IMG looking to ditch Super League branding

[Madrileño]

23 hours ago, Derwent Parker said:

no that sounds like a subsidiary of the NRL

It effectively is though. (A feeder if you like.)

The NRL would never allow it though, as it could seriously harm their branding. 

[Tommygilf]

1 hour ago, Rowan said:

Just to clear up something for an old timer - is this discussion  about changing the name of the sport or the name of a competition inside the sport of Rugby League?

Officially as far as we are aware it is the league that is currently Super League being renamed.

The debate will come as to whether that should change what goes along the bottom of the Sky Sports News TV screen, or what category we are on the BBC Sport website. With NRL, NFL, NBA etc, the league is the sport (or at least 95% of it that people are interested in) so its simpler to do. The only option I see for us is to call everything RFL. Its notable that Eric Perez described Toronto's journey in the league system as "moving through the RFL" perhaps then RFL 1, RFL 2 and RFL 3 become our Leagues under that overarching RFL brand.

[Wellsy4HullFC]

On 18/12/2022 at 09:34, JohnM said:

Those who don't like the use of the word "Elite" maybe need to have a word with the French RL authorities.

However, in a flight of world-peace fancy unlikely to happen, I'd go for:

NRL as the name of the whole sport world wide.

Each country or region the sport and governing body would be 

NRL Europe

NRL Aus etc.

In the UK , NRL Premier, NRL Championship, etc.

What does the N stand for?...

[JohnM]

6 minutes ago, Wellsy4HullFC said:

What does the N stand for?...

Good question.  It stands for the re-branding of our sport, creating a new global  identity, Naturally. 

[Wellsy4HullFC]

On 18/12/2022 at 09:34, JohnM said:

.

 

Edited December 19, 2022 by Wellsy4HullFC
Double post

[Wellsy4HullFC]

4 minutes ago, JohnM said:

Good question.  It stands for the re-branding of our sport, creating a new global  identity, Naturally. 

The fact you won't answer directly is telling.

[steve oates]

15 hours ago, Tommygilf said:

Officially as far as we are aware it is the league that is currently Super League being renamed.

 The only option I see for us is to call everything RFL. Its notable that Eric Perez described Toronto's journey in the league system as "moving through the RFL" perhaps then RFL 1, RFL 2 and RFL 3 become our Leagues under that overarching RFL brand.

There is an option to just leave well alone, and don't cause damage to the game by listening to IMG

I appreciate your efforts to suggest a new brand name, especially because what you have been left with after a lot of thought is "RFL"

Before the reunification "Superleague" were at loggerheads with the "RFL" under Nigel Wood for a very long time.

 Superleague chairmen may now be happy that all that is in the past, because Wood was ousted, but I would be sure that they would all be horrified to have the name RFL replacing Superleague.  Also that SL "Brand" has been a winner since 1996 and has served us well and attracted fans and TV deals to the game.....

IF you believe a brand name change can have a positive effect, then ask yourself why Stella Artrois Lager have not change their old fashioned hundreds of Years old brand??

I am not criticising you at all, but I think we should realise that these people are of little value to us, and as much as some of us think "Superleage" may not be as effective as it was years ago, that does not mean there is something better. We are the original Superleague, those who copy us admire us  - so stick with it. 

Don't listen to IMG..........   

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[whatmichaelsays]

39 minutes ago, steve oates said:

There is an option to just leave well alone, and don't cause damage to the game by listening to IMG

I appreciate your efforts to suggest a new brand name, especially because what you have been left with after a lot of thought is "RFL"

Before the reunification "Superleague" were at loggerheads with the "RFL" under Nigel Wood for a very long time.

 Superleague chairmen may now be happy that all that is in the past, because Wood was ousted, but I would be sure that they would all be horrified to have the name RFL replacing Superleague.  Also that SL "Brand" has been a winner since 1996 and has served us well and attracted fans and TV deals to the game.....

IF you believe a brand name change can have a positive effect, then ask yourself why Stella Artrois Lager have not change their old fashioned hundreds of Years old brand??

I am not criticising you at all, but I think we should realise that these people are of little value to us, and as much as some of us think "Superleage" may not be as effective as it was years ago, that does not mean there is something better. We are the original Superleague, those who copy us admire us  - so stick with it. 

Don't listen to IMG..........   

The big issue here is whether the sport / IMG feels that the "Super League" brand is powerful enough for RL, given the very obvious threats to the sport's ability to own that brand and keep it distinctive. 

Using your lager brand as an example; that is a brand that Stella puts an awful lot of resources into promoting (usually through advertising) and defending (against negative images), etc. Even then, there isn't really anyone trying to appropriate that brand. In my line of work I've worked with brands that spend more on brand protection than I suspect RL/SL has ever spent (or been able to spend) on brand promotion. 

Resources are what they are in RL so there becomes a real question over whether "Super League" is a brand that we can own and keep distinctive, given that the term is also being appropriated by other sports (particularly football). 

That was always the risk with quite a generic term like "Super League" - you either have to spend a lot of resource in owning the brand and making it distinctive, or you leave the brand open to being diluted by others using the same or similar terms. 

Edited December 19, 2022 by whatmichaelsays

[DI Keith Fowler]

36 minutes ago, steve oates said:

IF you believe a brand name change can have a positive effect, then ask yourself why Stella Artrois Lager have not change their old fashioned hundreds of Years old brand??

This is such an interesting one to pick, as you are correct the brewery is hundreds of years old but Stella Artois itself was a rebrand that happened in 1926.

No doubt the 1926 equivalent of Steve Oates, perhaps Stefan De Ooates, was bemoaning the fact they changed their centuries old branding to one referencing the Christmas star. 

[GUBRATS]

1 hour ago, steve oates said:

There is an option to just leave well alone, and don't cause damage to the game by listening to IMG

I appreciate your efforts to suggest a new brand name, especially because what you have been left with after a lot of thought is "RFL"

Before the reunification "Superleague" were at loggerheads with the "RFL" under Nigel Wood for a very long time.

 Superleague chairmen may now be happy that all that is in the past, because Wood was ousted, but I would be sure that they would all be horrified to have the name RFL replacing Superleague.  Also that SL "Brand" has been a winner since 1996 and has served us well and attracted fans and TV deals to the game.....

IF you believe a brand name change can have a positive effect, then ask yourself why Stella Artrois Lager have not change their old fashioned hundreds of Years old brand??

I am not criticising you at all, but I think we should realise that these people are of little value to us, and as much as some of us think "Superleage" may not be as effective as it was years ago, that does not mean there is something better. We are the original Superleague, those who copy us admire us  - so stick with it. 

Don't listen to IMG..........   

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Top post

[GUBRATS]

40 minutes ago, DI Keith Fowler said:

This is such an interesting one to pick, as you are correct the brewery is hundreds of years old but Stella Artois itself was a rebrand that happened in 1926.

No doubt the 1926 equivalent of Steve Oates, perhaps Stefan De Ooates, was bemoaning the fact they changed their centuries old branding to one referencing the Christmas star. 

Rather than ' wife beater ' ? 

[redjonn]

20 hours ago, Rowan said:

Just to clear up something for an old timer - is this discussion  about changing the name of the sport or the name of a competition inside the sport of Rugby League?

Nobody on here really knows. It is just a discussion around possible replacement names for Superleague given the possibility of a rebranding. For some that has focused on a name.

Surely nobody would think about changing the name of the sport as distinct from a competition within the sport.  

[Tonka]

4 hours ago, Wellsy4HullFC said:

What does the N stand for?...

Northern

[Hull Kingston Bronco]

31 minutes ago, Tonka said:

Northern

Perfect. Northern Rugby League

That's the only way you'll ever get the flatcappers to like the NRL 

[Padge]

On 17/12/2022 at 11:09, Barley Mow said:

Still reading, but still disagree I'm afraid.

I don't think your band analogy fits the scenario.

- The sport in 1894 was rugby.

- In 1895 rugby was still played (exactly the same rules of the game) but under two different governing bodies.

- In the period since, both of the governing bodies have changed the laws they play under. Neither now play 1894 rugby and two separate codes resulted - both equally rugby, distinct from each other and the sport as played before schism.

In the 1890s 'Rugby' was merely a code (rules) of football, a generic term for many codes.

Rugby was a collection of sporting unions (usually regionally based) consisting of individual clubs playing the 'Rugby' code of football.

The RFU was the controlling body that laid down the laws of the 'Rugby' code that clubs playing the sport had to adhere too. They gave the individual unions quite a bit of autonomy about how they arranged their fixtures and, though the RFU were not happy with them, leagues and cups. Both Lancashire and Yorkshire Unions had a stab at setting up leagues.

The larger clubs in Lancashire and Yorkshire were not happy with interference from their respective governing bodies over structure and fixtures. This led to them wanting their own union so they had control.  The RFU refused to accept the clubs 'Northern Union' as a member union. Though there are debates about timings and clubs resigning from county unions it basically meant that the RFU forced the Northern clubs out by not accepting their union membership.

It could be argued the clubs left but equally argued that the clubs were forced out. The split was about control, not money.

All that said I am not disagreeing with you but just posting my take on why we are entitled to the word rugby much to the chagrin of the RFU.

Edited December 19, 2022 by Padge

[Oxford]

Sometimes it's just like being at Twickers.

Blah, blah, blah code, thingumyjig blah blah blah codes.

 

[idrewthehaggis]

2 hours ago, Padge said:

In the 1890s 'Rugby' was merely a code (rules) of football, a generic term for many codes.

Rugby was a collection of sporting unions (usually regionally based) consisting of individual clubs playing the 'Rugby' code of football.

The RFU was the controlling body that laid down the laws of the 'Rugby' code that clubs playing the sport had to adhere too. They gave the individual unions quite a bit of autonomy about how they arranged their fixtures and, though the RFU were not happy with them, leagues and cups. Both Lancashire and Yorkshire Unions had a stab at setting up leagues.

The larger clubs in Lancashire and Yorkshire were not happy with interference from their respective governing bodies over structure and fixtures. This led to them wanting their own union so they had control.  The RFU refused to accept the clubs 'Northern Union' as a member union. Though there are debates about timings and clubs resigning from county unions it basically meant that the RFU forced the Northern clubs out by not accepting their union membership.

It could be argued the clubs left but equally argued that the clubs were forced out. The split was about control, not money.

All that said I am not disagreeing with you but just posting my take on why we are entitled to the word rugby much to the chagrin of the RFU.

Yeah I see this too.

Rugby League has to be in the name. Start, middle or end. It does not matter where.

When that Salfordian posh boy picked the ball up at Rugby School, the journey attested has never been singular nor exclusive. 

And like a family name, it is shared, but strongly unique to each individual. 

Cain and Able, Harry and Wills,  Chico, Harpo, Groucho, Gummo, and erm Zeppo

[Padge]

1 hour ago, idrewthehaggis said:

 

When that Salfordian posh boy picked the ball up at Rugby School, the journey attested has never been singular nor exclusive. 

 

He never did this, it's a complete and utter lie.

[The Ghost of 99]

1 hour ago, idrewthehaggis said:

When that Salfordian posh boy picked the ball up at Rugby School,

This really is not the place to be repeating rugby union lies, least of all lies directly arising in reaction to the breakaway of what became Rugby League.

This was a story they made up after 1895 to pretend the origins of of the sport lay with public schools rather than with working people. It shouldn't be something people are posting on this website of all places.

[idrewthehaggis]

Yeah we all know Webb Ellis didn't, but I think his Salfordian origins (albeit more Anthony Wilson than Adrian Morley) of that Founders myth gives us - RL - a sense of continuity that the other code can't scoff at.

Sale are a magpie Cheshire club..

I'd argue and I'd hope you'd agree, Webb Ellis whilst a myth, for RL to discard that myth, just gives strength to the kick n' clap bigots as union as the real thing that League suddenly deviated from.

Posh boys, can't claim to hold exclusive parenthood for any form of football. Its millenniums old - boot, first, hand or yer heid. Inflated ball, stomach, hair, rubber, leather or yer heid.  Preferably not her own.

I used to live near Ashbourne and a visit at Shrovetide will tell you that it wasn't fee paying Jono and Guy who invented it. 

Anyway the equation for re branding is-

Rugby League-as that is what is,

A word to show its the top/highest tier

A word to show its a league not a ko cup.

 

Edited December 20, 2022 by idrewthehaggis

[JohnM]

18 hours ago, Wellsy4HullFC said:

The fact you won't answer directly is telling.

It doesn't matter what it stands for . It has a certain resonance, it rolls off the tongue. It suggests an alignment with other sports. Isn't the NFL considering a UK franchise? Will they change the name from NFL to TFL Transnational Football League?   Will the NZ Warriors abandon the NRL Monika?

UN stands for United Nations but everyone calls it the UN, despite the member nations not being united. 

Anyway, all flights of fancy are allowed in the off season when there is no F in rugby.

[iffleyox]

9 hours ago, idrewthehaggis said:

 

I used to live near Ashbourne and a visit at Shrovetide will tell you that it wasn't fee paying Jono and Guy who invented it. 

 

 

Now that really is The Greatest Game, besides which RU and RL are mere children's hobbies. My great grandfather  turned up the ball* twice.

 

*Ashbourne for kicking off - you got your name on a board in the pub.

Edited December 20, 2022 by iffleyox

[Wellsy4HullFC]

12 hours ago, JohnM said:

It doesn't matter what it stands for . It has a certain resonance, it rolls off the tongue. It suggests an alignment with other sports. Isn't the NFL considering a UK franchise? Will they change the name from NFL to TFL Transnational Football League?   Will the NZ Warriors abandon the NRL Monika?

UN stands for United Nations but everyone calls it the UN, despite the member nations not being united. 

Anyway, all flights of fancy are allowed in the off season when there is no F in rugby.

I think the aim for the UN is to unite nations though, so it still applies.

I just think NRL Europe (same when NFL did it) is an oxymoron. National and European within the name is ridiculous.

 

If it doesn't matter what the first letter stands for, why not use X? XFL is relaunching with The Rock next year I believe. Don't think the X stands for anything anymore. Could be part of a marketing strategy!

 

XRL

[DI Keith Fowler]

1 minute ago, Wellsy4HullFC said:

I think the aim for the UN is to unite nations though, so it still applies.

I just think NRL Europe (same when NFL did it) is an oxymoron. National and European within the name is ridiculous.

 

If it doesn't matter what the first letter stands for, why not use X? XFL is relaunching with The Rock next year I believe. Don't think the X stands for anything anymore. Could be part of a marketing strategy!

 

XRL

I believe it stands for Xtreme, which should tell you everything you need to know about it.

[Wellsy4HullFC]

Just now, DI Keith Fowler said:

I believe it stands for Xtreme, which should tell you everything you need to know about it.

I think it did originally, but now it's just an X.