Rugby League World Cup 2021 (Merged Threads)

[Dunbar]

1 minute ago, StandOffHalf said:

Yep, in a sport with so many heritage players it just seems odd to pick which countries are OK for Origin and which aren't.

I know Taumalolo is very proud to have grown up in QLD but he can't play for them as things stand.

I would much prefer Origin to be open to anybody who meets the residency criteria - regardless of which nation they represent.

Yes, I think they should say that either...

If you are eligible for Origin you can play Origin for your State regardless of which country you represent.

or.

Origin is Kangaroo players and so if you represent another country other than Australia you have forfeited your Origin elibility.

This half way house is just a bit of a fudge.

[StandOffHalf]

13 minutes ago, Dunbar said:

Yes, I think they should say that either...

If you are eligible for Origin you can play Origin for your State regardless of which country you represent.

or.

Origin is Kangaroo players and so if you represent another country other than Australia you have forfeited your Origin elibility.

This half way house is just a bit of a fudge.

Well said. That is better than how I put it, and I totally agree.

[Big Picture]

2 hours ago, StandOffHalf said:

Yeah, the piece that made me go ''pfffftttt'' was referring to NZ, Tonga, and Samoa as Oz's main rivals.

That just shows how behind them England has fallen.

[Damien]

1 hour ago, StandOffHalf said:

Yep, in a sport with so many heritage players it just seems odd to pick which countries are OK for Origin and which aren't.

To be fair the intentions behind this were good. It was to encourage players to still play for the PI and other tier 2 countries without having to sacrifice Origin to do so, something many wouldn't have done some years ago when the change was made.

Edited June 10, 2022 by Damien

[Jim from Oz]

From The Guardian:

 

One more thing

The return to action of most World Cup teams this month – many for the first time in two and a half years - will “undoubtedly give us a boost” says Jon Dutton, the CEO of the tournament. “We’re going to use that to gain attention. We’ve got to use the opportunity, be an evangelist and build the excitement.”

Ticket sales for the opening and closing games are going particularly well – Dutton is hoping for a combined 70,000 at the opening day in Newcastle and Leeds – as are the England v France fixture at Bolton, the quarter-final at Wigan and the semi-final at Arsenal.

Dutton is expecting traditional league towns to be a “late sale”. Unsurprisingly, filling seats at Coventry and Middlesbrough remains more difficult. His staff are busy raising awareness in host communities before another major marketing campaign six weeks before kick-off.

[welshmagpie]

On 10/06/2022 at 15:21, Farmduck said:

When players register with the NRL (and probably the RFL) they nominate their preferred eligible country for national representation and, if relevant, their heritage country. These databases of players are available to each country's selectors and they can pick anyone who qualifies for their country. The player ultimately has the option of not playing for any selected country for any, or no, reason.

This is a preliminary squad. The WC squads for the 2017 WC weren't settled until early October and I expect this year will be the same.

I do the heritage and eligibility checks for Wales RL. You’d like to think this was the system but sadly it isn’t. It’s very difficult, much of the information provided is inaccurate and/or hard to confirm. 

[Farmduck]

3 hours ago, welshmagpie said:

I do the heritage and eligibility checks for Wales RL. You’d like to think this was the system but sadly it isn’t. It’s very difficult, much of the information provided is inaccurate and/or hard to confirm. 

What's the hard part? Birth certificates? Passports? Immigration records?

[Oxford]

4 hours ago, Farmduck said:

What's the hard part? Birth certificates? Passports? Immigration records?

When you're looking for there to be a problem or you want rid of something you don't agree with just matching the rules to the person will do it.

You've been Rwandared!

[Man of Kent]

5 hours ago, Farmduck said:

What's the hard part? Birth certificates? Passports? Immigration records?

In the case of Wales heritage players, I imagine it’s the finding of receipts proving their grandmothers bought a Tom Jones LP.

[Barley Mow]

7 hours ago, Farmduck said:

What's the hard part? Birth certificates? Passports? Immigration records?

I imagine for players with Welsh heritage, the majority will be born in northern England so immigration will be irrelevant and their passports would only demonstrate they are British (which obviously includes both English and Welsh).

Presumably the difficulty is demonstrating/verifying that grandparents were born in Wales (again despite their legal nationality being simply British).

Edited June 12, 2022 by Barley Mow

[UTK]

Current reports are suggesting that Haumole Olakau'atu and Daniel Tupou will both reject NSW in favour of representing Tonga in the mid-season international.

Lots of respect for them doing so even as a NSWelshman.

[fighting irish]

3 hours ago, Man of Kent said:

In the case of Wales heritage players, I imagine it’s the finding of receipts proving their grandmothers bought a Tom Jones LP.

It's more likely that Tom is their actual grandfather.

[Tommygilf]

12 hours ago, Jim from Oz said:

From The Guardian:

 

One more thing

The return to action of most World Cup teams this month – many for the first time in two and a half years - will “undoubtedly give us a boost” says Jon Dutton, the CEO of the tournament. “We’re going to use that to gain attention. We’ve got to use the opportunity, be an evangelist and build the excitement.”

Ticket sales for the opening and closing games are going particularly well – Dutton is hoping for a combined 70,000 at the opening day in Newcastle and Leeds – as are the England v France fixture at Bolton, the quarter-final at Wigan and the semi-final at Arsenal.

Dutton is expecting traditional league towns to be a “late sale”. Unsurprisingly, filling seats at Coventry and Middlesbrough remains more difficult. His staff are busy raising awareness in host communities before another major marketing campaign six weeks before kick-off.

If ever there was a sign of why the sport needs broader popularity this will be it; though hopefully some of the games will be catalysts for growth.

[StandOffHalf]

3 hours ago, UTK said:

Current reports are suggesting that Haumole Olakau'atu and Daniel Tupou will both reject NSW in favour of representing Tonga in the mid-season international.

Lots of respect for them doing so even as a NSWelshman.

AWESOME, if true!

[StandOffHalf]

I see that Dessie Hasler has been into Olakau'atu's ear, urging him to play for NSW.

''Tonga will always be there'', is how the Manly boss put it. 

Really goes to show the pressures put on players.

 

[Damien]

21 minutes ago, StandOffHalf said:

I see that Dessie Hasler has been into Olakau'atu's ear, urging him to play for NSW.

''Tonga will always be there'', is how the Manly boss put it. 

Really goes to show the pressures put on players.

The NRL have literally moved to make sure that Tonga won't always be there mid season again. They have chose not to give these players the choice for these players to represent their country mid season again. It stinks. NSW will always be there is more correct.

[jim_57]

28 minutes ago, StandOffHalf said:

I see that Dessie Hasler has been into Olakau'atu's ear, urging him to play for NSW.

''Tonga will always be there'', is how the Manly boss put it. 

Really goes to show the pressures put on players.

 

Playing Origin is (sadly) the best career move. More exposure and much higher payments.

Kiwis will lose more players to the Origin & Tonga/Samoa loophole as years go on as well. Nanai & Taulagi the latest NZ born players to opt for Origin.

Time to scrap any international eligibility ties with Origin. If a player qualifies under the current Origin eligibility rules (born, father or moved before 13th birthday) let them play. It would rarely affect England but NZ would be in the mix for future cases like Ponga, Nanai, Papalii, Paulo etc.

Edited June 12, 2022 by jim_57

[StandOffHalf]

3 minutes ago, Damien said:

The NRL have literally moved to make sure that Tonga won't always be there mid season again. They have chose not to give these players the choice for these players to represent their country mid season again. It stinks. NSW will always be there is more correct.

That was exactly my response upon reading that little pearler from Hasler.

[ghost crayfish]

33 minutes ago, jim_57 said:

Playing Origin is (sadly) the best career move. More exposure and much higher payments.

Kiwis will lose more players to the Origin & Tonga/Samoa loophole as years go on as well. Nanai & Taulagi the latest NZ born players to opt for Origin.

Time to scrap any international eligibility ties with Origin. If a player qualifies under the current Origin eligibility rules (born, father or moved before 13th birthday) let them play. It would rarely affect England but NZ would be in the mix for future cases like Ponga, Nanai, Papalii, Paulo etc.

Yeah it's really disappointing those guys chose QLD (I'm a queenslander). I agree with you

[welshmagpie]

16 hours ago, Farmduck said:

What's the hard part? Birth certificates? Passports? Immigration records?

The hard part is believing what the NRL put out there and GDPR in the UK to even source the information in the first place without going to the players themselves. 
 

The NRL published a list of heritage players for their recent heritage round. Roughly 40% of those listed were ‘qualifying’ based on great-great-grandparents or further. 

[jim_57]

9 hours ago, ghost crayfish said:

Yeah it's really disappointing those guys chose QLD (I'm a queenslander). I agree with you

I’m a Cowboys fan and Queenslander as well but I am disappointed both chose Origin. Unfortunately I can see it becoming the norm for dual eligible players in the future. An extra $90k a year for 3 games is a big lure let alone the hype and exposure.

[Farmduck]

10 hours ago, StandOffHalf said:

I see that Dessie Hasler has been into Olakau'atu's ear, urging him to play for NSW.

''Tonga will always be there'', is how the Manly boss put it. 

Really goes to show the pressures put on players.

 

It's shocking to think that a player who was born in Sydney and lived here his whole life might end up playing for NSW or Australia. It shouldn't be allowed.

[jim_57]

1 hour ago, Farmduck said:

It's shocking to think that a player who was born in Sydney and lived here his whole life might end up playing for NSW or Australia. It shouldn't be allowed.

Obviously his preference is Tonga if the stories are true. Nobody is debating his eligibility to play for Australia or NSW. The point was there is pressure being put on him to reverse his decision because it doesn’t align with what Hasler and the media sees as priority, frankly they should all stay out of it.

I doubt Olakau’atu is much of a chance for Origin 2 anyway and the mid-year tests are scrapped next year unfortunately so the point is probably moot.

[Farmduck]

This is the only direct quote I could find:

“I’d think as far as his heritage and Tonga, it’s always going to be there,” Hasler said. “Origin is a rare game. It’s a piece of history for players’ aspirations. He’ll get good counsel.”

If that's pressure then I'm a millionaire. If Olakau'atu can't cope with that kind of pressure then how is he going to cope with playing for Tonga?

 

[UTK]

24 minutes ago, Farmduck said:

This is the only direct quote I could find:

“I’d think as far as his heritage and Tonga, it’s always going to be there,” Hasler said. “Origin is a rare game. It’s a piece of history for players’ aspirations. He’ll get good counsel.”

If that's pressure then I'm a millionaire. If Olakau'atu can't cope with that kind of pressure then how is he going to cope with playing for Tonga?

 

I still think it's fair to say that it's an unnecessary comment from a person holding a position of power above Olakau'atu, and one that resonates with outdated views of the representative scene.

"As far as his heritage and Tonga, it's always going to be there" - is Hasler implying Origin isn't always going to exist? Tonga haven't played in 3 years and as a result Olakau'atu is yet to make his international debut, NSW have played every year and will continue to do so - Origin will always be there for Haumole as well so the comment is just exposing some of Hasler's bias. 

"Origin is a rare game. It's a piece of history for players' aspirations" - Despite the theatre that inevitably surrounds Origin the International game is still the highest level of the sport, winning a WC for Tonga is objectively a far greater achievement than winning a SOO series and this test match is important to building toward that goal.

I say all this as an Australian and a passionate supporter of NSW/Origin, Hasler is just out of touch with the changing scene that is representative football. A head coach importing those views on his players is entirely unnecessary and doesn't say a lot for his views on his players autonomy.