SKY MONEY.

[newbe]

Will Sky pay less money to S/L clubs now that Toronto are not in competition, and SBW the biggest name in S/L no longer around this season?

[Click]

This years sky tv deal was negotiated before TW were ever in SL or SBW was ever in the minds of TW.

As far as I am aware, Sky pay to broadcast X amount of games a season, we easily cover that already. We may have had a problem if we were like the NRL and televised every game, but we don't.

[Damien]

As long as the games are fulfilled then it shouldn't matter. Whether the competition is as attractive for a future deal is a different matter.

[ChoboMog]

When it comes to Sky Sports money, for the 2020 season, I don't see any reason why withdrawal of the Toronto Wolfpack will have any effect whatsoever.  The team was never provided a share of the central funding and TV money, anyway.

The real question is what effect Toronto's withdrawal, from the 2020 season, will have on the RFL/SL's attempts to negotiate a new TV deal following this season.  Regardless of one's views on the team, love 'em or hate 'em, the Toronto Wolfpack do provide significant added value for the RFL/SL's product, to Sky Sports or whoever might be interested in the rights, given: the increased interest; their global reach; and their demonstration of the expansion possibility into new untapped markets.

Without this, the RFL/SL's leverage in negotiating any new deal, and the value of the product offered to any potential broadcaster/sponsor, is lessened along with the potential £££/$$$ for the league, the teams, and the game in the Northern Hemisphere.

[Man of Kent]

35 minutes ago, ChoboMog said:

The real question is what effect Toronto's withdrawal, from the 2020 season, will have on the RFL/SL's attempts to negotiate a new TV deal following this season.  Regardless of one's views on the team, love 'em or hate 'em, the Toronto Wolfpack do provide significant added value for the RFL/SL's product, to Sky Sports or whoever might be interested in the rights, given: the increased interest; their global reach; and their demonstration of the expansion possibility into new untapped markets.

They did. Past tense...

[Sir Kevin Sinfield]

3 hours ago, newbe said:

Will Sky pay less money to S/L clubs now that Toronto are not in competition, and SBW the biggest name in S/L no longer around this season?

Hopefully the Super League chairmen with a little bit ambition and business sense can see the value of Toronto to the competition and manage to push through a vote in favour of Toronto coming back into Super League 2021 on the same terms as the other 11 clubs.

[whatmichaelsays]

19 hours ago, Sir Kevin Sinfield said:

Hopefully the Super League chairmen with a little bit ambition and business sense can see the value of Toronto to the competition and manage to push through a vote in favour of Toronto coming back into Super League 2021 on the same terms as the other 11 clubs.

The same Super League chairmen who weren't exactly subtle in viewing Toronto as the b*****d step-child who they wanted nothing to do with? 

Let's not kid ourselves here. There were club owners who feared that Toronto might, just might, reach a level of success that they neither could, nor one that they ever intended to try and reach. It suits these club owners for RL to remain a cheap regional oddity and they would have taken any opportunity, any at all, to push Toronto over the edge to preserve that.  Toronto threated to be a tall poppy and these people simply had to cut it down. 

Rugby League Family™ indeed. 

[silverback]

How come everyone gets the blame now,but not toronto,from a tall poppy to weed.

[PEANUT HEAD]

3 hours ago, Sir Kevin Sinfield said:

Hopefully the Super League chairmen with a little bit ambition and business sense can see the value of Toronto to the competition and manage to push through a vote in favour of Toronto coming back into Super League 2021 on the same terms as the other 11 clubs.

The rfl have negotiated a good deal to have SBW face on the side of asda delivery Van's , instead of asking for extra money.

[whatmichaelsays]

3 hours ago, silverback said:

How come everyone gets the blame now,but not toronto,from a tall poppy to weed.

I'm not saying that many of Toronto's issues aren't self inflicted, but the deck has been rigged against them from the minute they won the MPG.

Compare and contrast the level of support granted to the likes of Leigh (an SL club in waiting we're constantly told) last year when, through their own failings, they were pleading for special dispensation and emergency loans because they couldn't even muster a matchday 17, with the level of support TW asked for, and were refused, for being caught out by a global pandemic.

TW aren't blameless, but the Rugby League Family has shown how insular it really is. 

[silverback]

18 minutes ago, whatmichaelsays said:

I'm not saying that many of Toronto's issues aren't self inflicted, but the deck has been rigged against them from the minute they won the MPG.

Compare and contrast the level of support granted to the likes of Leigh (an SL club in waiting we're constantly told) last year when, through their own failings, they were pleading for special dispensation and emergency loans because they couldn't even muster a matchday 17, with the level of support TW asked for, and were refused, for being caught out by a global pandemic.

TW aren't blameless, but the Rugby League Family has shown how insular it really is. 

 BUT,we were told time and time again they were in for the long haul and had a massive billionair backer. what changed.they had gone thru the past 3 years up to championship looking well,was Sl too much for them even with bags a cash??plenty a teams have fallen on hard times but are still around.

[Eddie]

5 minutes ago, silverback said:

 BUT,we were told time and time again they were in for the long haul and had a massive billionair backer. what changed.they had gone thru the past 3 years up to championship looking well,was Sl too much for them even with bags a cash??plenty a teams have fallen on hard times but are still around.

Maybe having no income this season has something to do with it. 

[silverback]

3 minutes ago, Eddie said:

Maybe having no income this season has something to do with it. 

BUT,why no income, if i had big buddles a cash BATLEY would have a star studded squad wanting for nothing,companys have had to grab loans to keep going, if SBW had a been left out of been the star pinnup boy,would we still have toronto playing next week. is it really about the £200.000 they wanted for wages,or is it a nice gettup for all concerned, dont swet i do feel sommats amiss and a new teams going to spring up based in manchester.

[whatmichaelsays]

17 minutes ago, silverback said:

 BUT,we were told time and time again they were in for the long haul and had a massive billionair backer. what changed.they had gone thru the past 3 years up to championship looking well,was Sl too much for them even with bags a cash??plenty a teams have fallen on hard times but are still around.

TW haven't gone away. What they have done is said that a combination of visa issues (due to unforseen circumstances) and no prospect of income makes this season a false economy. And I can't blame them.

They're already down, and yet the "RL family" sticks the boot in one more time for good measure. 

[silverback]

1 hour ago, whatmichaelsays said:

TW haven't gone away. What they have done is said that a combination of visa issues (due to unforseen circumstances) and no prospect of income makes this season a false economy. And I can't blame them.

They're already down, and yet the "RL family" sticks the boot in one more time for good measure. 

cobblers,they were playing next week until 2 days since. rest a Sl will put on a show without them am sure,its a farce that should a never happened,people with too much money wanting to own the world,, you cant buy fame, you have to earn a seat at the top table. not to worry its saves them been bottom a pile.lets have em in championship again strutting about.

[dboy]

1 hour ago, silverback said:

BUT,why no income, if i had big buddles a cash BATLEY would have a star studded squad wanting for nothing,companys have had to grab loans to keep going, if SBW had a been left out of been the star pinnup boy,would we still have toronto playing next week. is it really about the £200.000 they wanted for wages,or is it a nice gettup for all concerned, dont swet i do feel sommats amiss and a new teams going to spring up based in manchester.

They don't receive central funding, or a share of the TV money.

All their income is generated in Canada e.g. match days.

With no games to be played in  Canada this season, they have zero income.

Argyle funded the player wages to 55%, but needed some cash input to get through the season - he didn't find it.

[silverback]

6 minutes ago, dboy said:

They don't receive central funding, or a share of the TV money.

All their income is generated in Canada e.g. match days.

With no games to be played in  Canada this season, they have zero income.

Argyle funded the player wages to 55%, but needed some cash input to get through the season - he didn't find it.

Then he aint the big shot we all fell for,he had a dream and his pockets got longer and his arms got shorter, cant blame him its been going wrong far too long,they look like a championship side, some a the players/staff brought in were gash.am sure there fans will enjoy another visit to the mount for a warm welcome,

[LittleboroRoughyed]

Why couldn't TW effectively play each of their home games at the away clubs ground and negotiate (with SL) a percentage split of profit (after maychday expenses) with the host club? TW are effectively based in Rochdale and this would have reduced expenditure & allowed them to fulfill fixtures without the fear of relegation.

[wiganermike]

2 minutes ago, LittleboroRoughyed said:

Why couldn't TW effectively play each of their home games at the away clubs ground and negotiate (with SL) a percentage split of profit (after maychday expenses) with the host club? TW are effectively based in Rochdale and this would have reduced expenditure & allowed them to fulfill fixtures without the fear of relegation.

No-one will have match-day income for anyone to get a share of until October at the earliest so such an arrangement wouldn't have been possible.

[dboy]

5 minutes ago, LittleboroRoughyed said:

Why couldn't TW effectively play each of their home games at the away clubs ground and negotiate (with SL) a percentage split of profit (after maychday expenses) with the host club? TW are effectively based in Rochdale and this would have reduced expenditure & allowed them to fulfill fixtures without the fear of relegation.

They tried to get help from SL - the other clubs were asked to supply a loan equivalent of less than £20k per club - they refused.

What profit do you think is coming from future games? 

There's no profit - just a reduction of loss.

[Rupert Prince]

8 hours ago, ChoboMog said:

When it comes to Sky Sports money, for the 2020 season, I don't see any reason why withdrawal of the Toronto Wolfpack will have any effect whatsoever.  The team was never provided a share of the central funding and TV money, anyway.

The real question is what effect Toronto's withdrawal, from the 2020 season, will have on the RFL/SL's attempts to negotiate a new TV deal following this season.  Regardless of one's views on the team, love 'em or hate 'em, the Toronto Wolfpack do provide significant added value for the RFL/SL's product, to Sky Sports or whoever might be interested in the rights, given: the increased interest; their global reach; and their demonstration of the expansion possibility into new untapped markets.

Without this, the RFL/SL's leverage in negotiating any new deal, and the value of the product offered to any potential broadcaster/sponsor, is lessened along with the potential £££/$$$ for the league, the teams, and the game in the Northern Hemisphere.

It's possible at Toronto might well add value to the TV deal.  I'd like to think so.  But the real problem as it started out this season was that they lost each game and looked likely to be relegated.

So I find it difficult to see that there was going to be any significant effect.

[Kayakman]

3 hours ago, Rupert Prince said:

It's possible at Toronto might well add value to the TV deal.  I'd like to think so.  But the real problem as it started out this season was that they lost each game and looked likely to be relegated.

So I find it difficult to see that there was going to be any significant effect.

We will know more after the meeting with SL this Thursday...the real problem is with the Sky contract and the Wolfpack being shut out...its being addressed this Thursday so we will know soon.

[The Rocket]

Hopefully not

[JM2010]

21 hours ago, newbe said:

Will Sky pay less money to S/L clubs now that Toronto are not in competition, and SBW the biggest name in S/L no longer around this season?

What were the viewing figures for Toronto games in SL?

I was all for Toronto but struggled to watch their games as the standard wasn't great. Unfortunately they didn't add as much to SL as I thought they would. Their squad is basically lower level SL players and top end Championship players with 1 or 2 big names. Most of these players will just move to the next promoted team or bottom end SL team.

Ad for SBW, he wasn't a standout performer and after the initial excitement of his signing I think was just a standard SL player. 5/10 years ago he would have been the star of SL.

I know I'm being negative but I genuinely would love Toronto to be a top end SL team but unfortunately I'm now thinking North American teams in SL isn't the way to go. They'll just sign existing UK players who will just go for a pay day.

I'd rather see London, France, Wales, Manchester, Sheffield, Bradford find big backers like Argyle and some long term investment. Just think it would benefit SL more

 

[Tommygilf]

29 minutes ago, JM2010 said:

What were the viewing figures for Toronto games in SL?

I was all for Toronto but struggled to watch their games as the standard wasn't great. Unfortunately they didn't add as much to SL as I thought they would. Their squad is basically lower level SL players and top end Championship players with 1 or 2 big names. Most of these players will just move to the next promoted team or bottom end SL team.

Ad for SBW, he wasn't a standout performer and after the initial excitement of his signing I think was just a standard SL player. 5/10 years ago he would have been the star of SL.

I know I'm being negative but I genuinely would love Toronto to be a top end SL team but unfortunately I'm now thinking North American teams in SL isn't the way to go. They'll just sign existing UK players who will just go for a pay day.

I'd rather see London, France, Wales, Manchester, Sheffield, Bradford find big backers like Argyle and some long term investment. Just think it would benefit SL more

 

I see your points, that said basically any team promoted from the championship is likely to be made up of players how you describe. That true in any league.

I also appreciate the point about uk/French expansion. My only counter to that is 1, the big backers either don't exist in those locations, and 2, for historic and sociological reasons, if they do exist they are not drawn towards RL.

North America for me offers the opportunity of expanding the sports recognition without the historical baggage and other sport shenanigans we see almost everywhere else. RL clubs are also relative drops in the ocean in terms of funding sport in North America. 

Essentially, unless the sport starts mixing in the rich and famous circles in the UK we're not going to get that sort of investment and certainly can't decide where it goes. Indeed when we have in the past, as a sport we've totally renounced the money and complained. See Salford and Marwan.