Keighley sack there coach.

[guess who]

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=pfbid0n7wBXestEuvtDe9o9YRvUdswrxQo8mKbRcWSmqzEJ6pAARqDKEDnL4aARhJ7oEzvl&id=100063841873884

[RBKnight]

Wow...... world's gone mad is my first reaction 

[Jughead]

I don’t get that. 5 wins from 11 is a good start to life in the Championship. 

[David Shepherd]

Got to be more than performance to this. You’d be mad to be disappointed with mid table in your first year after promotion.

maybe he said something nice about IMG

Edited May 15, 2023 by David Shepherd

[gazza77]

Feels like the board had over ambitious targets to me, for this year at least, and that's without the IMG issues... 

[Damien]

34 minutes ago, RBKnight said:

Wow...... world's gone mad is my first reaction 

Funny, mine was it's their and not there

[Cw25]

They have only just got up. But I still expected them to have done a tad better. Not exactly a disaster.So I am surprised.

[IM2]

2 hours ago, David Shepherd said:

Got to be more than performance to this. You’d be mad to be disappointed with mid table in your first year after promotion.

maybe he said something nice about IMG

Maybe they found out he was a Londoner?

[Snowys Backside]

I think they have someone lined up !!!

[Ragingbull]

Players walking out, coach gone, further issues behind the scenes.  Seems there is big trouble in K Town. 

[The Blues Ox]

8 hours ago, Ragingbull said:

Players walking out, coach gone, further issues behind the scenes.  Seems there is big trouble in K Town. 

Its almost like they are trying to keep up with the Jones's. 

[OriginalMrC]

All is not well in Keighley. I expect a fan share ownership crowdfunder to be launched soon 

[Dovster]

Deinitely a bit of a suprise. I think generally the fans are very happy with our current position but the owners are expecting a lot more. Their investment has not had the returns they had hoped for. Unfortunately for Ryys, Coaches are not allowed a great deal of time to get things right.

Hopefully we have a plan b.

[RP London]

13 minutes ago, Dovster said:

Deinitely a bit of a suprise. I think generally the fans are very happy with our current position but the owners are expecting a lot more. Their investment has not had the returns they had hoped for. Unfortunately for Ryys, Coaches are not allowed a great deal of time to get things right.

Hopefully we have a plan b.

problem is, add another couple of positions up the ladder and the return on investment will not be much changed.. they need to look at the investment, where it is and where the return can come from (ie their own performance as businessmen) before looking at the coaching staff if that is their issue. 

It strikes me that they are not prepared to do the work off the field (I know they have done a fair bit before anyone says anything) that is needed to get the returns and growth they are looking for, and by that I also mean the time it takes to for effects to be seen. They just assume that what happens on the pitch directly changes the P&L which it wont without other things, the exact point IMG have made all along. Therefore the only way to get a return is on the pitch, which it isnt, and hence this decision which seems strange. 

Hope I am wrong but if I am close with any of the above then they could be in trouble medium to long term. 

[sentoffagain2]

   They need to all stick together to stay in The Championship.That was all they needed to do in their first year back.Then get things sorted during the close season.

[Dovster]

6 minutes ago, RP London said:

problem is, add another couple of positions up the ladder and the return on investment will not be much changed.. they need to look at the investment, where it is and where the return can come from (ie their own performance as businessmen) before looking at the coaching staff if that is their issue. 

It strikes me that they are not prepared to do the work off the field (I know they have done a fair bit before anyone says anything) that is needed to get the returns and growth they are looking for, and by that I also mean the time it takes to for effects to be seen. They just assume that what happens on the pitch directly changes the P&L which it wont without other things, the exact point IMG have made all along. Therefore the only way to get a return is on the pitch, which it isnt, and hence this decision which seems strange. 

Hope I am wrong but if I am close with any of the above then they could be in trouble medium to long term. 

I again disagree with most of your points.

People will support a winning team. This has always been the case despite what IMG have to say on the subject (and I really don't want to get into that debate again). The Keighley owners have invested heavily into the club - on all fronts.

You need on-field performance to maximise off field investment. We currently are not achieving this. Hence the change in coach.

 

[RP London]

8 minutes ago, Dovster said:

I again disagree with most of your points.

People will support a winning team. This has always been the case despite what IMG have to say on the subject (and I really don't want to get into that debate again). The Keighley owners have invested heavily into the club - on all fronts.

You need on-field performance to maximise off field investment. We currently are not achieving this. Hence the change in coach.

 

of course it helps but you also have to wait for these positive things to really hit... 2 more wins would have made very little difference to the bottom line... what if you suddenly now have a bad run of form due to this change?.. you have to build so that those fluctuations on the field do not affect so much the club off it (which is where IMG are coming from IMHO, they know people will support a winning team, to say they don't know that or don't accept that is silly as they are not stupid, but thats not the issue here).. I just feel as though they are going with the on field being the most important and the impact need to be immediate where as actually they need to give everything a bit of time. The on field is good, much better than many who get promoted, they need to let that build whilst building the bits off it

The change in coach will not guarantee any improvement on the pitch so its a massive risk, where a longer term view may increase the return long term. That's why for me it seems odd and suggests that there are other issues, ie they are so desperate for the on field to work to cover those cracks.. which is a worry, again, long term because the on the pitch is always uncertain with injuries and form so to build it so heavily dependent on that is IMHO a mistake, as so often with coaches and managers there is a "be careful what you wish for".. the messiah doesn't have the best of records in actually showing up.

Also just because they have invested heavily does not mean they have invested wisely.. 

As I say I hope I am wrong and you may disagree but its just 2 opinions without seeing bank balances or really knowing what these people are thinking (away from what they may say in an interview). I don't want to see any club go to the wall (been there and done that) but, as i say, it just, for me, is a worrying sign when a club actually is doing well.

[Click]

30 minutes ago, Dovster said:

I again disagree with most of your points.

People will support a winning team. This has always been the case despite what IMG have to say on the subject (and I really don't want to get into that debate again). The Keighley owners have invested heavily into the club - on all fronts.

You need on-field performance to maximise off field investment. We currently are not achieving this. Hence the change in coach.

 

In my opinion, it is incredibly hard to go from promotion to continue getting more wins than loses after you're in the higher division. Unless you are spending Toronto money and moving from L1 to Champ, then the teams are a lot more even, I can't say looking at the Keighley side that they are too far from where they should be. If Rhys had been given another year, I am sure he would have kept on improving their performances

[Expatknight]

45 minutes ago, Dovster said:

I again disagree with most of your points.

People will support a winning team. This has always been the case despite what IMG have to say on the subject (and I really don't want to get into that debate again). The Keighley owners have invested heavily into the club - on all fronts.

You need on-field performance to maximise off field investment. We currently are not achieving this. Hence the change in coach.

 

You say people will support a winning team, which to some extent I agree with, but historically what has been the maximum gate for Keighley, it will never ever be where they probably need it to be a success in Super League which is what I assume was behind the investment from the current owners, it is the same for the majority of Championship sides the fan base just isn’t there and there are so many other things out there for people to spend their money on unlike in the 1950s , 60s and 70s. And has been said for a newly promoted side they are where you would expect, it is a big step up from League 1 in so many ways and not just in the quality of the players. I don’t think Lovegrove has been given long enough to establish his side in the Championship and also like has already been said you do not get instant success unless you are spending mega money and even then it isn’t guaranteed ask Fev last season. 

[Dovster]

21 minutes ago, RP London said:

of course it helps but you also have to wait for these positive things to really hit... 2 more wins would have made very little difference to the bottom line... what if you suddenly now have a bad run of form due to this change?.. you have to build so that those fluctuations on the field do not affect so much the club off it (which is where IMG are coming from IMHO, they know people will support a winning team, to say they don't know that or don't accept that is silly as they are not stupid, but thats not the issue here).. I just feel as though they are going with the on field being the most important and the impact need to be immediate where as actually they need to give everything a bit of time. The on field is good, much better than many who get promoted, they need to let that build whilst building the bits off it

The change in coach will not guarantee any improvement on the pitch so its a massive risk, where a longer term view may increase the return long term. That's why for me it seems odd and suggests that there are other issues, ie they are so desperate for the on field to work to cover those cracks.. which is a worry, again, long term because the on the pitch is always uncertain with injuries and form so to build it so heavily dependent on that is IMHO a mistake, as so often with coaches and managers there is a "be careful what you wish for".. the messiah doesn't have the best of records in actually showing up.

Also just because they have invested heavily does not mean they have invested wisely.. 

As I say I hope I am wrong and you may disagree but its just 2 opinions without seeing bank balances or really knowing what these people are thinking (away from what they may say in an interview). I don't want to see any club go to the wall (been there and done that) but, as i say, it just, for me, is a worrying sign when a club actually is doing well.

 

22 minutes ago, RP London said:

of course it helps but you also have to wait for these positive things to really hit... 2 more wins would have made very little difference to the bottom line... what if you suddenly now have a bad run of form due to this change?.. you have to build so that those fluctuations on the field do not affect so much the club off it (which is where IMG are coming from IMHO, they know people will support a winning team, to say they don't know that or don't accept that is silly as they are not stupid, but thats not the issue here).. I just feel as though they are going with the on field being the most important and the impact need to be immediate where as actually they need to give everything a bit of time. The on field is good, much better than many who get promoted, they need to let that build whilst building the bits off it

The change in coach will not guarantee any improvement on the pitch so its a massive risk, where a longer term view may increase the return long term. That's why for me it seems odd and suggests that there are other issues, ie they are so desperate for the on field to work to cover those cracks.. which is a worry, again, long term because the on the pitch is always uncertain with injuries and form so to build it so heavily dependent on that is IMHO a mistake, as so often with coaches and managers there is a "be careful what you wish for".. the messiah doesn't have the best of records in actually showing up.

Also just because they have invested heavily does not mean they have invested wisely.. 

As I say I hope I am wrong and you may disagree but its just 2 opinions without seeing bank balances or really knowing what these people are thinking (away from what they may say in an interview). I don't want to see any club go to the wall (been there and done that) but, as i say, it just, for me, is a worrying sign when a club actually is doing well.

In my opinion the owners can see how far away from the top teams we actually are. We have suffered three heavy home defeats against the top three teams.

The fans can also see this and know there is no hope of competing with these sides this year. Personally I am happy with results (in the main) so far but i'm not investing the money.

I do think we may be trying to move too quickly to the next level (top end Championship). I always thought this should have been a year of consolidation. Maybe this is Barrows fault for showing what could be done in your first season in the Championship - Only Joking BTW.

I do agree with you when you say we a not have invested wisely. This maybe the reason for Rhys leaving. As you say we don't reallyknow at this time.

Obviously all is not well at the club at this time and I'm sure the blame game is in full swing. However talking of the clubs demise I think is a little premature I believe.

[steve oates]

13 hours ago, David Shepherd said:

maybe he said something nice about IMG

Shouldn't think so, what is nice about meddling self serving consultants? 

[Dovster]

4 minutes ago, Expatknight said:

You say people will support a winning team, which to some extent I agree with, but historically what has been the maximum gate for Keighley, it will never ever be where they probably need it to be a success in Super League which is what I assume was behind the investment from the current owners, it is the same for the majority of Championship sides the fan base just isn’t there and there are so many other things out there for people to spend their money on unlike in the 1950s , 60s and 70s. And has been said for a newly promoted side they are where you would expect, it is a big step up from League 1 in so many ways and not just in the quality of the players. I don’t think Lovegrove has been given long enough to establish his side in the Championship and also like has already been said you do not get instant success unless you are spending mega money and even then it isn’t guaranteed ask Fev last season. 

Don't want to debate your opinion on whether Keighley could ever be more than what they are, as this is just opinion and I'm sure we are miles apart and never agree.

I agree that on the face of the Cougars mid table position is ok. However this doesn't match the investment.

Unfortunately for Lovegrove the owners seem to think this is his fault.

 

[Dovster]

34 minutes ago, Click said:

In my opinion, it is incredibly hard to go from promotion to continue getting more wins than loses after you're in the higher division. Unless you are spending Toronto money and moving from L1 to Champ, then the teams are a lot more even, I can't say looking at the Keighley side that they are too far from where they should be. If Rhys had been given another year, I am sure he would have kept on improving their performances

I agree it is difficult although Barrow and I think Whitehaven before them did very well in their first promoted season. This with a smaller budget than Keighley.

It looks as though mistakes have been made and Lovegrove is the one being blamed.

We don't really know the reasons at this point. It's all guesswork.

 

[steve oates]

1 hour ago, Dovster said:

I again disagree with most of your points.

People will support a winning team. This has always been the case despite what IMG have to say on the subject (and I really don't want to get into that debate again). The Keighley owners have invested heavily into the club - on all fronts. You need on-field performance to maximise off field investment. We currently are not achieving this. Hence the change in coach.

Yeh lets leave GMI out of it. If these owners want to throw money about and change personnel on and off the pitch at  every twist and turn it's up to them and frankly I find it exciting. Especial against the league of "A"s nonsense we are having to put up with. It was exciting enough when Cougarmania came along so having been there done that, I look forward to "Little Keighley" taking  as many big scalps as soon as possible, and especially when they get to Superleague.

I know they they may not be allowed in. Do you know if these two guys ever contemplated buying Bradford?

[Dovster]

1 hour ago, steve oates said:

Yeh lets leave GMI out of it. If these owners want to throw money about and change personnel on and off the pitch at  every twist and turn it's up to them and frankly I find it exciting. Especial against the league of "A"s nonsense we are having to put up with. It was exciting enough when Cougarmania came along so having been there done that, I look forward to "Little Keighley" taking  as many big scalps as soon as possible, and especially when they get to Superleague.

I know they they may not be allowed in. Do you know if these two guys ever contemplated buying Bradford?

I really don't think Keighley would be allowed into Super League under the proposed plans. We're not really what IMG are looking for. I think the best we could achieve at the moment is a good Championship team. The owners have plans to improve the stadium and are making a difference in the community. All these plans were already in place before IMG came on the scene.

I doubt very much that the current owners would go near the bulls. One of them is the son of Mick O'Neil who was one of the founders of the Cougars back in the nineties.