Our League streaming figures

[Sir Kevin Sinfield]

6 hours ago, Spidey said:

No matter what the price was RL fans would want it cheaper it’s always the way

I agree, but I also don’t see the point in increasing the price to £10 on the day, I bet virtually nobody signed up on the day, I understand they want sales before matchday and think the price of £4.95 early bird is fine, but increase it by £1 or £2 on the day not £5.05 which more than doubles the price.

[Ivarr the Boneless]

Most football lower level league and top level non league teams who declared viewing figures were typically massively below their average gates. Finger in the air, 10-25% of an average gate.

It was raising so little money that  some non league clubs gave free coverage, thinking the fan engagement retained was worth the financial write off.

 

[Spidey]

44 minutes ago, Sir Kevin Sinfield said:

I agree, but I also don’t see the point in increasing the price to £10 on the day, I bet virtually nobody signed up on the day, I understand they want sales before matchday and think the price of £4.95 early bird is fine, but increase it by £1 or £2 on the day not £5.05 which more than doubles the price.

Or sign up in advance and get it half price

£10 is fine. Maybe the early bird should have been £7

[Man of Kent]

The rumour is around 25,000 have bought Our League streams so far . That's in total (including testimonials etc.) not per match. I believe there have been eight PPV streams so far.

The two Bradford games are each said to be in the thousands.

[OriginalMrC]

Are people seriously saying £10 is too much to watch their team? £5 early bird and £10 on the day is spot on I reckon. Its great value in comparison to many other entertainment mediums. 

I guess if many people think £10 is steep therein lies the problem with streaming and why it will never take off 

[Hela Wigmen]

13 minutes ago, OriginalMrC said:

Are people seriously saying £10 is too much to watch their team? £5 early bird and £10 on the day is spot on I reckon. Its great value in comparison to many other entertainment mediums. 

I guess if many people think £10 is steep therein lies the problem with streaming and why it will never take off 

Therein lies the problem with Rugby League in this country. I know plenty who didn’t buy World Cup tickets because they’re expecting them to be reduced. 

 

[Southerner]

20 minutes ago, OriginalMrC said:

Are people seriously saying £10 is too much to watch their team? £5 early bird and £10 on the day is spot on I reckon. Its great value in comparison to many other entertainment mediums. 

I guess if many people think £10 is steep therein lies the problem with streaming and why it will never take off 

Not necessarily watching “their” team though. I might want to watch several matches in a weekend!

[Hela Wigmen]

1 minute ago, Southerner said:

Not necessarily watching “their” team though. I might want to watch several matches in a weekend!

That’s why The RFL have made a day pass for Rd. 1 of the Championship. 

[Sir Kevin Sinfield]

24 minutes ago, OriginalMrC said:

Are people seriously saying £10 is too much to watch their team? £5 early bird and £10 on the day is spot on I reckon. Its great value in comparison to many other entertainment mediums. 

I guess if many people think £10 is steep therein lies the problem with streaming and why it will never take off 

It’s the doubling in price from early bird to on the day price that I think is a mistake and will result in less sales overall, as virtually nobody will sign up on the day 

[sentoffagain2]

1 hour ago, Sir Kevin Sinfield said:

I agree, but I also don’t see the point in increasing the price to £10 on the day, I bet virtually nobody signed up on the day, I understand they want sales before matchday and think the price of £4.95 early bird is fine, but increase it by £1 or £2 on the day not £5.05 which more than doubles the price.

  I agree £4.95 rising to £6.95 on game day seems ok.

[creditwhereitsdews]

The current pricing is more than fair.

[Ramon Rojo]

17 hours ago, Harry Stottle said:

Our League are already committed to turning up and screening the game the cost involved to them will remain the same for broadcasting and the automated selling of passes so why risk turning away customers by inflating the price on the day, I can't see the sense in it but I am always willing to learn if someone would advise me.

It's called pushing the boundaries in the pursuit of inflated profit

In other words, capitalism Rugby League style.

The fabric of our society is based upon it

[gingerjon]

16 hours ago, OriginalMrC said:

Are people seriously saying £10 is too much to watch their team?

They are.

They seriously are.

And will later moan that rugby league is skint.

[Whippet13]

The pricing is about right for a friendly, great value for a League game.

It's amazing value if you watch it with your partner, immediate family or (when allowed) friends.

I'll be taking in several as a neutral to watch my favourite Championship & League 1 teams once the competitive games are underway.

[Whippet13]

16 hours ago, Hela Wigmen said:

Therein lies the problem with Rugby League in this country. I know plenty who didn’t buy World Cup tickets because they’re expecting them to be reduced. 

 

They wont be, it is a strategy the RLWC organisers have said for a long time will not be followed.

I've been stung by this RFL in the past, it really cheesed me off and I spend a lot of money following RL. To be fair to the the RFL though, they seem to have learnt their lesson as I've not seen major discounts or freebie handouts since the Catalans Wembley fiasco. It's a legacy that still weighs on the game, which shows how damaging it was.

[RP London]

16 hours ago, OriginalMrC said:

Are people seriously saying £10 is too much to watch their team? £5 early bird and £10 on the day is spot on I reckon. Its great value in comparison to many other entertainment mediums. 

I guess if many people think £10 is steep therein lies the problem with streaming and why it will never take off 

There is a problem with streaming about how much it costs compared to the alternative or to "what you would expect" in normality.. 

A good example being something like Amazon Prime or Rakuten.. I would pay £3.95 to watch a movie in the house, and I do. I am not too happy to pay £14.95 to rent a movie even if it is "just out" (Wonder Woman 1984 for example). Mainly because that is how much it would cost in the cinema and i am not getting the cinema experience at home. (I know the cinema isnt open but it will be and I am sure they will show this when they can). However, IF the whole family want to watch it then it is good value because taking 2 adults and 2 kids to the cinema to watch it is really quite expensive. 

So now you come to the conundrum of streaming. Do you price it for the 1 person at home watching it on their own at which point £10 could be seen as steep as you dont get the rest of the atmosphere etc. In normal times you can do this because that person will probably get their mates around and therefore it becomes a cheaper option for a "cheaper experience". Normal times i think personally this is quite cheap.

However, now hit today.. the conundrum changes a bit as people are stuck at home.. so, do you work on the fact that people will pay the price because they really want to see their club, or do you work on the fact it needs to be cheaper as this "invite the mates around" option has gone.. If the quality is good I think you can get away with charging more as people will see it as helping the clubs out at a time when they cannot get money through the gates etc, but if the quality is poor people will complain. 

Is £10 too much to watch your team play? probably not. If you are just a "channel hopping" viewer then yes it absolutely is.. so what do you do? do you aim for getting more people at a lower price to watch or do you aim it at trying to make as much from the "die hards" that will watch? I dont know 100% but i would say right now potentially they havent got the balance right, there are sunk costs but i dont see those costs rising if more people are watching. I tend to think that £5 for 1 match is about right so £4.50 and £6.50 would probably work as the differences quite well. you may well get people tuning in for random games more and therefore make more money, but also have more "fans" at the end of this. 

We also have to remember that with streaming comes a less "heartland" based supporter base potentially. People are looking for entertainment now that they have binged the whole of netflix. If the RFL got this right they could expand the games footprint without doing much. Continue to stream post lockdown and those outside the heartlands that have no way of getting to games can watch "their team" every weekend (sell as a club season ticket streaming or something). Use the "new normal" to our advantage... (oh and internationals on FTA TV on a regular basis ffs!!).

There is potential here.. and I think the cheaper end could actually help this. The pricing structure can then change when fans are allowed back in. Use now to make some money and cover costs hopefully but to also develop something that can be "revolutionary" in terms of the game's profile..

 

Anyway, rant and brain splurge over.

[Dave T]

1 hour ago, RP London said:

There is a problem with streaming about how much it costs compared to the alternative or to "what you would expect" in normality.. 

A good example being something like Amazon Prime or Rakuten.. I would pay £3.95 to watch a movie in the house, and I do. I am not too happy to pay £14.95 to rent a movie even if it is "just out" (Wonder Woman 1984 for example). Mainly because that is how much it would cost in the cinema and i am not getting the cinema experience at home. (I know the cinema isnt open but it will be and I am sure they will show this when they can). However, IF the whole family want to watch it then it is good value because taking 2 adults and 2 kids to the cinema to watch it is really quite expensive. 

So now you come to the conundrum of streaming. Do you price it for the 1 person at home watching it on their own at which point £10 could be seen as steep as you dont get the rest of the atmosphere etc. In normal times you can do this because that person will probably get their mates around and therefore it becomes a cheaper option for a "cheaper experience". Normal times i think personally this is quite cheap.

However, now hit today.. the conundrum changes a bit as people are stuck at home.. so, do you work on the fact that people will pay the price because they really want to see their club, or do you work on the fact it needs to be cheaper as this "invite the mates around" option has gone.. If the quality is good I think you can get away with charging more as people will see it as helping the clubs out at a time when they cannot get money through the gates etc, but if the quality is poor people will complain. 

Is £10 too much to watch your team play? probably not. If you are just a "channel hopping" viewer then yes it absolutely is.. so what do you do? do you aim for getting more people at a lower price to watch or do you aim it at trying to make as much from the "die hards" that will watch? I dont know 100% but i would say right now potentially they havent got the balance right, there are sunk costs but i dont see those costs rising if more people are watching. I tend to think that £5 for 1 match is about right so £4.50 and £6.50 would probably work as the differences quite well. you may well get people tuning in for random games more and therefore make more money, but also have more "fans" at the end of this. 

We also have to remember that with streaming comes a less "heartland" based supporter base potentially. People are looking for entertainment now that they have binged the whole of netflix. If the RFL got this right they could expand the games footprint without doing much. Continue to stream post lockdown and those outside the heartlands that have no way of getting to games can watch "their team" every weekend (sell as a club season ticket streaming or something). Use the "new normal" to our advantage... (oh and internationals on FTA TV on a regular basis ffs!!).

There is potential here.. and I think the cheaper end could actually help this. The pricing structure can then change when fans are allowed back in. Use now to make some money and cover costs hopefully but to also develop something that can be "revolutionary" in terms of the game's profile..

 

Anyway, rant and brain splurge over.

I think the risk of making the on-the-day price close to the pre-order price is that more people will just wait and see as it isn't a deterrent. They clearly want people to buy in and commit, and this is because people will inevitably find that they can't be bothered on the day, or other things come up - but that money is banked with pre-pay. You probably also have logistical challenges around people just booking at the last minute etc. 

I'd like to think we have evidence of better sales results through encouraging pre-pay.

On your 2nd paragraph - this isn't about channel hoppers - nobody is stumbling across this, you are being targeted and having to go and find it. 

I think a fiver is great value. A tenner is fine, and I'd pay it for something I really wanted to watch - but the difference between the two is enough to make me buy in advance, which is the ultimate aim. 

Some people will be put off by even a fiver, that's life unfortunately.

[Southerner]

Interesting how the boxing PPV had an increased price on the day of the fight which has now been removed!!

They’ve obviously realised it’s counterproductive. 

[Harry Stottle]

1 hour ago, Whippet13 said:

They wont be, it is a strategy the RLWC organisers have said for a long time will not be followed.

Lets see what happens shall we....! 

The 2013 WC was lauded for it's attendances in nearly all the venue's it was played at, many attendees on reduced face value admission, the ongoing purchases may or may not amend the stratergy you quote Mr Whippet, will the urge as previously employed revert to - is it better to have 50% of something than 100% of nothing considering each seat in every stadium has already been paid for by the RFL.

[RP London]

2 minutes ago, Dave T said:

I think the risk of making the on-the-day price close to the pre-order price is that more people will just wait and see as it isn't a deterrent. They clearly want people to buy in and commit, and this is because people will inevitably find that they can't be bothered on the day, or other things come up - but that money is banked with pre-pay. You probably also have logistical challenges around people just booking at the last minute etc. 

I'd like to think we have evidence of better sales results through encouraging pre-pay.

On your 2nd paragraph - this isn't about channel hoppers - nobody is stumbling across this, you are being targeted and having to go and find it. 

I think a fiver is great value. A tenner is fine, and I'd pay it for something I really wanted to watch - but the difference between the two is enough to make me buy in advance, which is the ultimate aim. 

Some people will be put off by even a fiver, that's life unfortunately.

I agree with the Channel hoppers when you are looking at Our league as its a target but i was talking more in general as they should be looking to do something outside of Our league at which point you would be surprised at the "channel hopping" done by people searching for content through you tube etc and how it can link through to the tv (my search on my tv also shows me You Tube results for what i am searching for etc). 

I think the key is that £10 for something you "want to watch" is fine, i dont disagree, but that was my point on just getting die hards. I will pay £10 for a Warrington match but if I find i am at a loose end am I going to pay £10 for huddersfield v wakefield.. probably not £5 yes probably would.. so who do you want watching, smaller numbers of die hards paying more or potentially more people paying less.. its a tough choice as i said but IMHO this is where more for less may well be a good argument (unlike other times where the more people you have the more cost there is etc). 

If you can plan ahead yes you can save money, and many will do that and that is fine, 1/2 price though seems steep with any sort of thing like that, its not normally a 50% saving. This isnt a case of "is it worth putting on" so get pre sells to cover costs, they are there anyway. This is where i think the issues is.. £5 pre sell yes.. £10 main price no.. it just seems wrong. In terms of logistical issues about people booking at the time, get the systems sorted then to be honest.. they are all there there are loads of companies that do this sort of thing (flash sales on sites etc) that the proprietary software is available.. that IMHO is no real excuse for this disparity. 

Yes people will think £5 is too much but that isnt what we are saying.. £5 is a fair price, £10 I think is a bit steep but more importantly the differential seems harsh.. we may also seem more people paying a lower price (£6.50 say) that you actually make more out of it while getting more coverage. 

I know you are saying that the differential is good to make you pay in advance but if I am not sure whether i will get a chance to watch it (for whatever reason) i am still not going to just throw £5 away potentially but the £10, rather than making think i will pay in advance "just in case", may make me think stuff it i just wont watch it... and that is surely not what we are aiming for.

[gingerjon]

We're all at the guessing stage now.

Let's see how things look when (if) viewing figures are released.

[Sir Kevin Sinfield]

2 hours ago, gingerjon said:

They are.

They seriously are.

And will later moan that rugby league is skint.

I have no issue with the price. It’s the doubling in price for people who sign up on match day that’s simply bad business, nobody will sign up on match day, we’re missing out on potential sales. If I have a spare few hours I’d consider signing up to games last minute, but not when I know the price has doubled. Do any clubs double admission prices on match day? No, it’s a terrible strategy that will bring in less money to the sport.

[Sir Kevin Sinfield]

26 minutes ago, Dave T said:

I think the risk of making the on-the-day price close to the pre-order price is that more people will just wait and see as it isn't a deterrent. They clearly want people to buy in and commit, and this is because people will inevitably find that they can't be bothered on the day, or other things come up - but that money is banked with pre-pay. You probably also have logistical challenges around people just booking at the last minute etc. 

 

I agree but that can be done without doubling the price. Most clubs admission prices are more on match day compared to pre game day sales, but they go up approximately 10% in price they don’t double in price.

[RP London]

8 minutes ago, gingerjon said:

We're all at the guessing stage now.

Let's see how things look when (if) viewing figures are released.

true..

I'm thinking more of the fact that this could be something we see rolled out more if they got the offering right... for example i could be very interested in streaming every single Warrington home match that isnt on the telebox.. if they offered it in the right way as my ability to get across the pennines is limited but it would allow me to show support, put money into the club etc.. 

How many more people are there like me across the country, how many could there be etc if this was done right rather than what looks a little arbitrary. 

 

[Dave T]

11 minutes ago, Sir Kevin Sinfield said:

I have no issue with the price. It’s the doubling in price for people who sign up on match day that’s simply bad business, nobody will sign up on match day, we’re missing out on potential sales. If I have a spare few hours I’d consider signing up to games last minute, but not when I know the price has doubled. Do any clubs double admission prices on match day? No, it’s a terrible strategy that will bring in less money to the sport.

You can't state that last line categorically. 

The benefits from banking those early bird sales may far outweigh a few casual viewers the doubling puts off. 

If they have deemed getting people signed up in advance as important, it could be perfect pricing.