IMG Grading Unveiled

[sentoffagain2]

9 minutes ago, The Blues Ox said:

And there we have it as suspected there is a very much a chance that the status quo is acheived as Fev chairman comes out and says that Fev are currently behind every SL club on their ranking. He does not say how close it is but it looks like a must for them to get in this season otherwise it looks unlikely they will ever get a chance. 

   Right with that Oxy Fev are too close to Cas and Wakey to fit into their proposals.

[The Blues Ox]

1 hour ago, sentoffagain2 said:

   Right with that Oxy Fev are too close to Cas and Wakey to fit into their proposals.

Madness that Fev, who have been pro active in trying to improve things over a number of years are still seen as been behind likely Cas and Wakefield when it comes to the criteria. It just goes to show how difficult it is going to be for any team to gain SL status once the chosen few are locked in. Leigh this season would never have happened under the new criteria which seems crazy.

[The Phantom Horseman]

7 minutes ago, The Blues Ox said:

Madness that Fev, who have been pro active in trying to improve things over a number of years are still seen as been behind likely Cas and Wakefield when it comes to the criteria. It just goes to show how difficult it is going to be for any team to gain SL status once the chosen few are locked in. Leigh this season would never have happened under the new criteria which seems crazy.

Yep I have been saying that on this forum for months. Current SL occupancy has a massively favourable factor in terms of so many things that score IMG points - on finances, on crowds, on social media followers, plus on knock-on effects such as merchandise sales etc.

The idea that clubs get points based on a 3,000 home crowd threshold regardless of whether your home crowds are aginst Wigan, Hull, Hull KR, Leeds and St Helens or Keighley, Whitehaven, Newcastle, Barrow or Swinton is so patently preposterous - you have only to look at Leigh's crowds this year compared to some very moderate ones when they were dominating the Championship last season.

That's before you take into account that finishing bottom of SL three years in a row will still score you more IMG points than finishing top of the Championship three years in a row (unless you win the Grand Final).

As you say, Leigh's amazing year probably wouldn't have happened under the IMG system, and Fev have made no bones about the fact that they see this as the last chance for the club to get into SL. It's not hard to imagine Derek Beaumont would have lost interest if this system had been in place a couple of years ago, and whether Mark Campbell will feel motivated to continue with the huge amount of work he has put into Fev remains to be seen if they don't go up.

 

[sentoffagain2]

     Agree with TPH above post.I also look at the progress Hull KR have made since they achieved promotion from The Championship.Who are the better examples for SL KR and Leigh or Wakey and Cas.

[Les Tonks Sidestep]

2 hours ago, The Blues Ox said:

And there we have it as suspected there is a very much a chance that the status quo is acheived as Fev chairman comes out and says that Fev are currently behind every SL club on their ranking. He does not say how close it is but it looks like a must for them to get in this season otherwise it looks unlikely they will ever get a chance. 

Not sure that's much of a surprise. 

[glossop saint]

3 hours ago, The Blues Ox said:

Madness that Fev, who have been pro active in trying to improve things over a number of years are still seen as been behind likely Cas and Wakefield when it comes to the criteria. It just goes to show how difficult it is going to be for any team to gain SL status once the chosen few are locked in. Leigh this season would never have happened under the new criteria which seems crazy.

Too much emphasis on results? Yet that is what so many people want.

[The Phantom Horseman]

7 minutes ago, glossop saint said:

Too much emphasis on results? Yet that is what so many people want.

Think you need to explain that?

[glossop saint]

20 minutes ago, The Phantom Horseman said:

Think you need to explain that?

Sorry Phantom, I'm in a mischievous mood. Just that the irony of it being the results part of the grading that will likely seal the fate of those in and out of SL when a better run club that is doing all the right things doesn't make it in. If results weren't so a big percentage of the score then maybe Fev would get in.

No offence was intended. As has been said I think Fev have worked hard over the last decade or so and deserve a shot at SL.

[The Phantom Horseman]

4 minutes ago, glossop saint said:

Sorry Phantom, I'm in a mischievous mood. Just that the irony of it being the results part of the grading that will likely seal the fate of those in and out of SL when a better run club that is doing all the right things doesn't make it in. If results weren't so a big percentage of the score then maybe Fev would get in.

No offence was intended. As has been said I think Fev have worked hard over the last decade or so and deserve a shot at SL.

Ah ok. I prefer the term "SL occupancy" rather than "results", as for instance Wakefield have won 28 of their 93 league games (30%) since 2020, whereas Fev have won 68 out of 75 (91%).

[glossop saint]

3 minutes ago, The Phantom Horseman said:

Ah ok. I prefer the term "SL occupancy" rather than "results", as for instance Wakefield have won 28 of their 93 league games (30%) since 2020, whereas Fev have won 68 out of 75 (91%).

Good term. I'll use that in future. I can't remember what IMG use. On field performance maybe?

Edit. I've looked it up. It's 'Performance'.

Edited August 30, 2023 by glossop saint

[Harry Stottle]

5 hours ago, The Blues Ox said:

And there we have it as suspected there is a very much a chance that the status quo is acheived as Fev chairman comes out and says that Fev are currently behind every SL club on their ranking. He does not say how close it is but it looks like a must for them to get in this season otherwise it looks unlikely they will ever get a chance. 

Off course they will get a chance. Just ensure they get promoted this season.

[Harry Stottle]

4 hours ago, The Phantom Horseman said:

Yep I have been saying that on this forum for months. Current SL occupancy has a massively favourable factor in terms of so many things that score IMG points - on finances, on crowds, on social media followers, plus on knock-on effects such as merchandise sales etc.

The idea that clubs get points based on a 3,000 home crowd threshold regardless of whether your home crowds are aginst Wigan, Hull, Hull KR, Leeds and St Helens or Keighley, Whitehaven, Newcastle, Barrow or Swinton is so patently preposterous - you have only to look at Leigh's crowds this year compared to some very moderate ones when they were dominating the Championship last season.

That's before you take into account that finishing bottom of SL three years in a row will still score you more IMG points than finishing top of the Championship three years in a row (unless you win the Grand Final).

As you say, Leigh's amazing year probably wouldn't have happened under the IMG system, and Fev have made no bones about the fact that they see this as the last chance for the club to get into SL. It's not hard to imagine Derek Beaumont would have lost interest if this system had been in place a couple of years ago, and whether Mark Campbell will feel motivated to continue with the huge amount of work he has put into Fev remains to be seen if they don't go up.

 

The most deplorable thing is that there are those who consider the IMG thingy should be called sport in the effort for gaining promotion.

[Jill Halfpenny fan]

Could someone who understands the process explain if the following is possible:

London somehow fluke their way through the play offs and win promotion.  They replaced Wakefield. Next season they manage to finish 11th. Wakefield failed to win the championship the following year finishing third and not making the play off final.  However when we run the spreadsheet Wakefield outscore all the championship clubs and also London.  Thus we relegate London and promote Wakefield. Because if that is possible I can imagine the outcry.

[The Blues Ox]

1 minute ago, Jill Halfpenny fan said:

Could someone who understands the process explain if the following is possible:

London somehow fluke their way through the play offs and win promotion.  They replaced Wakefield. Next season they manage to finish 11th. Wakefield failed to win the championship the following year finishing third and not making the play off final.  However when we run the spreadsheet Wakefield outscore all the championship clubs and also London.  Thus we relegate London and promote Wakefield. Because if that is possible I can imagine the outcry.

That is all correct and how it is going to work going forward. Brill aint it. 

[Les Tonks Sidestep]

2 minutes ago, The Blues Ox said:

That is all correct and how it is going to work going forward. Brill aint it. 

If someone like JHF doesn't understand how it will work at this late stage I think there could well be an awful lot of surprised folk come the end of the 2024 season.....

[Spidey]

23 minutes ago, Jill Halfpenny fan said:

Could someone who understands the process explain if the following is possible:

London somehow fluke their way through the play offs and win promotion.  They replaced Wakefield. Next season they manage to finish 11th. Wakefield failed to win the championship the following year finishing third and not making the play off final.  However when we run the spreadsheet Wakefield outscore all the championship clubs and also London.  Thus we relegate London and promote Wakefield. Because if that is possible I can imagine the outcry.

I think you'd need a Grade A club in 12th in SL for that scenario to occur

[Jill Halfpenny fan]

Just now, Spidey said:

I think you'd need a Grade A club in 12th in SL for that scenario to occur

Surely all the twelfth place club need do is score more points than London.

[Spidey]

1 minute ago, Jill Halfpenny fan said:

Surely all the twelfth place club need do is score more points than London.

Would be interesting to know how high London in this example would need to finish to avoid being outscored by clubs below

Its all clear as Mud - I'm sure we'll all know the full details at the appropriate time

 

[Chrispmartha]

44 minutes ago, Jill Halfpenny fan said:

Could someone who understands the process explain if the following is possible:

London somehow fluke their way through the play offs and win promotion.  They replaced Wakefield. Next season they manage to finish 11th. Wakefield failed to win the championship the following year finishing third and not making the play off final.  However when we run the spreadsheet Wakefield outscore all the championship clubs and also London.  Thus we relegate London and promote Wakefield. Because if that is possible I can imagine the outcry.

Well it would at least show SL isn’t a closed shop

[WakefieldCityLoyal]

49 minutes ago, Jill Halfpenny fan said:

Could someone who understands the process explain if the following is possible:

London somehow fluke their way through the play offs and win promotion.  They replaced Wakefield. Next season they manage to finish 11th. Wakefield failed to win the championship the following year finishing third and not making the play off final.  However when we run the spreadsheet Wakefield outscore all the championship clubs and also London.  Thus we relegate London and promote Wakefield. Because if that is possible I can imagine the outcry.

That’s correct if a SL grade B scores lower than a championship grade B the championship grade B will be promoted.  Getting promoted this season if you’re a weak B will be interesting, that’s if they keep it 12 team league.

[WakefieldCityLoyal]

32 minutes ago, Spidey said:

Would be interesting to know how high London in this example would need to finish to avoid being outscored by clubs below

Its all clear as Mud - I'm sure we'll all know the full details at the appropriate time

 

The first few seasons will be interesting, when are IMG scores announced? is it a live scoring system? You could know who’s relegated/promoted before season even starts.

Up the Trin 

[Jill Halfpenny fan]

2 minutes ago, WakefieldCityLoyal said:

The first few seasons will be interesting, when are IMG scores announced? is it a live scoring system? You could know who’s relegated/promoted before season even starts.

Up the Trin 

That's the conclusion I've come to.  This could be fun.

[Les Tonks Sidestep]

2 hours ago, The Blues Ox said:

That is all correct and how it is going to work going forward. Brill aint it. 

Even funnier if they finished 13th or 14th.....

Edited August 30, 2023 by Les Tonks Sidestep

[bobbruce]

2 hours ago, Jill Halfpenny fan said:

Could someone who understands the process explain if the following is possible:

London somehow fluke their way through the play offs and win promotion.  They replaced Wakefield. Next season they manage to finish 11th. Wakefield failed to win the championship the following year finishing third and not making the play off final.  However when we run the spreadsheet Wakefield outscore all the championship clubs and also London.  Thus we relegate London and promote Wakefield. Because if that is possible I can imagine the outcry.

Wouldn’t that only happen if Wakefield became a B grading I don’t think any C graded club gets preference over another C graded club. 

[JM2010]

I thought it was basically the lowest finishing grade B club gets replaced by the Championship GF winner as long as they are also Grade B. If Broncos finished 11th they’d only get relegated if the club in 12th was a Grade A. If the 12th placed club was a Grade B then they’d go down. 
I don’t think it’s got anything to do with grading points. Bs can replace Bs and As are exempt