IMG Grading Unveiled

[steve oates]

5 minutes ago, redjonn said:

What I had hoped was that IMG would bring in their marketing capabilities, skills and knowledge to initially grow what we have. 

My good friend, you heavily overestimate consultants, and you do people in the game no favours like Mr. Hetherington.

That IMG are on pay by results only shows that the club owners who all have very successful careers in business don't themselves hold out any idea IMG will change anything for the good of the game.

[Dovster]

28 minutes ago, steve oates said:

But the club owners and fans know the game has reached it's ceiling because this last 20 odd years has involved potential new clubs looking to form teams that could grow into Superleague clubs. None worked.........

With respect you give these IMG people far too much Kudos. How are they going to identify anywhere where RL can be developed to the level of the Superleague clubs? We have people in the game like Gary Hetherington who has been there and tried that. but more than that what do IMg know about Rugby League?

Absolutely nothing, which is why they are just mucking about hoping for a few quid with this A-B-C rubbish.

I disgree regarding reaching our ceiling. For eg I don't think that Leigh or Hull KR think they have reached their ceiling. A lot of clubs are doing things to improve attendances, sponsership etc.

I agree the jury is still out regarding IMG.

I do believe that given the right conditions and approach expansion is still possible. After all RL is such a great sport it must be possible.

[gingerjon]

36 minutes ago, redjonn said:

For whatever reason we seemed to have pinned our hopes on the A, B, C ofsted approach.

That's just what the media, bloggers and forums have chosen to focus on.

Some of us (me, it was me) said that that would be the case.

[Angelic Cynic]

43 minutes ago, redjonn said:

What I had hoped was that IMG would bring in their marketing capabilities, skills and knowledge to initially grow what we have.  That is the basic investment in marketing that prevented the game in its current guise to reach its ceiling. 

Once we start to hit the ceiling then was the time to begin investing in expansion beyond its current footprint. This of course meaning all clubs taking less central funding to reallocate to that expansion plan.

For whatever reason we seemed to have pinned our hopes on the A, B, C ofsted approach.

They haven't started to market the current World Club Champions, St Helens.

If St Helens are the blueprint,and their biennial Academy side trips to the NRL is the way ahead - then that should be the way all clubs are directed.

How can they hope to achieve higher armchair follower figures if the product on the field,put together by a lower standard of coach and player,is just ignored while they expect clubs without finances to bother with stuff outside the requirements of improving on-field standards.

The Theatre Of The Absurd is here,now,while soccer has more and more USA owners of clubs, ( despite or because of promotion/relegation ) and the owner of St Helens discusses both rugby codes joining together. 

[The Rocket]

18 minutes ago, Angelic Cynic said:

,while soccer has more and more USA owners of clubs,

Let`s hope it`s catching, a few U.S. owners of Super League clubs probably wouldn`t go astray either.

[RP London]

Just now, Derwent Parker said:

Been called a lot of things but not uppity [I have now] but I am Northern and anti-woke so you can call me what you want I dont care.

Its the debate I care about.

Again you are Part right & wrong with your statement on invitations.

Every league is technically an invitation league, no team/club has a given right to be in a league just because they exist, the leagues are run by organisations that invite you to take part - YES, but that is entry to the RFL not to a certain league within.

Toronto, Cornwall etc, got entry to RFL- but had/have to work their way to the Top via P&R.

RFL/SL did not invite them straight into SL.

The only planned difference to this is if any team Gains an "A" Grade they will go straight in to SL from wherever they currently are. For example

So if Tottenham are allowed/invited in to the RFL and play at Spurs new ground with guaranteed Season Ticket sales of Thousands and Squillion's in the bank and half of Aussie an GB national teams signed up - chances are they will be an "A"  and might jump the queue?

Going back to your previous post - If SL minimum standards are "A" - then "B"s cannot be in it - therefore for now SL minimum standards are "B"  - Until they are ALL "A"s

 

There is nothing new in what you have said so I refer you back to my other posts for answers to everything you have put.. your use of examples is the only bit new but again already answered.. you just want an argument but its already all there so pointless to just write it again.

[David Dockhouse Host]

Meet the owners

The Cougars are back

 

 

 

[Big Picture]

2 hours ago, Dovster said:

It is hard to disagree with most of what you say. I suppose the only point is that if RL stays in a small geographical area it will eventually reach its ceiling amd IMG will know this.. Perhaps IMG can help bring in a successful strategy for growth outside of the north of England and raise the standards within our current playing areas.

Eventually reach its ceiling????  FYI the game has already reached the ceiling of what it can achieve with its little regional so-called "Super" League.  Wakefield's Michael Carter recently told the media that Sky has told them the audience is stagnant.  When Eric Pérez said at the start of the Toronto venture that the game had maxed out the revenues available in its heartland and needed to expand further afield, he was right.

The blunt truth is that the traditional clubs in those smallish, unfashionable towns don't rate well on TV and that's why the last TV contract was for so much less than before.  The idea that the game is strong in its heartland as @steve oatesand some others here think is dead wrong, in truth the game is weak even in its heartland.

I think you can forget the idea that IMG can help bring in a successful strategy for growth outside the north of England, the failure of dozens of expansion ventures over several decades shows that in its current guise the game doesn't have enough appeal to outsiders for expansion to work and needs a whole different approach.

[John Drake]

Various posts removed.

Please don't insult each other.

Or reply to insulting posts.

Just report them and move on.

Thanks.

[Oxford]

3 hours ago, Dovster said:

If by divided you mean a wide ranging number of opinions on the subject. I agree

Well no, I didn't mean that Dovster, but thanks for asking.

 

1 hour ago, Big Picture said:

Eventually reach its ceiling????  FYI the game has already reached the ceiling of what it can achieve with its little regional so-called "Super" League.  Wakefield's Michael Carter recently told the media that Sky has told them the audience is stagnant.  When Eric Pérez said at the start of the Toronto venture that the game had maxed out the revenues available in its heartland and needed to expand further afield, he was right.

The blunt truth is that the traditional clubs in those smallish, unfashionable towns don't rate well on TV and that's why the last TV contract was for so much less than before.  The idea that the game is strong in its heartland as @steve oatesand some others here think is dead wrong, in truth the game is weak even in its heartland.

I think you can forget the idea that IMG can help bring in a successful strategy for growth outside the north of England, the failure of dozens of expansion ventures over several decades shows that in its current guise the game doesn't have enough appeal to outsiders for expansion to work and needs a whole different approach.

Can't agree with you here BP.

 

 

[Oxford]

2 hours ago, The Rocket said:

a few U.S. owners of Super League clubs

I think the assumption that americans would make good owners for RL organisations leaves a bit to be desired.

Unless you just mean people so rich they wouldn't mind handing over their cash and then keep their noses out.

[dkw]

7 hours ago, Chrispmartha said:

They’re really starting to embarrass themselves now.

I realise they are trying an April fools joke but still…

 

 

[RP London]

6 minutes ago, dkw said:

 

Thats brilliant trolling!!

[GUBRATS]

5 hours ago, Big Picture said:

Eventually reach its ceiling????  FYI the game has already reached the ceiling of what it can achieve with its little regional so-called "Super" League.  Wakefield's Michael Carter recently told the media that Sky has told them the audience is stagnant.  When Eric Pérez said at the start of the Toronto venture that the game had maxed out the revenues available in its heartland and needed to expand further afield, he was right.

The blunt truth is that the traditional clubs in those smallish, unfashionable towns don't rate well on TV and that's why the last TV contract was for so much less than before.  The idea that the game is strong in its heartland as @steve oatesand some others here think is dead wrong, in truth the game is weak even in its heartland.

I think you can forget the idea that IMG can help bring in a successful strategy for growth outside the north of England, the failure of dozens of expansion ventures over several decades shows that in its current guise the game doesn't have enough appeal to outsiders for expansion to work and needs a whole different approach.

Then the game is over 

[Oxford]

7 hours ago, redjonn said:

What I had hoped was that IMG would bring in their marketing capabilities, skills and knowledge to initially grow what we have.  That is the basic investment in marketing that prevented the game in its current guise to reach its ceiling. 

Once we start to hit the ceiling then was the time to begin investing in expansion beyond its current footprint. This of course meaning all clubs taking less central funding to reallocate to that expansion plan.

For whatever reason we seemed to have pinned our hopes on the A, B, C ofsted approach.

Spot on redjohn no one needs the first Ofsted never mind another.  IMG could have provided the list and said this is what's needed but I think certain clubs wanted the to provide assurances for those sides they felt brought more away fans etc. so this convoluted method of protection.

 

[Big Picture]

3 hours ago, GUBRATS said:

Then the game is over 

John Kear did say in an interview a few years ago (I think it was with the BBC but I'm not 100% certain) that there might not be any pro RL in Britain in 10-20 years.  If something doesn't change that might well come to pass.

[RP London]

36 minutes ago, Big Picture said:

John Kear did say in an interview a few years ago (I think it was with the BBC but I'm not 100% certain) that there might not be any pro RL in Britain in 10-20 years.  If something doesn't change that might well come to pass.

Indeed... hence, things are changing. 

[Big Picture]

34 minutes ago, RP London said:

Indeed... hence, things are changing. 

Time will tell what IMG is able to change.  I predict that you and plenty of others will be disappointed with how little they're able to accomplish given how little they have to work with.

[Dovster]

18 hours ago, Big Picture said:

Eventually reach its ceiling????  FYI the game has already reached the ceiling of what it can achieve with its little regional so-called "Super" League.  Wakefield's Michael Carter recently told the media that Sky has told them the audience is stagnant.  When Eric Pérez said at the start of the Toronto venture that the game had maxed out the revenues available in its heartland and needed to expand further afield, he was right.

The blunt truth is that the traditional clubs in those smallish, unfashionable towns don't rate well on TV and that's why the last TV contract was for so much less than before.  The idea that the game is strong in its heartland as @steve oatesand some others here think is dead wrong, in truth the game is weak even in its heartland.

I think you can forget the idea that IMG can help bring in a successful strategy for growth outside the north of England, the failure of dozens of expansion ventures over several decades shows that in its current guise the game doesn't have enough appeal to outsiders for expansion to work and needs a whole different approach.

Your opinions are very negative and really paint a very bleak outlook.

I do think the game is in a battle for eyes and hearts, this is known by the RFL and indeed the reason for IMG getting involved. We do need the right decisions to be made.

The North of England is a highly populated area and we certainly haven't reached everyone yet. If we can successfully grow and consolidate here, I feel we can still expand on this success.

I really hope that my future is right and yours is wrong. I know you must feel the same.

[Tommygilf]

3 minutes ago, Dovster said:

The North of England is a highly populated area and we certainly haven't reached everyone yet. If we can successfully grow and consolidate here, I feel we can still expand on this success.

Whilst I agree with a lot of the sentiment, I think this a flaw in thinking because of what influences the North of England. Its not a region that exists in a vacuum. Whilst there are lots of people here, a large percentage of them aren't necessarily from here, or take their cultural cues from elsewhere. 

Consolidation in the North of England means being more popular across the whole of Britain imo.

[Dovster]

23 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

Whilst I agree with a lot of the sentiment, I think this a flaw in thinking because of what influences the North of England. Its not a region that exists in a vacuum. Whilst there are lots of people here, a large percentage of them aren't necessarily from here, or take their cultural cues from elsewhere. 

Consolidation in the North of England means being more popular across the whole of Britain imo.

We obviously disagree slightly in our thinking of the best way forward.

I see this as an issue and an opportunity. Our clubs need to find ways to engage with more people and diversify within their local communities. I am not sure of the current level of effort in this area.

[Harry Stottle]

On 31/03/2023 at 18:57, Oxford said:

Aren't all thoughts yours and no one else's unless you belong to the Borg Collective.

He actually got some likes so, there were others on his same wavelength, not enough I expect to thrn a majority decision though.

[Harry Stottle]

On 01/04/2023 at 09:27, Tommygilf said:

Without automatic P/R Leigh replaced Toronto (and were chosen ahead of Toulouse).

As a fan I never wanted that Toulouse was my choice to be promoted, who knows what would have happened had that been the case, they would have gone down I expect, but would they have come back up if Leigh had still gone down the same recruitment path?

[Harry Stottle]

22 hours ago, Dovster said:

It is hard to disagree with most of what you say. I suppose the only point is that if RL stays in a small geographical area it will eventually reach its ceiling amd IMG will know this.. Perhaps IMG can help bring in a successful strategy for growth outside of the north of England and raise the standards within our current playing areas.

Reach its ceiling? What is the target audience in the heartlands?

Many years ago a wise old sales manager said to me, depending on prospective customers that can possibly be converted in any given area what is the point of moving further afield till those have been exhausted?

IMG I am informed are the Guru's of bringing new audiences to their given project, in the "small geographical area" of just Gtr Manchester and West Yorkshire alone behind every door of every house there are over 6million prospective R'ses that can be put on seats in the stadium or sat in front of the telly watching the game, now will someone tell me why the need is to branch out until a concerted effort has been undertaken to entice these prospective customers in?

[gingerjon]

29 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said:

Reach its ceiling? What is the target audience in the heartlands?

Many years ago a wise old sales manager said to me, depending on prospective customers that can possibly be converted in any given area what is the point of moving further afield till those have been exhausted?

IMG I am informed are the Guru's of bringing new audiences to their given project, in the "small geographical area" of just Gtr Manchester and West Yorkshire alone behind every door of every house there are over 6million prospective R'ses that can be put on seats in the stadium or sat in front of the telly watching the game, now will someone tell me why the need is to branch out until a concerted effort has been undertaken to entice these prospective customers in?

Filling out Greater Manchester and West Yorkshire would be expansion.

I'm glad we agree that it's about time the clubs in that area made an effort to do that.