London Broncos Moving Update

[EssexRL]

On 18/12/2020 at 14:40, BJW said:

And how ! Why I now go to Skolars and only to Broncos when Skolars play there or my SL side does.

Not wishing to take this discussion off topic but I think there is a parallel discussion to be had with the new Skolar's board about using fans more (and I don't just mean staffing the bar or rattling buckets). Given the state of RL in London, die hard fans are one of our biggest resources.

On the substantive topic - I agree with the consensus: yet another move doesn't make sense. The club can never lay down roots or build its local profile. For all Skolars challenges we feel like a North East London club and have lots of local connections (schools, colleges, businesses and even the MPs!) I don't love New River but we have been there getting on a quarter of a century.

[newbe]

Some one correct me if I am wrong, as I read it only Broncos 1st team will potentially home games at Wimbledon, train at Rosslyn Park. Where are the Academy U-18 and Scholarship U-16 play? The good thing about Trailfinders everyone was based at one place.

[Archie Gordon]

22 minutes ago, newbe said:

Where are the Academy U-18 and Scholarship U-16 play? The good thing about Trailfinders everyone was based at one place.

So far as I can tell, the academy and scholarship players don't even know the answer to that yet.

[The Daddy]

2 hours ago, newbe said:

Some one correct me if I am wrong, as I read it only Broncos 1st team will potentially home games at Wimbledon, train at Rosslyn Park. Where are the Academy U-18 and Scholarship U-16 play? The good thing about Trailfinders everyone was based at one place.

Probably Rosslyn Park 

[ATLANTISMAN]

47 minutes ago, The Daddy said:

Probably Rosslyn Park 

When I think of Rosslyn Park one name always springs to mind Andy Ripley:) one of the fittest rugby players ever.

Once played in a rugby league 7.s tournament there around 38 years ago.

 

P 

[Dr Tim Whatley]

3 hours ago, Archie Gordon said:

So far as I can tell, the academy and scholarship players don't even know the answer to that yet.

The club are keeping us nicely updated on their new coffee supplier though so it's all good.

[Futtocks]

1 hour ago, ATLANTISMAN said:

When I think of Rosslyn Park one name always springs to mind Andy Ripley:) one of the fittest rugby players ever.

Once played in a rugby league 7.s tournament there around 38 years ago.

 

P 

There was a chap called Offiah, who Widnes signed from Rosslyn Park RUFC. I always wonder what happened to him...

[gingerjon]

1 hour ago, Dr Tim Whatley said:

The club are keeping us nicely updated on their new coffee supplier though so it's all good.

The image of Delboy running a rugby club's marketing section is sometimes hard to get away from.

[Oldbear]

I have always had a soft spot for the Broncos. It was an early autumn afternoon in 1983 when I saw my first live rugby league game at Crystal Palace athletics stadium and I fell in love with the sport there and then. At the time my work saw me living in Essex so I regularly trekked first to Crystal Palace, then to Chiswick until work relocated me back to the North East in early 1987. I continued to follow Fulham to games in Yorkshire before via a friend I started to take in games in Carlisle around Feb 1988, where I stayed until Carlisle merged with Barrow and was a RL nomad until Gateshead Thunder were formed. As a result it really saddens me to hear of the continuing off field shortcomings of the Broncos, at least in the old Chiswick days the club, although broke, seemed more open to fans, now the style of engagement seems to be the mushroom propagation approach (you know, feed s##t and keep in the dark). I don’t know what the answer is, David Hughes has been a saviour of the club, but he sure has made some terrible off field appointments. I know some heartland fans question if Londoners really want rugby league, my response is that the junior game is producing players, fans show up for internationals and the loyal hard core could be swelled if there was any signs that the club had a strategy, but it obviously doesn’t (or doesn’t want to share it with anyone), and seems content to keep alienating those loyal fans that it does have. So for those smarter fans than me, who are also not several thousand miles away so much more closer to the action, what happens next, and what should happen?

[nadera78]

6 hours ago, gingerjon said:

The image of Delboy running a rugby club's marketing section is sometimes hard to get away from.

Del Boy with a Hull accent

[Tex Evans Thigh]

13 hours ago, EssexRL said:

Not wishing to take this discussion off topic but I think there is a parallel discussion to be had with the new Skolar's board about using fans more (and I don't just mean staffing the bar or rattling buckets). Given the state of RL in London, die hard fans are one of our biggest resources.

On the substantive topic - I agree with the consensus: yet another move doesn't make sense. The club can never lay down roots or build its local profile. For all Skolars challenges we feel like a North East London club and have lots of local connections (schools, colleges, businesses and even the MPs!) I don't love New River but we have been there getting on a quarter of a century.

I often wonder if the Skolars had been fortunate enough to have the opportunities and investment the Broncos have how well they might have done, or indeed may do if that happens. All the things you mention are positives and they seemed to have a decent junior set-up and pathway the last time I was involved around London. If the club could just get that initial kick-start, be successful on the pitch and start attracting a few new fans I could see them becoming the better of the London clubs. Lot of ifs there mind.

[Cumbrian Mackem]

44 minutes ago, nadera78 said:

Del Boy with a Hull accent

“To hull and back”

[Toby Chopra]

6 hours ago, Tex Evans Thigh said:

I often wonder if the Skolars had been fortunate enough to have the opportunities and investment the Broncos have how well they might have done, or indeed may do if that happens. All the things you mention are positives and they seemed to have a decent junior set-up and pathway the last time I was involved around London. If the club could just get that initial kick-start, be successful on the pitch and start attracting a few new fans I could see them becoming the better of the London clubs. Lot of ifs there mind.

Skolars might well surpass the Broncos as the top London club, especially if Hughes winds down support. But only really at L1/lower championship level.

If they had the money to rise higher they'd just end up in the same position the Broncos have been in: the ground isn't suitable for "kicking on" to next level - ie top end Championship or Superleague - so they'd be uprooted and wandering. 

The community work is great, but Broncos have also produced a lot of players over the years, several to SL standard, so it's not unique. 

The point in trying to make is I think there's no magic bullet for London Rugby league, that if only we did x or y it would take off. Perhaps in the past there were key decisions that could have made a big difference. But we are where we are and my feeling is the space for a Superleague club in London has probably closed, as the sports market in the London/SE has moved on and the wider sport as a whole doesn't have the profile or attraction to force its way back in. 

Wimbledon (with a boost from the World Cup) feels like the last throw of the dice to me for the Broncos. If it doesn't work, then the game needs to ensure there's at least one strong semi pro club in place as a step on the pathway from the London/SE community game, and professional careers in the north. And that could well be the Skolars. 

[Bedfordshire Bronco]

55 minutes ago, Toby Chopra said:

Skolars might well surpass the Broncos as the top London club, especially if Hughes winds down support. But only really at L1/lower championship level.

If they had the money to rise higher they'd just end up in the same position the Broncos have been in: the ground isn't suitable for "kicking on" to next level - ie top end Championship or Superleague - so they'd be uprooted and wandering. 

The community work is great, but Broncos have also produced a lot of players over the years, several to SL standard, so it's not unique. 

The point in trying to make is I think there's no magic bullet for London Rugby league, that if only we did x or y it would take off. Perhaps in the past there were key decisions that could have made a big difference. But we are where we are and my feeling is the space for a Superleague club in London has probably closed, as the sports market in the London/SE has moved on and the wider sport as a whole doesn't have the profile or attraction to force its way back in. 

Wimbledon (with a boost from the World Cup) feels like the last throw of the dice to me for the Broncos. If it doesn't work, then the game needs to ensure there's at least one strong semi pro club in place as a step on the pathway from the London/SE community game, and professional careers in the north. And that could well be the Skolars. 

A period of SL/CC success probably eclipses all else. Everything else helps but for me it's a period of of finishing in play offs/CC semis etc. for a few years

[Oldbear]

No there’s no magic bullet, but a combination of things, both on and off field, that if done properly, consistently and given time could really help and give London the push into a solid SL outfit. I still don’t know the source of the problem, is Hughes, for all he has done for London, actually damaging in some way because of the people he hires? Is he a control freak who should delegate but finds he can’t? Obviously the location is a big issue, Trailfinders seems to be off the table if they want to be back in SL, but any move causes more disruption and leaves the club at the mercy of soccer, with all that entails when you are the tenant (ask Rochdale about that). At the very least I feel the capital needs at least one solid Championship club, with the Skolars continuing as a community club in L1, that way the player development pathway stays intact, and the Skolars are there for late developers to fall back too, as well as those who just want to stay in the game, but not be at a top end Championship level.

[LEEDSLADGONE SOUTH]

So are they moving or what?

[EssexRL]

17 hours ago, Tex Evans Thigh said:

I often wonder if the Skolars had been fortunate enough to have the opportunities and investment the Broncos have how well they might have done, or indeed may do if that happens. All the things you mention are positives and they seemed to have a decent junior set-up and pathway the last time I was involved around London. If the club could just get that initial kick-start, be successful on the pitch and start attracting a few new fans I could see them becoming the better of the London clubs. Lot of ifs there mind.

The clubs got a great mindset and, I think, does really well with the resources it has but without significant funding we aren’t going to be able to promote/market properly or attract the players we need to be competitive. The potential is significant which is why it’s sad we didn’t get the investment we were promised. 

[Tex Evans Thigh]

3 hours ago, EssexRL said:

The clubs got a great mindset and, I think, does really well with the resources it has but without significant funding we aren’t going to be able to promote/market properly or attract the players we need to be competitive. The potential is significant which is why it’s sad we didn’t get the investment we were promised. 

Yeah, that was kind of my point. With a little boost in investment I could see them doing well. New River isnt terrible and I imagine could be enhanced fairly easily from the 5,000 capacity. Good roots in the area and I think an area that is a decent demographic for RL. Fairly easy to get to coming from the north and a reasonably short walk from a zone 3 tube. I really liked the junior system that was in place too. As you say, with a bit of investment you could envisage a Newcastle type situation, as it is they seem stuck in a loop.

[dead man inc]

2 hours ago, Tex Evans Thigh said:

Yeah, that was kind of my point. With a little boost in investment I could see them doing well. New River isnt terrible and I imagine could be enhanced fairly easily from the 5,000 capacity. Good roots in the area and I think an area that is a decent demographic for RL. Fairly easy to get to coming from the north and a reasonably short walk from a zone 3 tube. I really liked the junior system that was in place too. As you say, with a bit of investment you could envisage a Newcastle type situation, as it is they seem stuck in a loop.

One thing that would really benefit Skolars is if the majority of young Broncos reserves/Academy lads that just don’t make it with Broncos would actually sign for Skolars. A few do, and with SL stopping 2021 reserves a few of them have signed this year - just not sure their is a big enough critical mass of them to push Skolars onto the next level of playing performance to genuinely target the league 1 play off positions yet.

Hiwever more often than not when the lads are cut from Broncos Academy/reserves a significant amount of them give up the ghost & are lost to the game (i’m sure this happens up north as well unfortunately)

[nadera78]

15 hours ago, Bedfordshire Bronco said:

A period of SL/CC success probably eclipses all else. Everything else helps but for me it's a period of of finishing in play offs/CC semis etc. for a few years

You could say the same for every sports club in the world. The club just isn't in a position to achieve that though, because it simply doesn't do the basics never mind put in place the sort of systems and staffing required to achieve those results. If, for example, the Broncos made it to Wembley they wouldn't be able to capitalise on it because they lack the ability to do so.

[gingerjon]

5 hours ago, nadera78 said:

You could say the same for every sports club in the world. The club just isn't in a position to achieve that though, because it simply doesn't do the basics never mind put in place the sort of systems and staffing required to achieve those results. If, for example, the Broncos made it to Wembley they wouldn't be able to capitalise on it because they lack the ability to do so.

The year we made it to Wembley after the greatest Challenge Cup Semi Final of all time our average attendance went down.

[Dr Tim Whatley]

2 hours ago, gingerjon said:

The year we made it to Wembley after the greatest Challenge Cup Semi Final of all time our average attendance went down.

Never knew that. Absolutely amazing (or, given who we are talking about, is it?).

[gingerjon]

8 minutes ago, Dr Tim Whatley said:

Never knew that. Absolutely amazing (or, given who we are talking about, is it?).

It was Dave Hadfield writing in the Independent at the time in his end of season review who noted it. Certainly, we played a game against Gateshead which featured an unbelievably low crowd (for then) of under 2,000.

[Bedfordshire Bronco]

7 hours ago, nadera78 said:

You could say the same for every sports club in the world. The club just isn't in a position to achieve that though

I agree you could say that. In fact pmast success explains Wigan, Saint etc having big followings 

Getting to success and (and the subsequent) bigger support there is simple.... Money

Tinkering around the edges is exactly that 

A very big new investment to buy amazing players /coaches would be guest on the list 

[Henson Park Old Firm]

So when do we find out about the move...