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Folau set to depart the Dragons ?


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Just now, Blind side johnny said:

Dead the statement first. They say that he has family issues a disingenuous regular contact with the club.

The statement says family issues *and* covid restrictions in France.

I'm offering him as much sympathy for his position as he deserves.

Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. (Terry Pratchett)

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My advice to Israel.  When deciding whether to break your contract, fail to turn up for pre-season training, ignore the attempts at contact from your employer and consider a move to French Rugby Union

Well, this is an entirely unexpected development.

Hard to comment on Folau threads without seemingly like a sympathiser. I'm not to be clear - I completely disagree with his 'beliefs'.  But once again many on here appear to have their moral comp

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9 minutes ago, Dunbar said:

I think we need to be clear here.  Folau did not win an unfair dismissal claim as he reached a settlement with the ARU before the case was heard.

The part I liked best about all of this is that $2M was raised through crowd funding Christian groups for Folau to fight his case and speak up for 'religious freedom' and then he settled the case with an apology for all the hurt he caused and kept all the settlement money.

Semantics aside, he won his case with Aus RU and was paid out.

The post I was responded to was alluding to him not being paid by anyone.

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25 minutes ago, gingerjon said:

The statement says family issues *and* covid restrictions in France.

I'm offering him as much sympathy for his position as he deserves.

I hope that you never sit on my jury then.

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Sport, amongst other things, is a dream-world offering escape from harsh reality and the disturbing prospect of change.

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33 minutes ago, Blind side johnny said:

I hope that you never sit on my jury then.

I would behave in a just manner. I’m capable of doing that.

But no crocodile tears from me for our committed Christian “friend”.

Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. (Terry Pratchett)

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4 hours ago, barnyia said:

I reckon the club are seeing what happens with the start of the season and if crowds are allowed back before deciding if they can afford to keep him or not. He's on big wages and theyre stuck with Kasiano who is now fully paid by the dragons and not helped by the storm. 

I see some truth in that. 

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57 minutes ago, Lowdesert said:

Semantics aside, he won his case with Aus RU and was paid out.

The post I was responded to was alluding to him not being paid by anyone.

to be fair its not semantics.. he settled he didnt win.. You have to make a judgement call on whether it would cost you more to fight it (and still potentially lose) than it would just to pay them to go away.. Insurance companies make those decisions all the time. it is not an admission of guilt. 

In the same way you could say he lost because he didnt get all the $14m he was suing for. 

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11 minutes ago, gingerjon said:

I would behave in a just manner. I’m capable of doing that.

But no crocodile tears from me for our committed Christian “friend”.

If you don't care about Christianity, why bother about a claim that people might go 'to Hell'.

If critics of him do not believe in a non existent place or hurt, then on what basis do they say he has done something wrong.

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Hard to comment on Folau threads without seemingly like a sympathiser. I'm not to be clear - I completely disagree with his 'beliefs'. 

But once again many on here appear to have their moral compasses dictated to them by the media reaction rather than their own views. Surely we've accepted worse behaving players recently, but without the media fanfare it goes by relatively unnoticed in comparison? 

For anyone who might be unsure what i'm referring to (I wouldn't blame you as the media seemed to let this one slide), Leeds Rhinos recently signed Zane Tetevano - convicted of beating his girlfriend on at least 4 separate occasions and initially handed a 9 month prison sentence. I challenge anybody to justify why Folau gets treated worse for his 'belief' system than an actual criminal other than the fact he's significantly more famous?  

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13 minutes ago, RP London said:

to be fair its not semantics.. he settled he didnt win.. You have to make a judgement call on whether it would cost you more to fight it (and still potentially lose) than it would just to pay them to go away.. Insurance companies make those decisions all the time. it is not an admission of guilt. 

In the same way you could say he lost because he didnt get all the $14m he was suing for. 

Don’t you mean what Aus RU made to settle with him?  He wasn’t in control of the money.

Either way my point was regarding his payment though and the salary he had been paid v Catalans.

Disappointing if Folau, who accepted an improved offer mid 2020, is acting stupid again.  Most likely NRL.

 

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3 minutes ago, hunsletgreenandgold said:

Hard to comment on Folau threads without seemingly like a sympathiser. I'm not to be clear - I completely disagree with his 'beliefs'. 

But once again many on here appear to have their moral compasses dictated to them by the media reaction rather than their own views. Surely we've accepted worse behaving players recently, but without the media fanfare it goes by relatively unnoticed in comparison? 

For anyone who might be unsure what i'm referring to (I wouldn't blame you as the media seemed to let this one slide), Leeds Rhinos recently Zane Tetevano - convicted of beating his girlfriend on at least 4 separate occasions and initially handed a 9 month prison sentence. I challenge anybody to justify why Folau gets treated worse for his 'belief' system than an actual criminal other than the fact he's significantly more famous?  

I'm not sure how you are able to state that?

On what basis are you just labeling people sheep? People are more than capable of making their own minds up about things. 

Awareness of things is a different point to people not making their own minds up.

 

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12 minutes ago, hunsletgreenandgold said:

But once again many on here appear to have their moral compasses dictated to them by the media reaction rather than their own views.

Nope. I have my own moral compass, dictated by my own sense of right and wrong.

And I feel compelled to point out that this is in contrast to (as an example) Israel Folau who has his moral compass dictated to him by a book written by a stone age civilisation. 

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25 minutes ago, Lowdesert said:

Don’t you mean what Aus RU made to settle with him?  He wasn’t in control of the money.

 

 

Sorry i dont understand your point here... Aus RU settled with him.. he was in control and could have said no he wanted to fight it but he chose not to have his day in court (maybe because he knew he was on shaky ground) and Aus RU chose not to fight it in court either (probably for similar reasons). The choice to settle is made between the 2 parties, no one is "made" to settle they chose to and they are happy otherwise they carry on with the court action.

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8 minutes ago, Dunbar said:

Nope. I have my own moral compass, dictated by my own sense of right and wrong.

And I feel compelled to point out that this is in contrast to (as an example) Israel Folau who has his moral compass dictated to him by a book written by a stone age civilisation. 

I would consider you to be one of the few I don't include in the term 'many'. I stand by my original comments. 

 

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4 minutes ago, RP London said:

Sorry i dont understand your point here... Aus RU settled with him.. he was in control and could have said no he wanted to fight it but he chose not to have his day in court (maybe because he knew he was on shaky ground) and Aus RU chose not to fight it in court either (probably for similar reasons). The choice to settle is made between the 2 parties, no one is "made" to settle the chose to and they are happy otherwise they carry on with the court action.

Exactly. And the point I was making (which is where I get my frustration from with Folau) is that he raised money to have that fight on behalf of people who felt their religious freedoms were under attack. But after taking that money for legal fees he decided to settle and not stand up for what he said he was fighting for.

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On the one hand, its not surprising to see an Australian with a family struggling to see reasons to return to Europe right now. Leeds released Ava Seumanafagai on that principle (though only once they had secured a replacement in Tetevano). And all clubs that have commented have said how difficult recruiting from the NRL has been due to the Covid situation here. 

On the other hand, Folau certainly owes Catalans one and not responding to communications as "reported" is not a good look at all.

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30 minutes ago, Dave T said:

I'm not sure how you are able to state that?

On what basis are you just labeling people sheep? People are more than capable of making their own minds up about things. 

Awareness of things is a different point to people not making their own minds up.

 

Any thoughts on why Folau gets targeted as much as he does then, Dave? 

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1 minute ago, hunsletgreenandgold said:

 

Any thoughts on why Folau gets targeted as much as he does then, Dave? 

Because he is a huge name in both codes of Rugby. 

But that isn't what I have an issue with, it is the point that people aren't making their own judgements. 

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1 minute ago, hunsletgreenandgold said:

 

Any thoughts on why Folau gets targeted as much as he does then, Dave? 

Probably because in a largely agnostic/atheistic liberal society claiming certain people are going to go to hell and are the reason why a nation suffers disasters is not very popular?

Even Jesus said let he who is without sin cast the first stone.

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41 minutes ago, hunsletgreenandgold said:

Hard to comment on Folau threads without seemingly like a sympathiser. I'm not to be clear - I completely disagree with his 'beliefs'. 

But once again many on here appear to have their moral compasses dictated to them by the media reaction rather than their own views. Surely we've accepted worse behaving players recently, but without the media fanfare it goes by relatively unnoticed in comparison? 

For anyone who might be unsure what i'm referring to (I wouldn't blame you as the media seemed to let this one slide), Leeds Rhinos recently signed Zane Tetevano - convicted of beating his girlfriend on at least 4 separate occasions and initially handed a 9 month prison sentence. I challenge anybody to justify why Folau gets treated worse for his 'belief' system than an actual criminal other than the fact he's significantly more famous?  

The problem with this stance is that those who are against Folau's behaviour appear to be judged as sheep unable to make their own mind up, but those who don't criticise him obviously are far too smart to have their moral compass dictated by the media.

Do you see why people have issue with this stance? It is extremely arrogant and condescending. Whether you meant it like that or not.

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43 minutes ago, hunsletgreenandgold said:

For anyone who might be unsure what i'm referring to (I wouldn't blame you as the media seemed to let this one slide), Leeds Rhinos recently signed Zane Tetevano - convicted of beating his girlfriend on at least 4 separate occasions and initially handed a 9 month prison sentence. I challenge anybody to justify why Folau gets treated worse for his 'belief' system than an actual criminal other than the fact he's significantly more famous?  

And having already signed Robert Lui. 

The sport should have a definite code of conduct and decide what is and isn't acceptable. They "banned" Ben Barba while others continue to play having done the same/similar.

How many drink drivers do we tolerate, or those with any criminal record for that matter?

When do we consider a person redeemed or actually sorry for what they have done?

(Folau's stupidity in posting what he did, when we're all aware some more in the sport will agree with him, is quite amazing.)

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1 minute ago, RigbyLuger said:

And having already signed Robert Lui. 

The sport should have a definite code of conduct and decide what is and isn't acceptable. They "banned" Ben Barba while others continue to play having done the same/similar.

How many drink drivers do we tolerate, or those with any criminal record for that matter?

When do we consider a person redeemed or actually sorry for what they have done?

(Folau's stupidity in posting what he did, when we're all aware some more in the sport will agree with him, is quite amazing.)

I don't particularly disagree, but I do think it becomes problematic. I think we have to let the legal systems do their work and each club needs to make their own decisions on things like this - they then are answerable to their own supporters and shareholders.

But I do share some sympathy with the view that it can harm the overall comp and therefore the comp should have rules, I just think it opens a can of worms. I don't think the NRL have done too good a job trying to police this.

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5 minutes ago, Dave T said:

The problem with this stance is that those who are against Folau's behaviour appear to be judged as sheep unable to make their own mind up, but those who don't criticise him obviously are far too smart to have their moral compass dictated by the media.

Do you see why people have issue with this stance? It is extremely arrogant and condescending. Whether you meant it like that or not.

That wasn't what I was saying. I didn't say people were sheep for their views on Folau, more the fact they have a view is because the media decide (dictate) he is newsworthy and therefore run stories scrutinising every aspect of his being. Meanwhile we've just had somebody who's actually convicted of serious offences signed into the league and because the media have deemed, in their view, it not being a matter of interest, then it'll go by unchallenged. 

That does not sit right with me. I judge based on the action not the hype. 

 

 

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1 hour ago, gingerjon said:

I would behave in a just manner. I’m capable of doing that.

But no crocodile tears from me for our committed Christian “friend”.

I was going to post a relatively considered piece.... but you have it more than covered throughout this thread..... 

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26 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

Probably because in a largely agnostic/atheistic liberal society claiming certain people are going to go to hell and are the reason why a nation suffers disasters is not very popular?

Even Jesus said let he who is without sin cast the first stone.

Don't disagree with that. I thought liberals weren't keen on wife beaters either? 

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