IMG Grading System (Many Merged Threads)

[The Blues Ox]

Just now, bobbruce said:

Classic rugby league it’s simultaneously far too easy to get an A grade and impossible all at the same time. I think Brian Cox is missing a trick not checking out the rugby league multiverse. 

Tell me you don't understand how the grading criteria works without telling me you don't understand how the grading criteria works.

[bobbruce]

2 hours ago, phiggins said:

Though potentially creating more uncertainty.

Jeopardy added. 

[bobbruce]

3 minutes ago, Click said:

If you are currently in SL and have achieved a Grade 'A' then you are in SL. But if you happen to be the 13th team that achieves a Grade 'A' it doesn't guarantee SL. 

Perhaps it should, but it really isn't that relevant as I highly doubt we will be actually close to having that many grade 'A' clubs.

I’m not sure but I think if you are outside SL and you surpass a SL clubs score you will replace them as far as I know. 

[Click]

1 minute ago, bobbruce said:

I’m not sure but I think if you are outside SL and you surpass a SL clubs score you will replace them as far as I know. 

If there is a club in the championship that gets a Grade 'A' and there are still clubs in SL that are Grade 'B' - Then sure, of course, that's the point of the system.

there doesn't seem to be a Grade 'Higher B' and Grade 'Lower B' from what we've been told. (in terms of promotion to SL)

[Click]

Just now, Click said:

If there is a club in the championship that gets a Grade 'A' and there are still clubs in SL that are Grade 'B' - Then sure, of course, that's the point of the system.

there doesn't seem to be a Grade 'Higher B' and Grade 'Lower B' from what we've been told. (in terms of promotion to SL)

On further thinking about this - I honestly have no idea at the moment about how it is going to work, guess we will find out in a month or so. 

I just have the image of the original grading figures published in order in my mind. I guess I don't care enough after a season of knowing London aren't touching SL next year 

[bobbruce]

2 minutes ago, Click said:

If there is a club in the championship that gets a Grade 'A' and there are still clubs in SL that are Grade 'B' - Then sure, of course, that's the point of the system.

there doesn't seem to be a Grade 'Higher B' and Grade 'Lower B' from what we've been told. (in terms of promotion to SL)

I thought all grades were ranked so Leeds 16.90 say down to Wakefield (as an example) 15.01. So the top 12 scoring clubs are in SL until the League is increased. 

[Dave T]

3 minutes ago, bobbruce said:

I thought all grades were ranked so Leeds 16.90 say down to Wakefield (as an example) 15.01. So the top 12 scoring clubs are in SL until the League is increased. 

Yes, it's is basically the top 12 scores. The Grade A and grade B thing pretty much means nowt, and in fact is a distraction.

[Hopie]

7 hours ago, Damien said:

This is pretty much the case with most of these posts slagging off the process and IMG. Let's face it even if we kept everything the same many of the same people would still moan.

Where would you be without the opportunity to moan about these posts you are moaning about?

[Worzel]

This is Mikey Lewis’ world and we’re just background characters!

[Harry Stottle]

4 hours ago, bobbruce said:

I’m not sure but I think if you are outside SL and you surpass a SL clubs score you will replace them as far as I know. 

What, both being A Grades and one replaces the other, have you seen that in Brian Cox's manifesto?

[Harry Stottle]

4 hours ago, Dave T said:

Yes, it's is basically the top 12 scores. The Grade A and grade B thing pretty much means nowt, and in fact is a distraction.

Quote please, or provide a link.

[RP London]

5 hours ago, The Blues Ox said:

There were 7 in the initial run through, I don't expect that to have dropped and with the noises coming from certain teams I think its going to be more towards 9 or 10.

So "noises"

Gledhill  noises, Keighley noises, Hunslet noises?

[dboy]

54 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said:

Quote please, or provide a link.

What are you asking about???

The top 12 scores will be in SL.

The A / B thing is a misnomer.

If ever we have 13 grade A clubs, the top 12 scoring clubs will be in SL - until there is enough money coming into the game to support more top flight clubs.

[Dave T]

7 hours ago, Harry Stottle said:

Quote please, or provide a link.

What do you want a quote for? 

We know it's the top 12 scores.

I provided a link earlier in this thread where Rhodri Jones said we'd consider expanding if we have more than 12 A grades. So no guarantee.

The first version of this whole thing stated Grade A's had permanent SL status, however let's say Hull drop to a B and get overtaken by a handful of.clubs, they will go down. Grade A offers zero protection. 

[The Blues Ox]

8 hours ago, RP London said:

So "noises"

Gledhill  noises, Keighley noises, Hunslet noises?

More Castleford coming out and explaining why they thought if they could sell out their last match they would be in line for a Grade A type of thing I was more leaning towards but whatever floats your boat I guess.

[The Blues Ox]

The chances of getting more than 12 A grade clubs is so slim, the criteria is just so stacked against any team that will be in the Championship after this season. Realistically even the very best Championship clubs are going to max out at between 13-13.5 points after this year.

If we take it Cas are close to an A grade and Wakefield won't be far off either along with Leigh if what Beaumont says is true. That really only leaves Salford and Huddersfield as targets for the Championship clubs and are we really to believe that those two teams are not going to have improved from the initial scores? In my opinion we will hit 12 Grade A's after next season and that will be that until the IMG experiment runs its course. 

Obviously one option for IMG would be for them to increase the requirements for an A grade but this would not make any difference because it will become blatently obvious that it will be near impossible for any Champ team to bridge the gap. I think in theory it could have been a good system but it became flawed as soon as they set the bar so low to be judge an elite club. 12 Grade A's within 2 years of the system would be a disaster in my eyes because can you really see Sky increasing the money they put in to the game when the product really has not changed?

[Barley Mow]

If Wakefield and Toulouse make the 12 for next year there is a small chance of 13 A grades in the next couple of years as there will be 13 clubs with some of the advantages of SL incumbency in those points calculated over 3 years.

If it's a straight swap between London and Wakefield this year, we should very quickly see how the points advantage to SL incumbency means nobody else can get an A or even make the 12.

Edited September 14 by Barley Mow

[Harry Stottle]

1 hour ago, The Blues Ox said:

The chances of getting more than 12 A grade clubs is so slim, the criteria is just so stacked against any team that will be in the Championship after this season. Realistically even the very best Championship clubs are going to max out at between 13-13.5 points after this year.

If we take it Cas are close to an A grade and Wakefield won't be far off either along with Leigh if what Beaumont says is true. That really only leaves Salford and Huddersfield as targets for the Championship clubs and are we really to believe that those two teams are not going to have improved from the initial scores? In my opinion we will hit 12 Grade A's after next season and that will be that until the IMG experiment runs its course. 

Obviously one option for IMG would be for them to increase the requirements for an A grade but this would not make any difference because it will become blatently obvious that it will be near impossible for any Champ team to bridge the gap. I think in theory it could have been a good system but it became flawed as soon as they set the bar so low to be judge an elite club. 12 Grade A's within 2 years of the system would be a disaster in my eyes because can you really see Sky increasing the money they put in to the game when the product really has not changed?

You omit to mention Toulouse Oxy, where are they in your calculations an A or B?

Edited September 14 by Harry Stottle

[Les Tonks Sidestep]

1 hour ago, The Blues Ox said:

The chances of getting more than 12 A grade clubs is so slim, the criteria is just so stacked against any team that will be in the Championship after this season. Realistically even the very best Championship clubs are going to max out at between 13-13.5 points after this year.

If we take it Cas are close to an A grade and Wakefield won't be far off either along with Leigh if what Beaumont says is true. That really only leaves Salford and Huddersfield as targets for the Championship clubs and are we really to believe that those two teams are not going to have improved from the initial scores? In my opinion we will hit 12 Grade A's after next season and that will be that until the IMG experiment runs its course. 

Obviously one option for IMG would be for them to increase the requirements for an A grade but this would not make any difference because it will become blatently obvious that it will be near impossible for any Champ team to bridge the gap. I think in theory it could have been a good system but it became flawed as soon as they set the bar so low to be judge an elite club. 12 Grade A's within 2 years of the system would be a disaster in my eyes because can you really see Sky increasing the money they put in to the game when the product really has not changed?

IMG could only advise that, the clubs would have to vote any changes through. As to how successful any such advice would be be see eg removal of loop fixtures.

[Toby Chopra]

1 hour ago, The Blues Ox said:

The chances of getting more than 12 A grade clubs is so slim, the criteria is just so stacked against any team that will be in the Championship after this season. Realistically even the very best Championship clubs are going to max out at between 13-13.5 points after this year.

If we take it Cas are close to an A grade and Wakefield won't be far off either along with Leigh if what Beaumont says is true. That really only leaves Salford and Huddersfield as targets for the Championship clubs and are we really to believe that those two teams are not going to have improved from the initial scores? In my opinion we will hit 12 Grade A's after next season and that will be that until the IMG experiment runs its course. 

Obviously one option for IMG would be for them to increase the requirements for an A grade but this would not make any difference because it will become blatently obvious that it will be near impossible for any Champ team to bridge the gap. I think in theory it could have been a good system but it became flawed as soon as they set the bar so low to be judge an elite club. 12 Grade A's within 2 years of the system would be a disaster in my eyes because can you really see Sky increasing the money they put in to the game when the product really has not changed?

Seriously?

If we get 12 grade As it would be a triumph, not a disaster, as for the first time we'd have a whole league's worth of well supported, financially strong clubs, that are  equipped to promote the sport through modern communication channels.

Sadly we're still miles of that though.

[ATLANTISMAN]

Thinking about this can see all but the following clubs given an A.

Cas Hudds Salford 

With Wakey nailed on to replace London that leaves the above 3 as the most vulnerable clubs with Cas and Salford prob up against Toulouse.

I cannot see IMG wanting to lose Manchester and with Wakefield up Castleford will be seen as disposable being in the same area.

P

[The Blues Ox]

2 hours ago, Harry Stottle said:

You omit to mention Toulouse Oxy, where are they in your calculations an A or B?

I don't see Toulouse out scoring any current SL bar London, and they are not getting close to Wakey.

1 hour ago, Toby Chopra said:

Seriously?

If we get 12 grade As it would be a triumph, not a disaster, as for the first time we'd have a whole league's worth of well supported, financially strong clubs, that are  equipped to promote the sport through modern communication channels.

Sadly we're still miles of that though.

You think getting 12 Grade A teams within a couple of seasons of the system is a triumph? Most teams seem to be just fiddling with the figures to get the grades needed rather than doing what the criteria originally set out to do. 12 Grade A's after next season is not getting a better sky deal and most clubs will not have had any increase in income just because of their grading.

[LeeF]

26 minutes ago, ATLANTISMAN said:

Thinking about this can see all but the following clubs given an A.

Cas Hudds Salford 

With Wakey nailed on to replace London that leaves the above 3 as the most vulnerable clubs with Cas and Salford prob up against Toulouse.

I cannot see IMG wanting to lose Manchester and with Wakefield up Castleford will be seen as disposable being in the same area.

P

IMG do not decide who is and who isn’t in SL. The scoring criteria does.

I know that you have been corrected on this many times on this thread so I find it strange that you keep repeating this theory

[Derwent Parker]

6 hours ago, Dave T said:

What do you want a quote for? 

We know it's the top 12 scores.

I provided a link earlier in this thread where Rhodri Jones said we'd consider expanding if we have more than 12 A grades. So no guarantee.

The first version of this whole thing stated Grade A's had permanent SL status, however let's say Hull drop to a B and get overtaken by a handful of.clubs, they will go down. Grade A offers zero protection. 

Its in the IMG handbook

A "The highest rated grade with the club guaranteed participation in the top-tier on a permanent basis (as long as the grade is maintained)".

[Dave T]

5 minutes ago, Derwent Parker said:

Its in the IMG handbook

A "The highest rated grade with the club guaranteed participation in the top-tier on a permanent basis (as long as the grade is maintained)".

It only really works if we neatly land on 12 grade A clubs. Let's say we get 13 this month (or in any subsequent year), we aren't moving to 13 clubs next year. And if we then drop to 11 grade A clubs, we aren't dropping back to 12 clubs.

And permanent basis means nowt when you're just reassessed every season.

Edited September 14 by Dave T