IMG Grading System (Many Merged Threads)

[Worzel]

15 minutes ago, Jill Halfpenny fan said:

Yet we've been giving them all that for years and the value of the TV deal consistently reduces. If I was the broadcaster my logic would be along the lines of "How badly do I want this sport, how badly do my competitors want this sport, how cheaply can I get this sport".

We haven't, we really, really haven't. We are a sport with 4 Grand Final winners. In a league of 12 clubs average attendances range from 14,000 to under 5,000, and so the resulting disproportionate spread of resources means that not all matches are as competitive as they could be. I think we have 6 teams who are capable of spending up to the salary cap (the real one i.e. including using marquee allowances), and having a full infrastructure of coaching and support staff, and 6 who don't.

That's why the periodic debate about Catalans, who are probably #3 of those fully resourced 6 clubs, is absolutely ridiculous. The issue is getting the other clubs up to that level... whereas in our sport we've been more focused on getting to a lowest common denominator. 

[kiggy]

31 minutes ago, Worzel said:

I agree with this, the Championship doesn't have a TV deal and so any "exceptional" club should pay the extra costs if they want to join the league. If you can't, don't join.

Similarly in Super League, that comp comes with a TV deal you all collectively sell, and if you can't afford the costs associated with being in that league in order to access that revenue (including foreign travel) then you're very welcome in the Championship.

A question: for those TO matches televised (here in France) do the away side get any revenue from it? 

[Chrispmartha]

4 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said:

What you said. 

That there’s a mountain of work to do?

That IMG can’t do it for them?

That SL has poor numbers?

 

that’s excellent is it?

[Worzel]

1 minute ago, kiggy said:

A question: for those TO matches televised (here in France) do the away side get any revenue from it? 

I don't think there is any revenue from French TV deals. At most they will be done "at cost". Often some of those costs will be being covered by the French club... which the away side is very welcome to contribute to!!   

[Harry Stottle]

7 minutes ago, Chrispmartha said:

That there’s a mountain of work to do?

That IMG can’t do it for them?

That SL has poor numbers?

 

that’s excellent is it?

I was just being facetious Chris, does it make a fan of a club say a regular attendee or a season ticket holder any less of a fan, if they don't interact on the web?

You quote my club as having 3,000 subscribers, yet they have 6,000 members.

Edited October 17, 2024 by Harry Stottle

[Chrispmartha]

16 minutes ago, Harry Stottle said:

I was just being facetious Chris, does it make a fan of a club say a regular attendee or a season ticket holder any less of a fan, if they don't interact on the web?

You quote my club as having 3,000 subscribers, yet they have 6,000 members.

Your first question is a non sequitur and a strawman, nobody has said that.

As for your last point, what actually is your point?

I get the feeling you think digital marketing is pointless, it really isn’t.

[Jill Halfpenny fan]

9 minutes ago, Worzel said:

We haven't, we really, really haven't. We are a sport with 4 Grand Final winners. In a league of 12 clubs average attendances range from 14,000 to under 5,000, and so the resulting disproportionate spread of resources means that not all matches are as competitive as they could be. I think we have 6 teams who are capable of spending up to the salary cap (the real one i.e. including using marquee allowances), and having a full infrastructure of coaching and support staff, and 6 who don't.

That's why the periodic debate about Catalans, who are probably #3 of those fully resourced 6 clubs, is absolutely ridiculous. The issue is getting the other clubs up to that level... whereas in our sport we've been more focused on getting to a lowest common denominator. 

I agree with all of that, its probably why I have such a bee in my bonnet over "the spreadsheet".  However all your offering going forward is the same clubs who have contributed year on year to the above situation. You are never going to get all clubs to the same "high" level, if those at the bottom start winning how will it affect the attendances of those currently at the top. Unfortunately RL fans are fickle, clubs start losing, fans drift away. If St Helens drop to eighth and Huddersfield move to 6th are we going to see a loss or increase in fan numbers? You said yourself Hull KR are currently near their ceiling, the ceiling of some of the others will be lower.

[Forever Trinity]

For anyone interested as there isn't  a match thread for it this week, the game will be live on The Sportsman Channel on YouTube  coverage starts at 6.45pm for the 7pm kick off.

[kiggy]

40 minutes ago, Worzel said:

I don't think there is any revenue from French TV deals. At most they will be done "at cost". Often some of those costs will be being covered by the French club... which the away side is very welcome to contribute to!!   

It used to be the case that TO had to stump up the production costs for a live feed. I'm not so sure if they do now with this ViaOccitanie deal. I'm not as close to the club anymore as I used to be so can't verify it. Maybe @PECETTO can offer a view. 

[Les Tonks Sidestep]

50 minutes ago, Worzel said:

We haven't, we really, really haven't. We are a sport with 4 Grand Final winners. In a league of 12 clubs average attendances range from 14,000 to under 5,000, and so the resulting disproportionate spread of resources means that not all matches are as competitive as they could be. I think we have 6 teams who are capable of spending up to the salary cap (the real one i.e. including using marquee allowances), and having a full infrastructure of coaching and support staff, and 6 who don't.

That's why the periodic debate about Catalans, who are probably #3 of those fully resourced 6 clubs, is absolutely ridiculous. The issue is getting the other clubs up to that level... whereas in our sport we've been more focused on getting to a lowest common denominator. 

And yet it's quite possible that there will be 10 Grade A Clubs (and several more very close) come the announcement of scores....

[Worzel]

1 minute ago, Les Tonks Sidestep said:

And yet it's quite possible that there will be 10 Grade A Clubs (and several more very close) come the announcement of scores....

Yes I agree the A grade criteria is too low if more than that group are given that score. It should probably equate to where I draw the distinction in my post, but like all things this stuff is hard to design and even when you do design it well there are always opportunities to 'game' the criteria I'm afraid. 

[Tommygilf]

27 minutes ago, RP London said:

It's the misunderstanding that not every part has to be directly making money but that some parts are vital for the next stage that will make profit but that that one brick doesn't. foundations/utilities of a building, you can't see them, they cost but dont look nice & you may wonder why you need them, but without them the whole thing is utterly pointless. 

Exactly, it's like accountants trying to get rid of the foil on San Pellegrino not realising that its are part of the reason it's a premium (and more expensive) product. Intangibles have worth.

[PECETTO]

25 minutes ago, kiggy said:

It used to be the case that TO had to stump up the production costs for a live feed. I'm not so sure if they do now with this ViaOccitanie deal. I'm not as close to the club anymore as I used to be so can't verify it. Maybe @PECETTO can offer a view. 

Toulouse pay the production costs 

[The Blues Ox]

What day is it? Not on Sky? If not that must be the first time in years the final has not been televised. Up until this post I genuinely had no idea when the game was been played.

[sam4731]

1 minute ago, The Blues Ox said:

What day is it? Not on Sky? If not that must be the first time in years the final has not been televised. Up until this post I genuinely had no idea when the game was been played.

That's what turning into a meaningless game does.

[Click]

3 minutes ago, sam4731 said:

That's what turning into a meaningless game does.

Didn't the Championship say no to going back to ViaPlay or whatever their name is now it got taken over again for this season?

[Wollo Wollo Wayoo]

6 minutes ago, The Blues Ox said:

What day is it? Not on Sky? If not that must be the first time in years the final has not been televised. Up until this post I genuinely had no idea when the game was been played.

For at least the last three years its been on a Sunday so maybe this years Saturday slot doesn't fit in?

[Click]

1 hour ago, Harry Stottle said:

I was just being facetious Chris, does it make a fan of a club say a regular attendee or a season ticket holder any less of a fan, if they don't interact on the web?

You quote my club as having 3,000 subscribers, yet they have 6,000 members.

That's kind of the point he was making.

[binosh]

Every year this thread comes around regarding Toulouse, as yet not one person can quantify 1 actual genuine reason why they should be “parachuted” into SL

If they earn their place by spending, performing and scoring enough via IMG then fair enough but going off their last outing in SL and their season so far in the championship for a FT team then I won’t be holding my breathe.

All this nonsense about being in Europe and a City is just desperation by Houles and is completely irrelevant.

[Click]

1 minute ago, binosh said:

Every year this thread comes around regarding Toulouse, as yet not one person can quantify 1 actual genuine reason why they should be “parachuted” into SL

If they earn their place by spending, performing and scoring enough via IMG then fair enough but going off their last outing in SL and their season so far in the championship for a FT team then I won’t be holding my breathe.

All this nonsense about being in Europe and a City is just desperation by Houles and is completely irrelevant.

Why is it irrelevant? Because you've decided it is? 

[binosh]

Just now, Click said:

Why is it irrelevant? Because you've decided it is? 

Is it part of IMGs grading system other than catchment? If it isn’t then it’s irrelevant. 

 

[Click]

Just now, binosh said:

Is it part of IMGs grading system other than catchment? If it isn’t then it’s irrelevant. 

 

You talk about how this thread comes up every year about why "Toulouse should be parachuted into SL" and then go on about IMG.

What has IMG's criteria got to do with it if they're talking about parachuting a club into the top division? 

[binosh]

Just now, Click said:

You talk about how this thread comes up every year about why "Toulouse should be parachuted into SL" and then go on about IMG.

What has IMG's criteria got to do with it if they're talking about parachuting a club into the top division? 

Is this a serious question?

What’s so important about Toulouse that IMG/RFL are going to chuck their own 12 year grading process out of the window in year 3 and parachute a french team into the competition.

Unless you can point me to anything that says otherwise and I’ll happily concede. 

I was under the assumption it clearly states that SL will not expand until there are enough Grade A clubs, now if Toulouse end up a Grade A there’s no need to parachute them as they will have earned it which is what I originally posted.

[Griff]

28 minutes ago, The Blues Ox said:

What day is it? 

Thursday today, mate.

[Harry Stottle]

1 hour ago, Chrispmartha said:

Your first question is a non sequitur and a strawman, nobody has said that.

As for your last point, what actually is your point?

I get the feeling you think digital marketing is pointless, it really isn’t.

Christopher I did not say anybody has said that in respect of your first sentance, I am asking the question of you. Read back what I said instead of putting your own version on it. Non sequitur and strawman really, you are not addressing one of your employees.

Whether I think digital marketing is pointless or not is not the issue, again if one does not partake of it, what of it, oh that's right IMG will not give your club any points FFS.