guest]

42 minutes ago, RL Tragic said:

I agree with some of your points . I think for me though .

Aus v Lebanon was bad but there is some argument that people knew the outcome .

NZ v Fiji , Was an appalling attendance and an embarrassment to the game and tournament organisers.

England V PNG , was broadly in line with 2013 quarter final against lesser opponents,and should have been a sell out .

Tonga v Samoa, was less than a NZ v Samoa group game in 2013 and should have been a lock out for that fixture.

I don’t think any attendance at this edition has been very good based on what the organisers promised,the whole comp stands at 6000 on average less than 9 years ago . 
 

I also hope we host again but my point is we had ample opportunity to Kerr lessons in 2013 , a phenomenal tournament . If something worked well you tweak it and make it better not radically change it .

An average comparison pre semis and final is pointless and misleading. 

If you took wembley and OT out of 2013 the average and difference is markedly less. 

[Londonbornirishbred]

39 minutes ago, RL Tragic said:

I agree with some of your points . I think for me though .

Aus v Lebanon was bad but there is some argument that people knew the outcome .

NZ v Fiji , Was an appalling attendance and an embarrassment to the game and tournament organisers.

England V PNG , was broadly in line with 2013 quarter final against lesser opponents,and should have been a sell out .

Tonga v Samoa, was less than a NZ v Samoa group game in 2013 and should have been a lock out for that fixture.

I don’t think any attendance at this edition has been very good based on what the organisers promised,the whole comp stands at 6000 on average less than 9 years ago . 
 

I also hope we host again but my point is we had ample opportunity to Kerr lessons in 2013 , a phenomenal tournament . If something worked well you tweak it and make it better not radically change it .

I'd have games at smaller stadiums, with chances to buy discounted tickets early, with set deadlines and no last minute deals. Then, if it looks like you're heading for a poor crowd, fill the stadium with Kids and Community staff (Nurses, Armed forces etc.) don't be worried about folk getting grumpy because they paid and others get in for free. If you want to watch top quality League, it doesn't come better than a World Cup and they don't come around too often on home soil!

If you had announced that Samoa v France was to be played at Post Office Road, I reckon you'd have sold it out well in advance. As it was, there was never any danger of filling the Haliwell J so there was no urgency and you end up half empty and looking awful on TV
 

[Ragingbull]

Just now, Londonbornirishbred said:

I'd have games at smaller stadiums, with chances to buy discounted tickets early, with set deadlines and no last minute deals. Then, if it looks like you're heading for a poor crowd, fill the stadium with Kids and Community staff (Nurses, Armed forces etc.) don't be worried about folk getting grumpy because they paid and others get in for free. If you want to watch top quality League, it doesn't come better than a World Cup and they don't come around too often on home soil!

If you had announced that Samoa v France was to be played at Post Office Road, I reckon you'd have sold it out well in advance. As it was, there was never any danger of filling the Haliwell J so there was no urgency and you end up half empty and looking awful on 

Post Office Road?  I've heard it all now.  

Semi final at Odsal as well?

[ChristianB]

The missed opportunity was in not filling half the grounds with arranged primary school groups. No one who purchased a ticket would have complained (I wouldn't, and I drove myself and my kids over a thousand mile round trip to watch three group matches).

Introducing young children to the game is the soundest long term investment you can make.

 

[RL Tragic]

12 minutes ago, ChristianB said:

The missed opportunity was in not filling half the grounds with arranged primary school groups. No one who purchased a ticket would have complained (I wouldn't, and I drove myself and my kids over a thousand mile round trip to watch three group matches).

Introducing young children to the game is the soundest long term investment you can make.

 

Bang on , I think Leeds did it for the womens opener , there should have been a pledge to introduce X thousand of kids to RL . 

[RL Tragic]

33 minutes ago, Leonard said:

An average comparison pre semis and final is pointless and misleading. 

If you took wembley and OT out of 2013 the average and difference is markedly less. 

It was still a good few thousand more at this point of the tournament surely.

[Jim from Oz]

7 hours ago, The Hallucinating Goose said:

As we are now not going to be playing Tonga in the semi it means England's highest home attendance against Tonga is still only the 3,000 who attended the Federation Shield game in 2006.

However, due to us now playing Samoa twice in this tournament, 2 of our top 10 highest attendances (only England and not GB) will be against Samoa, our highest against them before this tournament being just over 5,000 who watched another Federation Shield game in Hull. 

Just some interesting stats there. 

Interesting (but not surprising) what WIKIPEDIA says about this tournament:

The inaugural Federation Shield rugby league competition was held in 2006. This competition is organised by the Rugby Football League and was contested by England, France, Samoa and Tonga.^[1][2] England defeated Tonga 32-14 in the final to lift the Federation Shield for the first time. No tournament has taken place since and its future is unclear.

[Jim from Oz]

15 hours ago, Jim from Oz said:

TOTAL FOR WEEK 1: 95,243 (average 11,905)

TOTAL FOR WEEK 2:  68,875 (average 8,609)

TOTAL FOR WEEK 3: 72,198  (average 9,025)

Australia v Lebanon: 8,206
England v PNG: 23,179
NZ v Fiji: 7,080  

UPDATED TOTAL: 274,911 (average 10,181)  

 

TARGETS:

2000 RLWC: 263,921

(8,514 per match)

TARGET 1 ACHIEVED  

 

2017 RLWC: 382,080

(13,646 per match)

 

2013 RLWC: 458,483

(16,374 per match)

 

2022 WOMEN’S EURO: 574,865

(18,544 per match)

 

ORIGINAL TARGET: 750,000

TOTAL FOR WEEK 1: 95,243 (average 11,905)

TOTAL FOR WEEK 2:  68,875 (average 8,609)

TOTAL FOR WEEK 3: 72,198  (average 9,025)

Tonga v Samoa: 12,674  

TOTAL FOR THE Q/Fs: 51,139 (average 12,785) 

UPDATED TOTAL: 287,585 (average 10,270)

 

TARGETS:

2000 RLWC: 263,921

(8,514 per match)

TARGET 1 ACHIEVED  

 

2017 RLWC: 382,080

(13,646 per match)

 

2013 RLWC: 458,483

(16,374 per match)

 

2022 WOMEN’S EURO: 574,865

(18,544 per match)

 

ORIGINAL TARGET: 750,000

[Jim from Oz]

So if (and yes, a fair-sized "if" at this stage) the 2 x semi-finals and the final all sold out to full capacity (approx 170,000), then there remains a faint chance RLWC 2021(22) could ALMOST reach the RLWC target of 458,483.

[pahars]

3 hours ago, Tommygilf said:

France 25 should learn from 21:

Don't pitch your tournament at a way higher price than any previous person in your audience has paid for similar in the recent past whilst concentrating over a third of your matches in a small area at said higher price point; thus discouraging multiple attendees when you're already pitching to a small pre-existing market. 

And get a ticket website that is up to scratch.

I suspect that France '25 will be a lot more like 2013. Some rustic and left field settings in the group stages, some marquee stadiums for the big matches, pricing aimed at getting eyeballs on events rather than just charging the most possible.

As long as the French government has pre paid the staging fee and the FFRXII just has to put bums on seats them I’m fairly confident about 2025. 
 

A couple of group games in places that RL has got 7k plus fairly recently and in the afterglow of the olympics and the other lot’s thing would give you: Toulouse, Perpignan, Albi, Carcassonne, Montpellier and Avignon. 
 

The first five are far enough apart to not saturate the market but not too far that they couldn’t share training facilities/accommodation. 

 

 

[Hopie]

26 minutes ago, Jim from Oz said:

Interesting (but not surprising) what WIKIPEDIA says about this tournament:

The inaugural Federation Shield rugby league competition was held in 2006. This competition is organised by the Rugby Football League and was contested by England, France, Samoa and Tonga.^[1][2] England defeated Tonga 32-14 in the final to lift the Federation Shield for the first time. No tournament has taken place since and its future is unclear.

England* were those not on tour with GB

[Guest]

6 hours ago, RL Tragic said:

It was still a good few thousand more at this point of the tournament surely.

Agreed. Just making the point. If we end up around 420k compared to 458k, then it is hardly a disaster. Especially given the loot the final will generate. 

I know there are more games, but depends how much of a needle mover Wales Vs Cook Islands was ever going to be.

In fact, there seems to be a view that more games has killed competitiveness and a reason to see group games. 

Edited November 7, 2022 by Leonard