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Harry Stottle

Yorkshire Super League

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Interesting hearing Agar's comments on the new rules afterwards hoping to see more focus on the defensive aspect of the game rather than attack attack attack. Straight after his team shipped 48 points that's just too funny.

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13 minutes ago, Moove said:

Interesting hearing Agar's comments on the new rules afterwards hoping to see more focus on the defensive aspect of the game rather than attack attack attack. Straight after his team shipped 48 points that's just too funny.

To be fair, you've taken that right out of context 

Rich did say that its too early to evaluate and that news rules weren't the reason leeds lost.

He gave an honest perspective on the rules whilst acknowledging that his team play crapola 

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Prediction: no Yorkshire Super League team will make the playoffs.

Likely top four (not in order of qualification):  St Helens, Wigan, Warrington, Catalans

Likely dark horse qualifier:  Salford

Only outside Yorkshire chance of qualifying: Huddersfield.

Edited by Manfred Mann

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4 minutes ago, Robin Evans said:

To be fair, you've taken that right out of context 

Rich did say that its too early to evaluate and that news rules weren't the reason leeds lost.

He gave an honest perspective on the rules whilst acknowledging that his team play crapola 

Nah I'm well aware that he said his own team were rubbish, and he was set up a bit in the interview as well. But it's still funny that someone who is apparently so interested in defence manages to coach a team to be so bad at it. The context of the rest of what he said doesn't change that.

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The tackling in SuperLeague over the last couple of seasons has been on a dramatic slide.

Among certain teams (Hull KR, Hudds and today... Leeds) it is regularly embarrassing.

People on here still sneer at the tackling in union. Utterly delusional. 


Rugby League: Alive and Handling

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45 minutes ago, Celt said:

The tackling in SuperLeague over the last couple of seasons has been on a dramatic slide.

Among certain teams (Hull KR, Hudds and today... Leeds) it is regularly embarrassing.

People on here still sneer at the tackling in union. Utterly delusional. 

Cant say I've noticed any particular defensive decline in the last 2 years, do you have any figures to prove it?

As for today, the sport is adjusting to 2 revolutionary rule changes, making a judgment of clubs on today's performances is a bit harsh. Come back in a month and let's see what the situation is when teams have adapted.

Your average RU defender would be completely and utterly overwhelmed in an average RL game.

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10 minutes ago, Whippet13 said:

Cant say I've noticed any particular defensive decline in the last 2 years, do you have any figures to prove it?

As for today, the sport is adjusting to 2 revolutionary rule changes, making a judgment of clubs on today's performances is a bit harsh. Come back in a month and let's see what the situation is when teams have adapted.

Your average RU defender would be completely and utterly overwhelmed in an average RL game.

Correct. There’s been some soft middle defence in the few games since restart though. 

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2 hours ago, Robin Evans said:

Rich ... gave an honest perspective on the rules whilst acknowledging that his team play crapola 

I've been acknowledging that for the past forty-odd years.

😄


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1 hour ago, Celt said:

The tackling in SuperLeague over the last couple of seasons has been on a dramatic slide.

Among certain teams (Hull KR, Hudds and today... Leeds) it is regularly embarrassing.

People on here still sneer at the tackling in union. Utterly delusional. 

People sneer at Union defensive qualities because defensively Union players are quite poor. Put a Premier Rugby player in a SL match played at the speed which the game is being played under the new rules and that player won’t last 15 minutes before needing to leave the field.

During their 10 to 15 minute stint they’d be caught out of position, spun by the speed of the players cutting lines around them and if they actually managed to get their body in front of a ball carrier they’d have no chance of locking the ball up which would see it offloaded

Union players can’t cope with the speed, the intensity or the running lines of League and believe me I have a foot in both camps.

Edited by OMEGA
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1 hour ago, Celt said:

The tackling in SuperLeague over the last couple of seasons has been on a dramatic slide.

Among certain teams (Hull KR, Hudds and today... Leeds) it is regularly embarrassing.

People on here still sneer at the tackling in union. Utterly delusional. 

The embarrassing thing over the past two weeks is showing the games within hours of the beamed NRL games. The difference in intensity is so apparent.

I played union for nearly thirty years and the tackling will never be as good as it  is in league. That,s because the positions are so specialised. Five of the eight forwards never have to make running tackles, just knock down similar sized blokes who haven't got two yards of pace and a sidestep between them.

I'd concede that the backs in top level union teams are likely to have tacklers just as good as ours in league, some better than ours because their game can leave defences more exposed in both numbers and space. However, they don't have to stand under 20 aerial bombs every game.

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I don’t think anyone would argue that the NRL is a higher standard but they have huge advantages over SL. The biggest being colossal amounts of money, they attract the best athletes in Australian sport, they have the best training facilities and they have a climate more conducive to consistent high quality training month-on-month, year-on-year!

Union outside backs would get torn to shreds by SL halfbacks who skip over defenders at speed and engage the line with options inside and out with lead runners and players sweeping from the back. League players read the almost invisible cues that defenders show when pressured and the decision making is more acute.

They'd adapt eventually but we’re comparing their current standard with League standards

Edited by OMEGA

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Yeah I have to admit I was taken aback by the casual attitude of many of the players in defence on the highlights reels, just not doing that little bit more extra effort , however there is no shortage of athletes and defensive intensity can be taught . Treating your in-goal like a no -go zone for other teams is a good start.

 

Edited by The Rocket

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3 hours ago, Whippet13 said:

Cant say I've noticed any particular defensive decline in the last 2 years, do you have any figures to prove it?

I am guessing you don't watch a lot of Super League then. The standard of tackling is woeful at times. 

Just take Leeds - Saints from yesterday. 1. The kick chase from Leeds for Grace's kick return try. It was absolutely pathetic. 

2. The try right on the hooter. Look at the "attempts" by the last 2 Leeds defenders. Laughable. And a terrible advert for professional sport.

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Rugby League: Alive and Handling

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I wonder how much of this is due to the enforced break though, players have not really been able to do that much team work and as much as you can work on individual fitness nothing prepares for making a hit or taking a hit like an actual game and for some teams this weekend it was their first for some time. I know Leeds got underway last week but let’s face it had Huddersfield had a couple of old heads to steady things down last week that would have been a fairly comprehensive defeat for Leeds, and this new 6 again rule seems made for Saints, as they have showed 2 weeks running now. Let’s judge teams when they have all got 3-4 games under their belts, I suspect we will find that Leeds are currently in a false position near the top and that as someone else said earlier the top of the table is likely to be made up from teams west of the Pennines.

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I'm a Leeds fan who lives in Brisbane and that was like watching the Broncos.  Of Sts' tries, 6 should not have been scored against a full-time pro RL team.  Barge overs by forwards are generally an indication of horrid defensive attitude (especially 2 in one game), and not covering kick returns is laughable. 

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10 hours ago, Harry Stottle said:

Is this a defence avoidence zone?

Points conceded:-

HFC 54.

Leeds 48

Cas 40

HKR 40

Wakey by far the best 23

Ouch!

 

 

2 hours ago, BrisbaneRhino said:

I'm a Leeds fan who lives in Brisbane and that was like watching the Broncos.  Of Sts' tries, 6 should not have been scored against a full-time pro RL team.  Barge overs by forwards are generally an indication of horrid defensive attitude (especially 2 in one game), and not covering kick returns is laughable. 

Beat me to it BR - that Leeds v Saints game was very similar to several I have watched at Lang Park this season.. Broncos conceding an average of 30 points per game and got by far the worst points difference in the comp.. 

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19 hours ago, Whippet13 said:

Cant say I've noticed any particular defensive decline in the last 2 years, do you have any figures to prove it?

As for today, the sport is adjusting to 2 revolutionary rule changes, making a judgment of clubs on today's performances is a bit harsh. Come back in a month and let's see what the situation is when teams have adapted.

Your average RU defender would be completely and utterly overwhelmed in an average RL game.

Didnt Folau get MOTM ??

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17 hours ago, Celt said:

I am guessing you don't watch a lot of Super League then. The standard of tackling is woeful at times. 

Just take Leeds - Saints from yesterday. 1. The kick chase from Leeds for Grace's kick return try. It was absolutely pathetic. 

2. The try right on the hooter. Look at the "attempts" by the last 2 Leeds defenders. Laughable. And a terrible advert for professional sport.

The players are coming off a 4+ month break of contact with each other, and have had a 3 week pre-season. We have introduced 2 of the most revolutionary attack supporting rule changes in decades and all that's in the middle of August. It's a bloody miracle some of the defences are as strong as they are. Like I said, come back in a month and we'll see what the position is then.

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Further to Harry's original post - I just caught the highlights of Hull FC v Salford.

Hulls attempts at defence is truly desperate stuff to watch. 1st half - they are literally falling off tackles. Lolo'hea 2nd try, he gets the ball 10m out and literally runs straight at 2 defenders. One of them falls off him, and he just drags the other guy over the line!

In the last 7 minutes, Salford manage to score 3 tries... Against a so-called professional team!

Woeful stuff. No wonder people don't want to pay to watch.

Edited by Celt

Rugby League: Alive and Handling

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The fact that "defence" and "tackling" are often used interchangeably partly explains why defence is weaker in UK than Aus. There may be some simple misses and poor attempts, but organisation and reading the play are at least as important to players being in positions to make effective tackles.

Also, poor organisation and defensive reads over the course of a game lead to more energy being consumed. Hence, lots of points conceded late in the game through sheer fatigue.

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Well if all the knowledge stopped getting drained to union as defensive coaches.. 

What does RL need to do to stop the drain of knowledge 

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