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Sports Prophet

Should Americas have more seats at the WC table

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This sparked when someone mentioned the potential to recruit current Canadian/USA unionites for the Pack. Certainly an additional carrot to playing professional rugby in your own continent would be the opportunity to play in a WC.

Then I wondered if a full strength Canada or USA would be capable of beating a full strength Ire/Scot/Wales.

Does Europe deserve its seven spots for the World Cup?

Edited by Sports Prophet

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1 hour ago, SL17 said:

They wouldn’t be capable of beating an amateur side. That’s the level they are at.

For possibly the first time ever, I agree with you.

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Assuming heritage players are being excluded (the US beat Wales not that long ago with them) then they wouldn't be close, but frankly I can't see Canada/US/Jamaica being much different in quality to Greece and the like so you could perhaps argue that last European WC spot.

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1 hour ago, TIWIT said:

For possibly the first time ever, I agree with you.

I’m not saying things can’t change..

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9 hours ago, Wollongong said:

The ultimate must be a 24 country World Cup within the next two world cups. 


8 European 

8 Oceania/ Asia

4 Americas 

4 Africa /Middle East

Ideally yes but we’d be at risk of having some absolute mis-matches that might switch people off.
 

I like the idea of a 16 team w/c with a developing nations w/c running alongside it at the same time. Those teams wouldn’t then get thrashed by 100 point score lines and it would give smaller clubs the chance to host matches - eg if that was happening next year there could be games at Widnes, Sheffield, Workington, Whitehaven etc etc. Who wouldn’t want to see Chile v Nigeria at Craven Park. 

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1 hour ago, Heritage XIII said:

Should start off 2 less for Australasia Pacific and 1 less for the home nations & add 1 for Africa & 1 for Asia & 1 for Latin America.

1 of the Australia/pacific qualifiers qualified through international repechage against South Africa and the USA. As for the home nations they had to qualify through the European championships/qualifiers and have earned their spot. None of these sides are undeserving imo.

1 problem the current qualification system has is that every quarter finalist qualifies automatically for the next World Cup. I can see the merits of this, but it does have the downside that it gives no respect for location meaning it can result in somewhat lopsided qualification. If everything goes to seedings then we are likely to see only 2 non-pacific nations attain this automatic qualification again (Lebanon and England).

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I think there is a bit too much focus on the world cup, how many teams we have and where they are from comes a little secondary to the wider international game.

We could afford to be a bit more sanguine about the WC and its structure if there was a comprehensive international game around it. 

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7 hours ago, Tommygilf said:

1 of the Australia/pacific qualifiers qualified through international repechage against South Africa and the USA. As for the home nations they had to qualify through the European championships/qualifiers and have earned their spot. None of these sides are undeserving imo.

1 problem the current qualification system has is that every quarter finalist qualifies automatically for the next World Cup. I can see the merits of this, but it does have the downside that it gives no respect for location meaning it can result in somewhat lopsided qualification. If everything goes to seedings then we are likely to see only 2 non-pacific nations attain this automatic qualification again (Lebanon and England).

The only teams who should automatically qualify should be England, Australia, New Zealand and the host nation(s). Turn qualifying into an event in its self

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I'm viewing this thread as a success in itself.  It doesn't feel that long ago we were struggling for teams to play in the World Cup now were arguing about who should be included.

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On 22/01/2020 at 06:25, The 4 of Us said:

A full strength USA or Canada would at this stage in their development struggle to be a full strength NCL side, so no. Not yet. 

 

On 22/01/2020 at 06:27, SL17 said:

They wouldn’t be capable of beating an amateur side. That’s the level they are at.

 

On 22/01/2020 at 08:07, TIWIT said:

For possibly the first time ever, I agree with you.

Strange, USA competed in recent world cups haven't they? I'm sure with heritage players they should be Championship level.

Am I really that out of touch on the matter?

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Greece and Italy both came 2nd in a group of 3 weak European teams.

They should have had to play and beat Canada and USA to qualify, as Cook Islands did.

Too many spots were automatically given to European teams IMO. 

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11 minutes ago, Sir Kevin Sinfield said:

Greece and Italy both came 2nd in a group of 3 weak European teams.

They should have had to play and beat Canada and USA to qualify, as Cook Islands did.

Too many spots were automatically given to European teams IMO. 

I can see that argument. I imagine cost could be prohibitive for some of these teams.

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I don’t want to let anyone who’s able to play to be in the competition, teams should have to be of a certain standard otherwise the tournament will become a laughing stock.
 

Requirements such as a domestic league with x number of teams in or number of registered players in that country would be good too, as well as a minimum number of players from said league in the WC squad, so you can’t have 20-odd blokes from the Queensland and NSW cups rocking up to represent a country none of them have been to before.

With all of that, having a 16 team cup with a competitive qualification process finding the best 16 teams would be marvellous. 

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On 21/01/2020 at 20:24, Wollongong said:

The ultimate must be a 24 country World Cup within the next two world cups. 


8 European 

8 Oceania/ Asia

4 Americas 

4 Africa /Middle East

The union WC isn't even at 24, what makes you think it would work in league? 

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31 minutes ago, TheReaper said:

The union WC isn't even at 24, what makes you think it would work in league? 

How many in the hockey World Cup... or cricket .... or handball... or bowls. 
 

im not basing the comment on the patterns of other sports just on the potential of my sport.

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In answer to the OP No. and have England and New Zealand recouped their money fromn the promoter of the Denver test yet ?

Edited by THE RED ROOSTER
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On 24/01/2020 at 02:11, TheReaper said:

The union WC isn't even at 24, what makes you think it would work in league? 

I think 16 teams is the max. And that's pushing it imo. The recent cricket world cup only had teams and that's a much bigger sport worldwide. 

I'm not an advocate of having minow teams that would struggle in the championship. 

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On 24/01/2020 at 01:33, Sir Kevin Sinfield said:

Greece and Italy both came 2nd in a group of 3 weak European teams.

They should have had to play and beat Canada and USA to qualify, as Cook Islands did.

Too many spots were automatically given to European teams IMO. 

And that is exactly where I was leading to. I think six team repechage for last three or four places would have been great. Giving USA and Canada opportunities to demonstrate themselves as better peforming teams than say Greece, Scotland, Ireland, Cooks et al.

Edited by Sports Prophet
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On 23/01/2020 at 21:46, Wollongong said:

How many in the hockey World Cup... or cricket .... or handball... or bowls.

im not basing the comment on the patterns of other sports just on the potential of my sport.

Hockey has 16, cricket a pitiful 10 and handball has 24.

31 minutes ago, Sports Prophet said:

And that is exactly where I was leading to. I think six team repechage for last three or four places would have been great. Giving USA and Canada opportunities to demonstrate themselves as better peforming teams than say Greece, Scotland, Ireland, Cooks et al.

The governing bodies of the game in those countries don't have any money for such a competition and little prospect of attracting any, so how would they pay for it?

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