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Martyn Sadler

When will Rugby League return?

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58 minutes ago, GUBRATS said:

I had a business for 19 years , built from scratch , turned over 20 odd million , set up others to verying degrees of success 

Was shut down for 3 weeks due to the Icelandic Ash cloud , nothing I could do , paid my staff to sweep the floors for 2 weeks , if things are out of your control , just sit it out , no amount of planning without firm dates is a complete waste if time , also a former director of a Championship/SL club 

 

There’s a clear difference on this place, which is exacerbated by goings on now, between the employed and the employers. 

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4 hours ago, rhinos78 said:

Your not expected to do anything, its a proposed option that gives you the choice. Season ticket holders get all there teams home games without having to pay extra. Sky sports subscription holders still get there couple games a week without having to pay extra.

If a season ticket holder decided they wernt happy that they were having to watch games on stream that they paid for to actually attend, you would hope they would be entitled to a refund, but i havnt seen anything on that yet.

If as has been suggested, championship and league one clubs arnt included in the live ppv, then it dosnt really change things from where we are now for fans of them clubs...Apart from say, if you wanted to watch Leeds get a hiding off someone, you could choose to pay for that game and select the money you'v payed to go to Bradford. If championship and league one clubs arnt included in the live ppv then again you'd hope season ticket holders would get there refund as they wouldnt even have the option of watching there teams live in any form. I really hope These leagues are included, Fev vs Leigh was one of the most enjoyable games i watched last season and after Leeds games, id probably pay to watch more championship than superleague.

Even after the Government relaxes things to a degree where its possible and even if SKY give it there blessing, therl still be Lots of problems and kinks to iron out for this to become reality, but its a desperate swing in desperate times for the clubs.

 

The only fair way I can see this pay per view working is if season ticket holders are refunded for games they are not allowed to attend, then they have the choice to buy pay per view games the same as non season ticket holders.

Giving season ticket holders free streaming isn’t acceptable, that’s not what they’ve paid for. Are they seriously going to charge £20-£25 to stream a game? No that would be crazy, it should be more like £5. We can’t pretend streaming a game from home has the same value as attending in person.

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2 hours ago, GUBRATS said:

So you think that after being stuck inside for months people won't want to go outside when they can ?

  Yes,absolutely they will.

   But I don't think it will be to spectate at rugby league games after they have watched,if they have,televised rugby league games,in empty stadia,played by elite athletes who have not trained together as a team for sufficient time.

  If there is no promotion,or a truncated season,will you expect Leigh to attract attendances that they would have done prior to this stoppage?

  If everyone,including the paying public,are involved in the dialogue for how best to progress,I would feel slightly more optimistic.

  A number of sports all restarting together doesn't thrill me. I hope the sport doesn't rush any decisions.


     No reserves,but resilience,persistence and determination are omnipotent.                       

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4 hours ago, rhinos78 said:

Your not expected to do anything, its a proposed option that gives you the choice. Season ticket holders get all there teams home games without having to pay extra. Sky sports subscription holders still get there couple games a week without having to pay extra.

If a season ticket holder decided they wernt happy that they were having to watch games on stream that they paid for to actually attend, you would hope they would be entitled to a refund, but i havnt seen anything on that yet.

If as has been suggested, championship and league one clubs arnt included in the live ppv, then it dosnt really change things from where we are now for fans of them clubs...Apart from say, if you wanted to watch Leeds get a hiding off someone, you could choose to pay for that game and select the money you'v payed to go to Bradford. If championship and league one clubs arnt included in the live ppv then again you'd hope season ticket holders would get there refund as they wouldnt even have the option of watching there teams live in any form. I really hope These leagues are included, Fev vs Leigh was one of the most enjoyable games i watched last season and after Leeds games, id probably pay to watch more championship than superleague.

Even after the Government relaxes things to a degree where its possible and even if SKY give it there blessing, therl still be Lots of problems and kinks to iron out for this to become reality, but its a desperate swing in desperate times for the clubs.

 

The only fair way I can see this pay per view working is if season ticket holders are refunded for games they are not allowed to attend, then they have the choice to buy pay per view games the same as non season ticket holders.

Giving season ticket holders free streaming isn’t acceptable, that’s not what they’ve paid for. Are they seriously going to charge £20-£25 to stream a game? No that would be crazy, it should be more like £5. We can’t pretend streaming a game from home has the same value as attending in person.

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23 minutes ago, Sir Kevin Sinfield said:

The only fair way I can see this pay per view working is if season ticket holders are refunded for games they are not allowed to attend, then they have the choice to buy pay per view games the same as non season ticket holders.

Giving season ticket holders free streaming isn’t acceptable, that’s not what they’ve paid for. Are they seriously going to charge £20-£25 to stream a game? No that would be crazy, it should be more like £5. We can’t pretend streaming a game from home has the same value as attending in person.

Agree with that

 

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44 minutes ago, Sir Kevin Sinfield said:

The only fair way I can see this pay per view working is if season ticket holders are refunded for games they are not allowed to attend, then they have the choice to buy pay per view games the same as non season ticket holders.

Giving season ticket holders free streaming isn’t acceptable, that’s not what they’ve paid for. Are they seriously going to charge £20-£25 to stream a game? No that would be crazy, it should be more like £5. We can’t pretend streaming a game from home has the same value as attending in person.

If you want your club to survive ( being a ST holder suggest you actually care about YOUR club ) then yes you will 

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In response to posters regarding season tickets and refunds for games played behind closed doors. Here is the legal position as it relates to soccer but also rugby league and other sports

Quote

Is it legal to restrict fans access to the stadium which have paid for tickets?

A football stadium is not a public place, it is private property usually owned by the club or a company on behalf of the club. The club is therefore within their rights to restrict access to the stadium.

The fact the fans have already paid for the tickets ensures that the club would have to be justified in restricting their access. Where a club has been ordered to play behind closed doors by a national governing body it can be assumed that this decision would be regarded as justified.

Will the fans be provided with a refund if they are not able to gain access to the stadium?

Often the decision will lie with the club – in the context of club football – or the national governing body – in the context of international football – as to whether the fans will be provided with refunds.

In the case of the England game where it was feared it would be played behind closed doors the Football Association made the decision that they would refund all fans the price they had paid for the tickets.

However, when a club is ordered to play behind closed doors for the reason of the behaviour of the home fans they may use their own discretion as to whether they will provide any fans with a refund

https://www.inbrief.co.uk/football-law/matches-behind-closed-doors/

An option would be to provide free live streaming or PPV for season ticket holders of the home team - Presumably by some kind of access code relating to the ST number.

Ian Rush (Liverpudlian soccer Legend) is not a fan of playing behind closed doors

https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/liverpool-icon-ian-rushs-damning-21889094

 


?

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The dominant ideas in society are always and everywhere the ideas of the ruling class. And always and everywhere they portray us as stupid, untrustworthy with bad motives. Show us respect sir. We gave you everything progressive there is. We gave you democracy. We demand some too.

 
Eddie Demsey RMT
 
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There were 17.4m people who voted to leave the European Union.

"Any attempt to try to cast their vote aside, as if they didn’t mean it or didn’t understand the consequences, whereas everybody else did, is a bit of a slur on the individuals who took the time to vote, many of them for the first time

Ian Lavery - Labour party chair  - 29th March 2019

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15 hours ago, Sir Kevin Sinfield said:

The only fair way I can see this pay per view working is if season ticket holders are refunded for games they are not allowed to attend, then they have the choice to buy pay per view games the same as non season ticket holders.

Giving season ticket holders free streaming isn’t acceptable, that’s not what they’ve paid for. Are they seriously going to charge £20-£25 to stream a game? No that would be crazy, it should be more like £5. We can’t pretend streaming a game from home has the same value as attending in person.

Yeah i touched on that in the second paragraph. I suspect that some season ticket holders who havnt been affected financialy by the Lockdown would be happy to accept the free streaming as a best case scenario and not request a refund because they want to help there club...What may not be acceptable to some, may be acceptable to others. 

But like we'v both said, the key is that the option for a refund should be there for season ticket holders who arnt in that position, or who just dont want to, because its not what they paid for....Which would be fair enough.

As i said in the last paragraph, its a desperate swing thats just a basic idea at the minute, if it gets closer to reality im sure there'l be a clearer picture. If that time comes and the clubs arnt offering refunds, then its time to get worked up.

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Personally as we have discussed between fellow York fans if its between having a club or not would rather they kept my money and if we get any games in this season thats a bonus however they are played. I.E. If the season is written off move on next year if necessary

 

Edited by HarrogateKnights
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There isn't an easy answer here unfortunately. The clubs are stuck between a rock and a hard place. 

The issue of PPV / behind closed doors games is more about getting some form of cash flow than it is about any "intergrity of the season" considerations. It can't be a coincidence that the Leeds online store seems to be having more sales than DFS at the moment - the clubs need cash in the till. 

I understand the whole "will season tickets be refunded" argument, but refunding season ticket holders would cripple clubs - they simply don't hold the cash. Similarly, waiting months until we are all, possibly, allowed back into stadiums isn't viable. 

I think the fairest way to deal with season ticket holders, and one I would support as an ST holder, would be to offer credits against next year's ticket for those that want to claim some form of compensation (and I imagine most clubs do/should have a CMS system that allows this). That means that fans "feel" that they've been suitably compensated for something they haven't received and it spreads the cash flow problem for the clubs.

No option is ideal but it requires some pragmatism. Some fans are going to feel short-changed but whilst the clubs have been able to take steps to reduce their cost base (furloughing staff, wage reductions and deferrals, etc), at some point (and that point is likely going to be before we can all go back to stadiums) the clubs are going to need to start raising cash.

Edited by whatmichaelsays
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On 14/04/2020 at 18:02, Dunbar said:

Fair comments.  I think by the time we even get to the point where games are going ahead behind closed doors some of the more critical economies will be back online and so furlough schemes may be winding down.

I won't comment on the availability of medical staff as that has been covered ad nauseum on another thread.

As I have said before, my biggest worry for Catalan in Super League and Toulouse in the Championship is that the games may restart while some international travel restrictions remain in place - what this does for both of these teams competing  the (majority) UK based leagues is very much an unknown at this stage.

If (and when) it does restart, the two French sides will have to remain in the UK for the rest of the season. Finding a new "home" ground will be a challenge but it would be better than all the travelling required. Obviously, home advantage of the new Stade Toulousaine ground would be lost but a small price to play for getting the league completed.

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12 minutes ago, kiggy said:

If (and when) it does restart, the two French sides will have to remain in the UK for the rest of the season. Finding a new "home" ground will be a challenge but it would be better than all the travelling required. Obviously, home advantage of the new Stade Toulousaine ground would be lost but a small price to play for getting the league completed.

I would say staying away from your family for an extended period of time is considerably more than a small price to pay... particularly for those players who are part time and don't earn the types of salaries that an overseas Super League signing would.

I don't know the personal circumstances of the Toulouse players but that would be a fair ask of them... in this time I wouldn't want to move overseas for work not knowing if international travel could be locked down at any point.

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40 minutes ago, kiggy said:

If (and when) it does restart, the two French sides will have to remain in the UK for the rest of the season. Finding a new "home" ground will be a challenge but it would be better than all the travelling required. Obviously, home advantage of the new Stade Toulousaine ground would be lost but a small price to play for getting the league completed.

It's quite possible that 'home grounds' will be given up by many teams in order to have bio-secure venues with fixed broadcast facilities. But I remain unconvinced that the Championship will resume this year anyway. It's just not worth it for most teams to play out the season behind closed doors, even with some sort of TV offer.   

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21 hours ago, Dunbar said:

I would say staying away from your family for an extended period of time is considerably more than a small price to pay... particularly for those players who are part time and don't earn the types of salaries that an overseas Super League signing would.

I don't know the personal circumstances of the Toulouse players but that would be a fair ask of them... in this time I wouldn't want to move overseas for work not knowing if international travel could be locked down at any point.

Yes, a big ask as many have very young families as well. My own personal "hunch" considering the prolongation of the lockdown, is that this season will be scrapped in the next few weeks. Let us hope that is a once-in-a-lifetime experience for everyone

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Some interesting points from Mr Cramer,well-known in rugby league circles,quoted about matters pertaining to the other code,but equally apply to our sport - https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2020/may/09/rugbys-return-may-be-hampered-by-premiership-players-insurance-cover


     No reserves,but resilience,persistence and determination are omnipotent.                       

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45 minutes ago, Angelic Cynic said:

Some interesting points from Mr Cramer,well-known in rugby league circles,quoted about matters pertaining to the other code,but equally apply to our sport - https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2020/may/09/rugbys-return-may-be-hampered-by-premiership-players-insurance-cover

I’ve not read it AC. But I can guess the policies won’t cover Covid-19.

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11 hours ago, Angelic Cynic said:

Some interesting points from Mr Cramer,well-known in rugby league circles,quoted about matters pertaining to the other code,but equally apply to our sport - https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2020/may/09/rugbys-return-may-be-hampered-by-premiership-players-insurance-cover

Yes, several pages back (or maybe even in one of the other threads) someone (me, it was me) said that the reason non league football won't be returning any time soon is because of the insurance issues.


Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. (Terry Pratchett)

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