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jroyales

Time to change the number of tackles rule.

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Watching RL the game has become so predictable. The Lions/NZ game emphasised the point. Six tackles and then a kick. A "tactic" used in all RL games. We criticise RU because of its non-stop kicking sadly we are just as bad, if not worse! Watching some of the RUWC games it was interesting to see how they build up attacks, agreeably slowly, but they had the time to do it - they call them "phases."

I am not advocating a return to unlimited possession but anything to stop six tackles and then a kick.

A possible solution could be having ten tackles. This could give sides more time to build an attack. Another suggestion could be limiting the kicking to certain areas of the pitch.

Something must be done to make the game more exciting and less boring due to its predictability.

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Just now, jroyales said:

Watching RL the game has become so predictable. The Lions/NZ game emphasised the point. Six tackles and then a kick. A "tactic" used in all RL games. We criticise RU because of its non-stop kicking sadly we are just as bad, if not worse! Watching some of the RUWC games it was interesting to see how they build up attacks, agreeably slowly, but they had the time to do it - they call them "phases."

I am not advocating a return to unlimited possession but anything to stop six tackles and then a kick.

A possible solution could be having ten tackles. This could give sides more time to build an attack. Another suggestion could be limiting the kicking to certain areas of the pitch.

Something must be done to make the game more exciting and less boring due to its predictability.

Would that be the predictability that got Salford to Old Trafford? 

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Increasing the number of tackles would just make sticking it up the jumper more of a percentage option. The seven-tackle rule already guarantees you reach the opponents 20 without having to take any risks.

I would actually love to see five tackles trialled.

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20 minutes ago, jroyales said:

Watching RL the game has become so predictable. The Lions/NZ game emphasised the point. Six tackles and then a kick. A "tactic" used in all RL games. We criticise RU because of its non-stop kicking sadly we are just as bad, if not worse! Watching some of the RUWC games it was interesting to see how they build up attacks, agreeably slowly, but they had the time to do it - they call them "phases."

I am not advocating a return to unlimited possession but anything to stop six tackles and then a kick.

A possible solution could be having ten tackles. This could give sides more time to build an attack. Another suggestion could be limiting the kicking to certain areas of the pitch.

Something must be done to make the game more exciting and less boring due to its predictability.

a couple of issues:

1. The phase play that you are lauding in Union is dull unless it is the 25 phases you are thinking of England at South Africa's try line.. which was only exciting in that they may have got over the line to score but in reality that was never going to happen as it was 25 phases of one up bash and modern day teams just do not concede that often around there. It takes a lot of tedious bashing, and normally the plan is to catch them offside with a technicality around the ruck and win a penalty and maybe a penalty try (or to set a scrum with the penalty for a penalty try if you are dominating). Equally that was 25 tackles where the ball moved very little and the play was not expansive.. so not really helping. in other areas of the pitch 10 phases is seen as impressive ball retention (which in itself is sad) and then often if they are not making much advantage they kick, normally with kick back and often another kick! Even that 25 phase play at the line if I was not English watching the world cup final hoping we would score it would have been dull as hell. 

I watch a lot of Union and I do not see what you are saying at all.. certainly not due to the rules of the game. Expansive teams are expansive teams and they play expansive rugby.. boring up the jumper teams are boring up the jumper teams due to the skills in the side. Both play by the rules. 

2. The Lions/NZ game was dull because of the tactics employed by the Lions and New Zealand (though they were more expansive). However, the Lions did not kick all that often in the first half on the last tackle, they ran quite a lot (badly but still they ran it). The Lions tactically look poor, we have not been set up right and the games have not been particularly good. However, watch other games played by other teams and they are expansive (many examples in the NRL and in Super League) they are played to the same rules but with coaches with more imagination... 

IMHO your argument does not hold up because the facts disprove it completely... (eg the lions actually ran quite a lot of last tackle plays (compared to normal) and you say they kicked and most a lot the phase play in union leads to a kick for territory)

The issue is not the rules its the imagination of the coaches and the risk v reward nature of the players. A tight game is a lot more attritional (in both codes) than a game where you are starting to get a bit of a lead... South Africa only opened up when they got, first, a break for their first try and then, because of that first try, an attitude of "we are taking the game away from them now". This happens in both games frequently. 

To compare both sports is false but your comparisons are not fair on this.. take a close attritional game in both sports and its up the jumper, abosrb pressure and kick for territory. Take 2 teams that are prepared to throw the ball around and they will.. it isnt the laws that are stopping them.

Edited by RP London
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As others have already said. I think increasing the tackles would have the opposite effect to what you are looking for. If you have 10 tackles you know that you can go the length of the field simply by playing safe, so we will see even less enterprise. 

If you want to see teams be more expansive there must be a better way.

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5 hours ago, jroyales said:

Watching RL the game has become so predictable. The Lions/NZ game emphasised the point. Six tackles and then a kick. A "tactic" used in all RL games. We criticise RU because of its non-stop kicking sadly we are just as bad, if not worse! Watching some of the RUWC games it was interesting to see how they build up attacks, agreeably slowly, but they had the time to do it - they call them "phases."

I am not advocating a return to unlimited possession but anything to stop six tackles and then a kick.

A possible solution could be having ten tackles. This could give sides more time to build an attack. Another suggestion could be limiting the kicking to certain areas of the pitch.

Something must be done to make the game more exciting and less boring due to its predictability.

Clearly you missed the epic Welsh attack of 20 phases which was I give you very very slow but resulted in an overall gain of minus 3 metres before they lost possession

The high number of phases; the slow & ponderous play and the loss of both metres and possession are regular occurrences in RU and are definitely not something this sport should aspire to 

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5 hours ago, RP London said:

I watch a lot of Union

Are you okay?

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“I'm not upset that you lied to me, I'm upset that from now on I can't believe you.”    

 

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1 minute ago, LeeF said:

definitely not something this sport should aspire to 

Or necessarily bothering to discuss.


“I'm not upset that you lied to me, I'm upset that from now on I can't believe you.”    

 

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I wonder what Rugby League would be like if we introduced the following (I'm not particularly advocating it, just a thought experiment).

  • Any time the dummy half is caught in possession it is an immediate turnover.  This wouldn't outlaw the scoot but it would mean that the dummy half wouldn't take the scoot option unless there is a clear chance to score/make a break.
     
  • On tackles 4 and 5 there must be a minimum of two passes of the ball each play.  If the dummy half or first receiver are caught in possession then it is a turnover.

As I say, just a thought.

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One poor major match and there's always someone advocating the failures of the past as a remedy for the present. Has anybody brought up the five yard thing yet? You know, jinking halfbacks, ball-handling forwards, small boys in the park, jumpers for goalposts etc. etc.

The other two matches on Saturday were great entertainment.

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5 hours ago, Just Browny said:

Increasing the number of tackles would just make sticking it up the jumper more of a percentage option. The seven-tackle rule already guarantees you reach the opponents 20 without having to take any risks.

I would actually love to see five tackles trialled.

It would be interesting, I'm not sure the effect of 5 tackles would be enough, we might just get lower scoring games which would be closer, which isnt a bad thing  but on not sure it would encourage attacking play. Especially considering what we saw in the 9s.

But fewer tackles is much more likely to create a positive outcome than more. More tackles prioritises possession and we are probably too possession based in the game. 

You would wonder if we went really far down, to say 3 tackles if that would force teams to attack to get themselves in to attacking position  and whether it would make them more likely to take attacking risks because the downside of losing the ball werent as great. 

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3 minutes ago, Futtocks said:

One poor major match and there's always someone advocating the failures of the past as a remedy for the present. Has anybody brought up the five yard thing yet? You know, jinking halfbacks, ball-handling forwards, small boys in the park, jumpers for goalposts etc. etc.

The other two matches on Saturday were great entertainment.

One poor match and someone is advocating a change to an even worse match.

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21 minutes ago, Oxford said:

Are you okay?

in so so many ways... no :kolobok_fie:

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1 minute ago, RP London said:

in so so many ways... no :kolobok_fie:

Jan 30th not long now.

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22 minutes ago, Rupert Prince said:

the laying on in the tackle.

Plus the wrestle or more delay.


“I'm not upset that you lied to me, I'm upset that from now on I can't believe you.”    

 

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3 minutes ago, Oxford said:

Jan 30th not long now.

Brexit? :kolobok_suicide:

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32 minutes ago, LeeF said:

Clearly you missed the epic Welsh attack of 20 phases which was I give you very very slow but resulted in an overall gain of minus 3 metres before they lost possession

Phase = fat bloke puts head down and charges one inch before falling down to recycle ball to next fat bloke to do the same . If you have a ten man overlap ... well tough 

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2 minutes ago, RP London said:

Brexit? :kolobok_suicide:

No

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“I'm not upset that you lied to me, I'm upset that from now on I can't believe you.”    

 

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1 minute ago, DavidM said:

Phase = fat bloke puts head down and charges one inch before falling down to recycle ball to next fat bloke to do the same . If you have a ten man overlap ... then something has gone horribly wrong with the plan so you better kick it so you can start again once the opposition has shown you how..

i've edited that for accuracy, hope you dont mind.. 

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