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Posted

We need another 200 pages to formally analyse the Swiss experiment.

Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. (Terry Pratchett)


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Posted

If we can keep it going for a while longer then we can simply roll it into the next RFL discussion on structural change.

"Just as we had been Cathars, we were treizistes, men apart."

Jean Roque, Calendrier-revue du Racing-Club Albigeois, 1958-1959

Posted

I have just read the report in the Examiner, I don't know exactly how accurate it is ( no reason it shouldn't be ),  It seems to me this is far from being a done deal in the long term, And in Rugby league long term is usually about 18 months.

 

I have been wondering what the SL clubs are getting out of this, I can see the arguments for some of them being able to opt for a less spending strategy, But some of them clearly won't be doing that, so what has been ceded to them  to vote this thing through.

 

There is the thing about playing the better clubs more often, but that may be nullified by it becoming stale, and SL could have just cut some strugglings clubs adrift if that was what they wanted.

 

There is a lot more to come out of this yet, I can't believe the six clubs who were against this earlier , have just gone away , thought about it and just plain changed their minds, It's almost as though they have voted it through knowing something else is in the pipeline,  Maybe a better TV deal or something.

 

They have been saying all along that there is not enough money to run SL properly ( and i agree ) but this deal doesn't seem to give them enough extra to have had such a big change of heart, One thing is certain none of them are fools when it comes to money, And i don't believe any of them have voted for this without knowing all the details, ( which are to be published later apparently )

 

I just have a feeling this is a stepping stone to something.

It may be a case of the potential broadcaster(s)really seeing the outstanding merits of this particular system and as such are willing to battle for the rights to pay handsomely for it to be implemented.

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Posted (edited)

I think it is worth stating that at this point there isn't any extra money to share until the SL clubs have met next week and agreed to allow some of "their" money to be used this way.   This was the sticking point when 6 clubs walked out prior to the World Cup and that is still very much up in the air.

 

If the SL clubs don't agree then the Championship clubs will receive exactly what they got this year from central funds - £90k.

Very interesting point.

 

To be honest, it is "their" money. Sky pay for the right to broadcast SL matches, no-one pays to broadcast Championship matches. Even under the new format for 2015 it's doubtful Sky will show any games from the Championship during the regular season, and quite probably just one or two from the middle eight section. If SL generates the money, and we know they need every penny of as it is, then why should they give it to the Championship clubs?

Edited by nadera78

"Just as we had been Cathars, we were treizistes, men apart."

Jean Roque, Calendrier-revue du Racing-Club Albigeois, 1958-1959

Posted

What doesn't look great was that the 3 x 8 proposal was only passed by 50% of the Superleague clubs. 7 for, 6 against and 1 abstention.

13 voted for a reduction to 12 clubs with against 1 abstention.

What will the bottom 8 play for other than avoiding relegation? The Not Really As Good As The League Below Superleague Challenge Vase.

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Posted (edited)

My understanding is that the structure has been agreed, the finances haven't. .....

No but the structure got a majority vote so presumably those who voted 'Aye' will have done so in the knowledge that funding has to be appropriate. In view of this it's reasonable to expect that the same majority will vote accordingly when the SL clubs debate the finance issues.

Edited by Terry Mullaney

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Posted

We can play this out all night Griff but you know there will always be a Fev fan in the wings to quote a post from page 56 :D So we may as well call a truce.

 

there will always be a Fev fan

 

Now you've depressed me.  

Posted

There can be no last poster.  Just a bloke who made the latest post. ;)

 

Ahem...It might be a lady

Whilst I do not suffer fools gladly, I will always gladly make fools suffer

A man is getting along on the road of wisdom when he realises that his opinion is just an opinion

Posted

No but the structure got a majority vote so presumably those who voted 'Aye' will have done so in the knowledge that funding has to be appropriate. In view of this it's reasonable to expect that the same majority will vote accordingly when the SL clubs debate the finance issues.

You're expecting SL clubs, who we all know need every penny of central funding they can get their hands on, to look at the GBP2.6million saved by dumping 2 clubs and willingly vote to hand that money over to Championship clubs? One or two might, as a way of hedging their bets in case of being relegated at the end of this year, but I can't see a majority doing it.

"Just as we had been Cathars, we were treizistes, men apart."

Jean Roque, Calendrier-revue du Racing-Club Albigeois, 1958-1959

Posted

there will always be a Fev fan

 

Now you've depressed me.  

We'll always be around John, life would be boring without us admit it.

"You cant be scared of death. When that time comes, it comes....I've been blessed. God's looked out for me, so, I'm happy." -Sean Taylor, #21, Washington Redskins

Posted

Very interesting point.

 

To be honest, it is "their" money. Sky pay for the right to broadcast SL matches, no-one pays to broadcast Championship matches. Even under the new format for 2015 it's doubtful Sky will show any games from the Championship during the regular season, and quite probably just one or two from the middle eight section. If SL generates the money, and we know they need every penny of as it is, then why should they give it to the Championship clubs?

 

A point i made some few thousands of posts back, It in my opinion is what the whole thing is about, and always has been.  It's a chance for the RFL to take money away from SLE and use it to try and fund the rest of Rugby league .

 

I totally agree that the clubs under SL level want ( and need ) extra funding, This just gets the RFL off the hook, by claiming It's all for the good of the game.

 

The SL chairmen have been saying that they need more money to keep up the level of the elite comp, But why would the RFL take any notice of them, I mean what do the likes of I lenahan know , other than how to run a top class club of course.

 

I would love to see the Championship well funded in a great comp, But why you want to even risk the comp that brings in the money, in any way is beyond me. I would say that helps no one.

Dont expect anything from a pig but a grunt

Posted

You're expecting SL clubs, who we all know need every penny of central funding they can get their hands on, to look at the GBP2.6million saved by dumping 2 clubs and willingly vote to hand that money over to Championship clubs? One or two might, as a way of hedging their bets in case of being relegated at the end of this year, but I can't see a majority doing it.

So what would be the point in voting for it in the first place? The system can't run without the required funding. Even Lenagan has said good progress has been made following the meeting

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Posted (edited)

got to be honest im not in favour of this new look . Theres no expansion in this infact it looks to me like a step backwards. While you could say the current super had gone a bit flat the new set up brings nothing new. How is this to help England , wales and France  ? WE should have sort investors to add new teams to the fourteen . Toulouse should have been added and the crusaders relocated to Cardiff . The possibility of another new team in Manchester . The sixteen could have looked like this Bradford ,Cardiff , Catalan , Huddersfield , Hull FC , Hull KR , Leeds , London , Manchester , St Helens , Salford , Toulouse , Wakefield , Warrington , Widnes and Wigan. European Rugby League Championship 26 weekly rounds with straight top eight play offs like the old premiership. Then instead of challenge cup just have the 16 teams in European knock out cup . 

Edited by superten

Chief Crazy Eagle

Posted

You're expecting SL clubs, who we all know need every penny of central funding they can get their hands on, to look at the GBP2.6million saved by dumping 2 clubs and willingly vote to hand that money over to Championship clubs? One or two might, as a way of hedging their bets in case of being relegated at the end of this year, but I can't see a majority doing it.

 

Not a single one of the six clubs who voted against the new structure will be anywhere near relegation at the end of this season. People can quote Lenaghan that progress has been made; but he still voted no as did Koukash and some other very big and successful personalities. Progress to them may mean something very different...

Posted

So what would be the point in voting for it in the first place? The system can't run without the required funding. Even Lenagan has said good progress has been made following the meeting

If I was chairman of a struggling SL club I might think it a good idea to go along with the changes because I know I can't catch Wigan and can use this to cut spending in some areas. But at the same time, by denying the Championship clubs the funding they want I can make sure they don't pose a genuine threat of taking my SL place. I can reduce my losses and maintain my place in SL.

"Just as we had been Cathars, we were treizistes, men apart."

Jean Roque, Calendrier-revue du Racing-Club Albigeois, 1958-1959

Posted

Not a single one of the six clubs who voted against the new structure will be anywhere near relegation at the end of this season. People can quote Lenaghan that progress has been made; but he still voted no as did Koukash and some other very big and successful personalities. Progress to them may mean something very different...

But Koukash and Adam Pearson have both said they'll give their full support to the changes. Sabotaging it by deliberately underfunding the new structure wouldn't be consistent with what they've said. There's probably another carrot being dangled somewhere in the mix.

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Posted

So what would be the point in voting for it in the first place? The system can't run without the required funding. Even Lenagan has said good progress has been made following the meeting

 

 

 

Genuine question Terry,  What would you guess is the reason these 6 club chairmen have apparently changed their opinion, or at least have allowed it to go through.

Dont expect anything from a pig but a grunt

Posted

But Koukash and Adam Pearson have both said they'll give their full support to the changes. Sabotaging it by deliberately underfunding the new structure wouldn't be consistent with what they've said. There's probably another carrot being dangled somewhere in the mix.

 

Aye.  The carrot of being able to change the funding to their advantage might be it though.

Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. (Terry Pratchett)

Posted

But Koukash and Adam Pearson have both said they'll give their full support to the changes. Sabotaging it by deliberately underfunding the new structure wouldn't be consistent with what they've said. There's probably another carrot being dangled somewhere in the mix.

I've got a feeling koukash will get his own way here terry and the SL will get their salary cap raised too. (Just a feeling that could be the carrot dangled).

Posted

But Koukash and Adam Pearson have both said they'll give their full support to the changes. Sabotaging it by deliberately underfunding the new structure wouldn't be consistent with what they've said. There's probably another carrot being dangled somewhere in the mix.

I just can't see either of them, both with clubs that need the extra money, voting to give away revenue that they generate. Same for most of SL.

It would have to be one hell of a carrot to pass up on 200K for no extra work.

"Just as we had been Cathars, we were treizistes, men apart."

Jean Roque, Calendrier-revue du Racing-Club Albigeois, 1958-1959

Posted (edited)

But Koukash and Adam Pearson have both said they'll give their full support to the changes. Sabotaging it by deliberately underfunding the new structure wouldn't be consistent with what they've said. There's probably another carrot being dangled somewhere in the mix.

 

The changes that have been agreed are the structural reform, not as yet the distribution of monies, which is a very different beast. If they'd agreed to the distribution of that money, it would have been announced with the structural reform. I hope I am wrong and they do agree to the money as the reform will be even more pointless than it already is my opinion of course!)...

Edited by GeordieSaint
Posted

Genuine question Terry,  What would you guess is the reason these 6 club chairmen have apparently changed their opinion, or at least have allowed it to go through.

I don't think they have changed their minds on the system and they didn't allow it go through, they were narrowly out voted so have to accept it. However I do think its likely there's a sweetener on the horizon which has caused them to back off a little regarding governance and finance.

According to one of the RL papers today Sky could have some opposition for the broadcasting rights and lucrative sponsor partners are apparently lined up so maybe they've had the rug pulled from under them. All speculation but I'd be shocked if the new format doesn't get the funding needed to make it work to its full potential.

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