Football

[Tommygilf]

On 25/01/2021 at 20:05, Futtocks said:

Lampard may have been wrong to take the job at a club where he was a playing legend. Even if that club didn't have a record of firing people prematurely.

He comes across as pretty bright and keen on learning everything he can about management, so I'd expect him to find a club soon, do well, and maybe bite Chelsea on the bum some way down the line.

I really don't get the sense he's exceptional, I think he's actually been very lucky with his managerial appointments at Derby and Chelsea. From what I've read he also engenders a very "in crowd" culture with his favourites in a given squad, not too dissimilar from how he's reported to have been for England, which seems to have caused at least some problems. I don't think Tuschel is an outstanding appointment either tbh, but certainly has better credentials than Lampard.

The obvious comparison for Lampard is Gerrard at Rangers and as much as it pains me to say it he is doing an excellent job there, and has been for 3 seasons really. I've no doubt Gerrard will manage Liverpool one day, but unlike Lampard, I get the sense he will only take that "hero returns" job when he's ready. If Lampard had stayed at Derby, maybe got them up in his second season, then kept them up this year, I think everyone would have a far more positive view of his managerial credentials. FWIW a pretty average first season at Derby (given the players he had access to) plus a very good first season at Chelsea given the transfer ban and emphasis on (often English) youth have been wiped out by 9 weeks of poor results.

I can't help but laugh at Chelsea here as ultimately it comes down to them. Much like Bruce at Newcastle or Dyche at Burnley or even Ole at Man United, there are issues way above the manager at the club that are deeply problematic.

[17 stone giant]

Am I the only one who doesn't get the constant fuss about VAR?

When it comes to offsides, surely officials have always drawn a line in their heads regarding where they believe the forward to be and where they believed the defender to be, and then compared them. That's what offside is.

I get that deciding exactly where to draw the line isn't an exact science, especially when it's something like a players arm - as per Ings against Villa. But having drawn the line where they (VAR) think it should be, it's a simple case of which line is then nearer the goal. I just don't get the fuss. Ings was offside based on the lines drawn. Yes, he was offside by a millimetre or two, but so what? You need to have a cut off somewhere. Even if you change the rules so that a forward can be, say, 5 millimetres nearer the goal than the defender and still be onside, you're then going to get a case where the forward is 6 millimetres nearer.

Yeah, let's get rid of VAR and then we can again have offside decisions like this one. I'm sure no Dutch fans would have complained had that disallowed goal proved costly to their World Cup qualification chances - 5 mins 33 seconds into video. Only played onside by three England defenders and by about a metre! Graham Taylor always conveniently forgot about it too, when complaining about being cheated later on in that game.

Netherlands 2-0 England (1993) WCQ - YouTube

 

[Gerrumonside ref]

1 hour ago, 17 stone giant said:

Am I the only one who doesn't get the constant fuss about VAR?

When it comes to offsides, surely officials have always drawn a line in their heads regarding where they believe the forward to be and where they believed the defender to be, and then compared them. That's what offside is.

I get that deciding exactly where to draw the line isn't an exact science, especially when it's something like a players arm - as per Ings against Villa. But having drawn the line where they (VAR) think it should be, it's a simple case of which line is then nearer the goal. I just don't get the fuss. Ings was offside based on the lines drawn. Yes, he was offside by a millimetre or two, but so what? You need to have a cut off somewhere. Even if you change the rules so that a forward can be, say, 5 millimetres nearer the goal than the defender and still be onside, you're then going to get a case where the forward is 6 millimetres nearer.

Yeah, let's get rid of VAR and then we can again have offside decisions like this one. I'm sure no Dutch fans would have complained had that disallowed goal proved costly to their World Cup qualification chances - 5 mins 33 seconds into video. Only played onside by three England defenders and by about a metre! Graham Taylor always conveniently forgot about it too, when complaining about being cheated later on in that game.

Netherlands 2-0 England (1993) WCQ - YouTube

 

You will never get every decision correct while there is a human element in the decision making process.

Football currently is banging itself on the head trying to square that circle with the only winner being ex referees.

The game at the moment is suffering as a spectacle with a slavish attempt to get every decision correct with substandard technology.  

 

[tim2]

Handball and offside have always been contentious - in this respect VAR isn't the problem, the laws of the game and the interpretation rulings are.

VAR just makes it worse by slowing things down and creating more uncertainty.

For offside, VAR should only, IMO, overrule a decision that is clearly wrong. That is, where the player is absolutely beyond the last defender at the point the pass is made. The real "howlers".

For handball, I'd prefer to see it being used only where the hand contact has been completely missed by the officials. The comms between the VAR and the ref/ARs should clear that up quickly.

Maybe it will settle down, but right now it's not helping the game IMO.

[gingerjon]

8 minutes ago, tim2 said:

Handball and offside have always been contentious - in this respect VAR isn't the problem, the laws of the game and the interpretation rulings are.

VAR just makes it worse by slowing things down and creating more uncertainty.

For offside, VAR should only, IMO, overrule a decision that is clearly wrong. That is, where the player is absolutely beyond the last defender at the point the pass is made. The real "howlers".

For handball, I'd prefer to see it being used only where the hand contact has been completely missed by the officials. The comms between the VAR and the ref/ARs should clear that up quickly.

Maybe it will settle down, but right now it's not helping the game IMO.

The problem I have is that not even the programmers are claiming that the VAR system is 100% accurate. There is margin of error.

Football really should have swallowed its pride and gone along with the Umpire's Call that cricket has.

[Mister Ting]

6 hours ago, gingerjon said:

The problem I have is that not even the programmers are claiming that the VAR system is 100% accurate. There is margin of error.

Football really should have swallowed its pride and gone along with the Umpire's Call that cricket has.

Or perhaps a degree of common sense when using VAR?

[DavidM]

Just come across this picture from an FA Cup match between Workington Reds and Manchester United in January 1958

Goalkeeper Harry  Gregg
Defender Roger Byrne
Defender Bill Foulkes
Defender Mark  Jones
Midfielder Eddie Colman
Midfielder Duncan  Edwards
Midfielder Kenny Morgans
Midfielder Albert Scanlon
Midfielder/Forward Bobby Charlton
Forward Tommy Taylor
Forward Dennis  Viollet

[Tommygilf]

Starting to think Rangers' post-Christmas collapse isn't coming...

[Wiltshire Rhino]

In Portugal's Primeira Liga, another win for Sporting puts them 10pts clear of 2nd placed Porto.

I'm still expecting them to somehow mess it up as, with 15 games left, it's way too early to be "happy".  

[Moose]

Leeds 3-0 Southampton 

A fabulous goal and all round performance from Raphinha, what a player, a joy to watch

[Robin Evans]

Barnsley..... just nuts....

[Bleep1673]

5 hours ago, Robin Evans said:

Barnsley..... just nuts....

I thought they were for the "Chop"?

[Robin Evans]

14 minutes ago, Bleep1673 said:

I thought they were for the "Chop"?

Go and stand in a corner and consider your actions!!

[Bleep1673]

Europa Cup draw

Ajax v Young Boys

Dynamo Kiev v Villareal

Roma v Shaktar Donetsk

Olympiakos v Arsenal

Dinamo Zagreb v Tottenham

Man Utd v AC Milan

Slavia Prague v Rangers

Granada v Molde

[Wanderer]

44 minutes ago, Bleep1673 said:

Europa Cup draw

Ajax v Young Boys

Dynamo Kiev v Villareal

Roma v Shaktar Donetsk

Olympiakos v Arsenal

Dinamo Zagreb v Tottenham

Man Utd v AC Milan

Slavia Prague v Rangers

Granada v Molde

At least there's a bit of variety here, Champions League bores me to death.

Was disappointed by Arsenal's late winner last night and we'll probably end up with a final of usual suspects e.g. United v Arsenal

[Bleep1673]

On 26/02/2021 at 12:22, Bleep1673 said:

Europa Cup draw

Ajax v Young Boys

Dynamo Kiev v Villareal

Roma v Shaktar Donetsk

Olympiakos v Arsenal

Dinamo Zagreb v Tottenham

Man Utd v AC Milan

Slavia Prague v Rangers

Granada v Molde

My choices in Bold

[17 stone giant]

On 23/02/2021 at 20:11, Moose said:

Leeds 3-0 Southampton 

A fabulous goal and all round performance from Raphinha, what a player, a joy to watch

We could have played until midnight and still not scored. I thought we started ok, but our inability to score means that the opposition know they just need to stay patient and take their chance(s) when it comes along. Leeds did that and they deserved to win. I don't think I've ever seen so many players slip over in a match. I'm sure everyone will be glad when the pitch is fixed. Frustrating times as a Saints fan, but I think we'll pick up enough points in the next few months to be safe. I'll take 17th and an FA Cup win (which of course won't happen).

[Bleep1673]

The Governments of the UK & the Republic of Ireland have launched a joint bid to hold the 2032 football world cup. I can tell you right now this will never be approved by FIFA, as all 4 UK countries, England Scotland, Northern Ireland, and Wales would automatically qualify as hosts, as would Ireland, therefore filling 5 qualifying places, and as FIFA have already suggested multiple host bids would not be accepted, why are they going for this? Would NI, Scotland and Wales allow an Olympic style GB&NI team? I doubt it, as in 2012 where the majority of players were English anyway.

[Robin Evans]

On 26/02/2021 at 13:09, Wanderer said:

At least there's a bit of variety here, Champions League bores me to death.

Was disappointed by Arsenal's late winner last night and we'll probably end up with a final of usual suspects e.g. United v Arsenal

Hope not

[gingerjon]

54 minutes ago, Bleep1673 said:

The Governments of the UK & the Republic of Ireland have launched a joint bid to hold the 2032 football world cup. I can tell you right now this will never be approved by FIFA, as all 4 UK countries, England Scotland, Northern Ireland, and Wales would automatically qualify as hosts, as would Ireland, therefore filling 5 qualifying places, and as FIFA have already suggested multiple host bids would not be accepted, why are they going for this? Would NI, Scotland and Wales allow an Olympic style GB&NI team? I doubt it, as in 2012 where the majority of players were English anyway.

The only confirmed 'intentions to bid' so far are all partnership bids. The fewest number of teams that would qualify automatically from them is 3, the average is 4.

[Deranged Drunk Guy]

good win for the gunners considering a travel to olympiacos is always testy.

Spurs win 2-0 V Dinamo Zagreb.

Is Granada a sneaky chance to win the entire thing? , seen a few of there games this year , they look like they know football. 

 

[Tommygilf]

On 07/02/2021 at 13:13, Tommygilf said:

Starting to think Rangers' post-Christmas collapse isn't coming...

Oh dear...

[Bleep1673]

Just noticed Salford at Wembley twice within 12 months, Saturday they play the EFL Final from 2019-20 that was postponed because of a virus.

OK, I admit one was a City Reds, and the other is the City (Ammies)

[Wiltshire Rhino]

Beware the Ides of March

No swearing allowed

Edited March 15, 2021 by Wiltshire Rhino

[Bleep1673]

Salford City hold the record for the shortest hold of any trophy anywhere in the world. Less than 24 hours.