Surprise, Surprise Derek Beaumont wants to end promotion- relegation

[Davo5]

2 hours ago, Eddie said:

If I was taking a commercial decision to pick my SL teams now I wouldn’t have London in. 

Or Bradford

[Eddie]

5 minutes ago, ShropshireBull said:

In 06 London got 5000 . A decade ago they got 3000. Playing at Ealing is fit for SL and after a 4 year absence they got 2k. It isn´t really beyond the realms of realistic possibility that they could get 5k at Plough Lane if they are locked in SL. 

Or if they get promoted and build a team good enough to start up. 

[Griff]

3 hours ago, Eddie said:

That’s three teams in how many years? Ok so it’s not impossible, but it is extremely difficult with the odds massively stacked against the promoted team, even in years where they get the same funding as everyone else. 

Huddersfield.

[whatmichaelsays]

3 hours ago, Eddie said:

That’s three teams in how many years? Ok so it’s not impossible, but it is extremely difficult with the odds massively stacked against the promoted team, even in years where they get the same funding as everyone else. 

The point stands. 

Beaumont says nobody has ever done it. The truth is that he has never done it. 

[phiggins]

2 hours ago, ShropshireBull said:

The only thing that Eddie and yourself have marked is yep, RL might have simply missed the boat by owning nothing in London. Zero infrastructure and at the mercy of a football club. Wimbledon don’t look like getting to the riches of the Premier League any time soon though. 

"The only thing" is still quite an important thing. Give them a place in Super League by all means, but don't do it without a plan in place that will stop them from moving to different areas of London every few years. 

[Archie Gordon]

1 hour ago, ShropshireBull said:

In 06 London got 5000 . A decade ago they got 3000. Playing at Ealing is fit for SL and after a 4 year absence they got 2k. It isn´t really beyond the realms of realistic possibility that they could get 5k at Plough Lane if they are locked in SL. 

I'm pretty sure they didn't average 5k in 2006.

But I am very sure that a Hughes-run Broncos won't ever get that because he's never invested money in building a supporter base. The decline in fans over his tenure has nothing to do with the stadiums involved and everything to do with the way Hughes and his appointments have run things.

[gingerjon]

7 minutes ago, Archie Gordon said:

I'm pretty sure they didn't average 5k in 2006.

But I am very sure that a Hughes-run Broncos won't ever get that because he's never invested money in building a supporter base. The decline in fans over his tenure has nothing to do with the stadiums involved and everything to do with the way Hughes and his appointments have run things.

4,642

Somewhat boosted by some borrowing of the union calculator for the opener v St Helens (8,213) and double header with the RU (I think it was) for Huddersfield (12,301).

[Oxford]

Let's face it the point of the OP was to essentially discredit Derek Beaumont, under the guise that because he doesn't want P&R now but was happy to use it when it suited. Well, Derek Beaumont looked after Leigh's interests when they were in the Championship and is doing much the same now they're in SL. So he's completely consistent in their cause and in no way hypocritical or duplicitous by his actions. His cause is the consistency and he champions it brilliantly.

And apart from all that P&R sucks well the R does anyway.

 

Edited February 23, 2023 by Oxford

[The Daddy]

8 minutes ago, Oxford said:

Let's face it the point of the OP was to essentially discredit Derek Beaumont, under the guise that because he doesn't want P&R now but was happy to use it when it suited. Well, Derek Beaumont looked after Leigh's interests when they were in the Championship and is doing much the same now they're in SL. So he's completely consistent in their cause and in no way hypocritical or duplicitous by his actions. His cause is the consistency and he champions it brilliantly.

And apart from all that P&R sucks well the R does anyway.

 

He's been great for Leigh, I do not doubt that

[JohnM]

It's perfectly acceptable for someone to change their mind about something based on changing circumstances etc.

[GUBRATS]

6 hours ago, phiggins said:

It's certainly a shift in view, given he's previously been adamantly in favour of P&R, even during previous seasons in Super League.

But he's not barely been in SL 5 minutes. This is his 3rd season (possibly 4th, can't remember what his involvement was in 05). He knows the challenges involved with assembling a team ready to make the step up, and keeping a team together.

I don't particularly agree with him. I think we need to find ways to get enough revenue into the sport to support two tiers, where relegation isn't such a massive hit. But a person is allowed to change his mind, and he's done so based on a fair bit of experience of the challenges involved.

Yes it's his 4th , Dereck was on the board in 05 

[GUBRATS]

5 hours ago, phiggins said:

True. But if my memory serves me right, Salford's first promotion to SL, as well as Wakefield's and Widnes', came at a time when the second tier season finished a few months before Super League, giving more time to recruit in the close season. Salford and Hull KR's second promotions came off the back of them playing in SL for a number of years and keeping as much of the SL infrastructure in place to bounce straight back up.

Hull KR in 2006/7 is the exception, of a team without a number of successive SL seasons previously, getting promoted in October and get themselves above one of the 11 established teams.

If Toulouse go up, and their owner says the same thing next year, would it get the same reaction? 

No doubt it will be dismissed on here by some HKR fans , but if they hadn't made it in 06 they'd have been stuffed financially , they gambled and it paid off , Leigh were the team who had come down and we were essentially level pegging until Batley did us in the play offs at Hilton Park , where have we seen the dogs do that afterwards ?

[GUBRATS]

2 hours ago, Griff said:

Huddersfield.

Full time team who had just been relegated after finishing bottom 2 or 3 times in a row , but getting reprieves due to stadium inadequacies of other teams ( Hunslet and Dewsbury ) then a few years later CAS and London are allowed up 

[meast]

6 hours ago, phiggins said:

True. But if my memory serves me right, Salford's first promotion to SL, as well as Wakefield's and Widnes', came at a time when the second tier season finished a few months before Super League, giving more time to recruit in the close season. Salford and Hull KR's second promotions came off the back of them playing in SL for a number of years and keeping as much of the SL infrastructure in place to bounce straight back up.

Hull KR in 2006/7 is the exception, of a team without a number of successive SL seasons previously, getting promoted in October and get themselves above one of the 11 established teams.

If Toulouse go up, and their owner says the same thing next year, would it get the same reaction? 

Huddersfield won promotion and finished 7th in 2003 with almost the same squad that got us promoted, with some good young homegrown players,  admittedly Mr Davy ensured we were still training full time but we still got promoted and were competitive the next season.

So competitive in fact that we beat all of Leeds , St Helens and Wigan for the first time in almost half a century.

[phiggins]

16 minutes ago, meast said:

Huddersfield won promotion and finished 7th in 2003 with almost the same squad that got us promoted, with some good young homegrown players,  admittedly Mr Davy ensured we were still training full time but we still got promoted and were competitive the next season.

So competitive in fact that we beat all of Leeds , St Helens and Wigan for the first time in almost half a century.

My point was hudds had multiple seasons in super league before relegation, which meant structures were in place to help bounce straight back up first time of asking in 2003

[Griff]

30 minutes ago, phiggins said:

My point was hudds had multiple seasons in super league before relegation, which meant structures were in place to help bounce straight back up first time of asking in 2003

2002. Ithought we were talking about staying up rather than getting back up  after being relegated.

[Oxford]

3 hours ago, ShropshireBull said:

But it is also why he should have zero influence over the direction because his interests may not be that of the sport.

I can see why you say this but firstly of course he wants the sport to do well, and I doubt that his efforts will work in the sport's favour. And of course the problem for the sport as a whole as always been self-interest among Chairmen.

[ATLANTISMAN]

4 hours ago, gingerjon said:

4,642

Somewhat boosted by some borrowing of the union calculator for the opener v St Helens (8,213) and double header with the RU (I think it was) for Huddersfield (12,301).

I was there that day 95% of the Quins Union fans left after watching an appalling match v Plymouth Albion which featured a 48 year old hooker (And not one from the red light district in Amsterdam:)

 

P 

[BadlyOverdrawnBoy]

7 hours ago, Gooleboy said:

London

 

7 hours ago, Davo5 said:

Bradford

 

6 hours ago, Griff said:

Huddersfield

Mornington Crescent

[gingerjon]

8 minutes ago, ATLANTISMAN said:

I was there that day 95% of the Quins Union fans left after watching an appalling match v Plymouth Albion which featured a 48 year old hooker (And not one from the red light district in Amsterdam:)

 

P 

I missed it as was on holiday but, yes, from people who were there, the official attendance of 12,000+ was about six times higher than the number watching.

What happens in Amsterdam stays in Amsterdam.

 

[meast]

3 hours ago, phiggins said:

My point was hudds had multiple seasons in super league before relegation, which meant structures were in place to help bounce straight back up first time of asking in 2003

3 seasons of being woeful, uncompetitive and nowhere near ready to step up, and 3 seasons of not being able to go down and regroup until 2002.

 

 

[meast]

2 hours ago, Griff said:

2002. Ithought we were talking about staying up rather than getting back up  after being relegated.

We were relegated in 2001, spent a season in the 2nd tier and came back stronger in 2003, that's what I meant, sorry.

[meast]

25 minutes ago, ATLANTISMAN said:

I was there that day 95% of the Quins Union fans left after watching an appalling match v Plymouth Albion which featured a 48 year old hooker (And not one from the red light district in Amsterdam:)

 

P 

I was there too and my mate from London who is a massive union fan, said the same about the RU game but enjoyed the RL game.

She is/was a Wasps fan so may not have liked Harlequins that much though, but it was a dire sporting event indeed.

[The Phantom Horseman]

Getting back on topic - I actually agree with Beaumont up to a point in this one, in that the odds are hugely stacked against the promoted team because of the massive disadvantage that they face in terms of when they can start their recruitment. That fact stands regardless of the fact that Hull KR for instance managed to overcome that disadvantage.

Very few Championship teams would have been able to offer the kind of contracts Beaumont would have had to do to keep his star players from 2022, and the fact that Leigh looked nailed on for promotion from around May onwards must have helepd in that regard, but most years the odds are stacked against the promoted team just because they aren't in a position to make big recruitment decisions until October.

[phiggins]

4 minutes ago, The Phantom Horseman said:

Getting back on topic - I actually agree with Beaumont up to a point in this one, in that the odds are hugely stacked against the promoted team because of the massive disadvantage that they face in terms of when they can start their recruitment. That fact stands regardless of the fact that Hull KR for instance managed to overcome that disadvantage.

Very few Championship teams would have been able to offer the kind of contracts Beaumont would have had to do to keep his star players from 2022, and the fact that Leigh looked nailed on for promotion from around May onwards must have helepd in that regard, but most years the odds are stacked against the promoted team just because they aren't in a position to make big recruitment decisions until October.

Yep. Was a much more level playing friend when the second tier finished before super league. Wakefield, Salford, Widnes and probably more managed to make the step up and stay up. 

The Championship grand final should be happening before the Super League play offs start.