Sat 12th Nov: RLWC SF: England v Samoa KO 14:30

[MatthewWoody]

1 minute ago, Chrispmartha said:

I thought we were shocking yesterday, it really did look like they had fallen in love with themselves, but what’s more disappointing is even playing so poorly we had a chance to win the game but that golden point performance was absolutely diabolical.

Its a missed opportunity but not the end of the world like some are going on about.

This.

This proves this Samoa side - with all due respect - was beatable. If we played like yesterday against NZ or Australia, we'd have lost with a cricket score.

 

[MatthewWoody]

3 minutes ago, Damien said:

Your point was about losing to a team other than NZ or Australia.

At home, yes, it's a failure. 

 

[JohnM]

23 minutes ago, MatthewWoody said:

So we can't criticize them cause they're in the England setup.

You and anyone can and do criticise them as individual players, as a team, as team management, as an organisation.

Indeed, without such criticisms, the forum would hardly exist.

However, the critics need to accept that they will also be criticised.

[MatthewWoody]

1 minute ago, JohnM said:

You and anyone can and do criticise them as individual players, as a team, as team management, as an organisation.

Indeed, without such criticisms, the forum would hardly exist.

However, the critics need to accept that they will also be criticised.

Somebody said "moan like babies". 

 

Edited November 13, 2022 by MatthewWoody

[Damien]

4 minutes ago, MatthewWoody said:

At home, yes, it's a failure. 

 

No more so than losing against NZ though.

[MatthewWoody]

2 minutes ago, Damien said:

No more so than losing against NZ though.

Not sure about this. 

Still, a failure. 

In football terms, I'd say yesterday's (for how bad we played) loss is more a 2012 Euros vs Italy on penalties than a 2021. I mean, in 2012 in Kiev was still a matter of inches but England had been embarassing. Like yesterday in rl. 

[Damien]

1 minute ago, MatthewWoody said:

Not sure about this. 

Still, a failure. 

In football terms, I'd say yesterday's (for how bad we played) loss is more a 2012 Euros vs Italy on penalties than a 2021. I mean, in 2012 in Kiev was still a matter of inches but England had been embarassing. Like yesterday in rl. 

You are moaning about losing against Samoa instead of a tier 1 nation. That is your premise regardless of performance.

[Northern Eel]

On 12/11/2022 at 14:29, shrewsbury roughyed said:

The mascots have been amazing all through the tournament. Really look as though they’re enjoying the occasion 

The World Cup event has, I was told yesterday, engaged 3,500 youngsters in the mascot, flag-bearing and dancing etc. That's a really important part of bringing people into the game.

Yesterday, the kids from our club had the absolute privilege of being mascots for England. (apologies; copied from the RLWC Legacy thread)

 

[Stuff Smith]

I'm losing the plot here.

We lost very narrowly in a thrilling game: a game that had us on the edge of our seats. Any neutral supporter, or potential  fan of the game watching for the first time, would have loved every minute. If Samoa had won like that against Australia or NZ, we'd be eulogizing about it.

But they beat England instead. It was still an amazing game. England lost; the sport of Rugby League didn't.

(The result may have dented the potential for the growth of the game in this country, but only may. I'm not sure, even if we'd won the tournament, that the sport in the UK would have been able to capitalise on it.)

Edited November 13, 2022 by Stuff Smith

[ELBOWSEYE]

5 hours ago, Damien said:

Its not a defence. His age and experience just illustrates how ridiculous it is writing off a 21 year old with a good 10 years left in the game. We did pick our more experienced players and they were our worst, the likes of Watkins, Tomkins, McIlorum, Williams.

Williams, you must be crazy. He was our only threatening player. 

[bratman]

4 minutes ago, ELBOWSEYE said:

Williams, you must be crazy. He was our only threatening player. 

I thought Williams was pretty good, a bit frantic at times but he did look threatening.

[David Shepherd]

4 minutes ago, ELBOWSEYE said:

Williams, you must be crazy. He was our only threatening player. 

The other three were very ordinary though, especially Mcilorum

[Northern Eel]

I've only just pulled myself to being able to post on the forum, since yesterday.

For my money, we just don't have the level of intensity and frequency of the highest caliber rugby league games to become conditioned to playing the occasions. Our game management lost us the game yesterday. We were poor in certain areas, but should have had enough to take the game in extra-time. We need to ensure we play the best teams in the world as often as possible. It sounds like we are going to need to jump on a plane more often that not, sadly.

[Damien]

8 minutes ago, ELBOWSEYE said:

Williams, you must be crazy. He was our only threatening player. 

Nope as a half he was terrible. Constantly running down blind allys and stifling any attack. He must have gone himself at least 5 times on the 4th tackle and he lacked the creativity to set up his outside backs. That meant he continually did what Williams resorts to, stupid kicks at stupid times, and his kicking game was attricious too. He was the George Williams I was glad to see leave Wigan.

[ELBOWSEYE]

3 minutes ago, Damien said:

Nope as a half he was terrible. Constantly running down blind allys and stifling any attack. He must have gone himself at least 5 times on the 4th tackle and he lacked the creativity to set up his outside backs. That meant he continually did what Williams resorts to, stupid kicks at stupid times, and his kicking game was attricious too. He was the George Williams I was glad to see leave Wigan.

Sounds a little bitter, pity few agree with you. 

[ELBOWSEYE]

11 minutes ago, David Shepherd said:

The other three were very ordinary though, especially Mcilorum

No arguments from me, I have expressed those views on earlier posts. 

[Damien]

1 minute ago, ELBOWSEYE said:

Sounds a little bitter, pity few agree with you. 

Why would I be bitter? You obviously didn't read this match thread either, Williams got plenty of criticism on here.

[Tippytoe]

2 hours ago, Dave T said:

I'm sure every England fan there wanted to go to the final and see us win. 

We don't all act like spoilt brats if it doesn't happen. 

 

Charming 

[Dunbar]

5 minutes ago, Damien said:

Nope as a half he was terrible. Constantly running down blind allys and stifling any attack. He must have gone himself at least 5 times on the 4th tackle and he lacked the creativity to set up his outside backs. That meant he continually did what Williams resorts to, stupid kicks at stupid times, and his kicking game was attricious too. He was the George Williams I was glad to see leave Wigan.

I will need to find the will to watch the game back again but from the first viewing I thought a lot England's problems stemmed from distribution - either the dummy half or the middle forwards looking to link.  There was no accuracy and no urgency at all.

Williams was reaching over his head to catch a ball or always having to adjust his body position to collect.  This led to him having to change the play as the edge defence had come in.  Not every single time but enough for it not to have been just Williams looking lost.

When he did run the ball he was dangerous, as he proved in setting up both the Whitehead and Farnworth tries.

I thought he was one of a few who could come off with his head up.

[Dave T]

4 minutes ago, Tippytoe said:

Charming 

Apologies if that sounds harsh, and I don't mean to be personal (and I havent followed your posts so I'm not aiming it directly at you), but don't suggest that being able to be pragmatic about a loss means in any way that people weren't bothered about winning, or are accepting of failure. 

[Damien]

12 minutes ago, Dunbar said:

I will need to find the will to watch the game back again but from the first viewing I thought a lot England's problems stemmed from distribution - either the dummy half or the middle forwards looking to link.  There was no accuracy and no urgency at all.

Williams was reaching over his head to catch a ball or always having to adjust his body position to collect.  This led to him having to change the play as the edge defence had come in.  Not every single time but enough for it not to have been just Williams looking lost.

When he did run the ball he was dangerous, as he proved in setting up both the Whitehead and Farnworth tries.

I thought he was one of a few who could come off with his head up.

Williams runs himself and kicks, that's what he does. He will always make half breaks because he runs time and again. Some people rate that but I want a half who offers a little more than constantly going himself on the 4th tackle and then leaving no kick option on the 5th. He tries hard but that is part of the problem, he tries too hard to make it happen himself.

As an experienced half he should have been directing the play and showing some composure but instead he was part of the problem. That is compounded when Tomkins and Welsby aren't offering that either.

Edited November 13, 2022 by Damien

[Moe syszlak]

27 minutes ago, David Shepherd said:

The other three were very ordinary though, especially Mcilorum

Mcilorum would have to up his performance to be described as ordinary. Abysmal would be more apt.

[Chrispmartha]

1 minute ago, Moe syszlak said:

Mcilorum would have to up his performance to be described as ordinary. Abysmal would be more apt.

He should have been playing for Ireland, if Micky Mac is our best hooker we are in trouble.

[Tippytoe]

6 minutes ago, Dave T said:

Apologies if that sounds harsh, and I don't mean to be personal (and I havent followed your posts so I'm not aiming it directly at you), but don't suggest that being able to be pragmatic about a loss means in any way that people weren't bothered about winning, or are accepting of failure. 

I was just being honest if that qualifies me of being a "spoilt brat" fine it's a forum and I'm viewing my opinion without name calling.

[Tommygilf]

5 minutes ago, Chrispmartha said:

He should have been playing for Ireland, if Micky Mac is our best hooker we are in trouble.

He isn't our best, but he is Shaun Wane's most trusted, and therein lies the problem