Rugby League World Cup 2021 (Merged Threads)

[gingerjon]

17 minutes ago, GUBRATS said:

So how long before they announce the 2021 Pacific 6 nation's competition to take place in November in Australia and NZ ? 

You haven't read the past few pages then?

[Mr Frisky]

This week the 14 countries who have committed should be asked to name their preliminary squads - say 35 to 40 players each and name all the NRL players and see how much the Aussies start going crazy...

 

[nadera78]

I'm afraid there's definitely more chance of the tournament being postponed than of it taking place. The NRL and its member clubs are just going to put so much pressure on the pacific nations that one of them will crack and pull out. At that point continuing becomes untenable. There is apparently a meeting of the Asia Pacific RL next week, to decide on a position to take, but I think it'll all be stitched up before then.

In the unlikely event that it goes ahead, I certainly see the appeal in having Indigenous and Maori teams taking part. They'd be very competitive teams, it would have a real 'f you' to the NRL feel to it and I think the optics would be quite good, it's certainly a story to sell to the media. That said, logistically I'm not sure how you'd do it - who would even pick the squads, coaches, etc? There's a Maori RL but they're affiliated to NZRL so would be pressured not to take part, but I don't think there's a comparable body for Indigenous RL. The safest bet would be to invite the USA and Serbia (as next best losers in qualifying) to take part. Like I say, in the unlikely event it takes place at all.

[theswanmcr]

11 hours ago, Henson Park Old Firm said:

In reality the Government of Queensland has told the NRL one more covid breach and they'll shut down the comp... I have a feeling australia and nz would then play.

Oh how funny would that be. We can then offer them the chance to come over here and safely finish the comp - give them full and sole Covid-friendly access to Underbank Rangers to host all games, including global commentary by Mick Gledhill - provided of course that they compete in the World Cup. Sorted.

[Man of Kent]

28 minutes ago, nadera78 said:

In the unlikely event that it goes ahead, I certainly see the appeal in having Indigenous and Maori teams taking part. They'd be very competitive teams, it would have a real 'f you' to the NRL feel to it and I think the optics would be quite good, it's certainly a story to sell to the media. 

It would be a great story and the BBC in particular would lap it up, and the Indigenous war cry and Maori haka.

But there’s more to play out, I suspect.

[FearTheVee]

46 minutes ago, nadera78 said:

In the unlikely event that it goes ahead, I certainly see the appeal in having Indigenous and Maori teams taking part. They'd be very competitive teams, it would have a real 'f you' to the NRL feel to it and I think the optics would be quite good, it's certainly a story to sell to the media.

I would actually probably enjoy that more than a WC with Oz and NZ in it!

[GeordieSaint]

53 minutes ago, nadera78 said:

I'm afraid there's definitely more chance of the tournament being postponed than of it taking place. The NRL and its member clubs are just going to put so much pressure on the pacific nations that one of them will crack and pull out. At that point continuing becomes untenable. There is apparently a meeting of the Asia Pacific RL next week, to decide on a position to take, but I think it'll all be stitched up before then.

I tend to agree. I simply don’t see how those Pacific nations will be able to compete; they are pretty much reliant on the NRL for everything. 

On a related note, really pleased with James Graham’s statement. The bit about financial reward the NRL specifically. That gets to the heart of this issue (with COVID as a smokescreen). Well done him. 

[JohnM]

If it is postponed, Vlandis will have won, and the WC will be a damp squib, what with all  the competing sports events. Vlandis will then claim ownership. 

If it goes ahead, Vlandis will claim its a mickey mouse cup. 

Either way, he'll win and assume control of the game worldwide. 

[Rupert Prince]

The WC must go on because if it does and does so because the ANZACs default then any supposed ANZAC series would not be sanctioned by the International Board and they would be illegal.  

[Toby Chopra]

There's no perfect outcome now. 

Loathe as I am to let the NRL win, in the cold light of day you have to accept the realities of power. 

I think the least worst option now is postponement to 2022, if we can get binding participation agreements from the Australians. 

The 2022 dates aren't great, but I genuinely fear a 2021 WC without Aus and NZ will be a financial disaster. Plenty of people are definitely going to ask for their money back for the Aus and NZ games, and the organisers will probably face refund demands for the rest of the tournament given it just won't be what was promised. They're still running social media ads now featuring Aus and NZ. 

[Scubby]

It has to go on. All the expenses and match fees for the players are coming from the Workd Cup not the NRL. For the first time, Tonga, Samoa and Fijian players are actually going to be rewarded. Add to that the prize money of getting to and winning the final it could be pretty lucrative for these nations.

That has never happened in the history of RL. These countries have always been treated like dirt.

[Scubby]

1 minute ago, Toby Chopra said:

There's no perfect outcome now. 

Loathe as I am to let the NRL win, in the cold light of day you have to accept the realities of power. 

I think the least worst option now is postponement to 2022, if we can get binding participation agreements from the Australians. 

The 2022 dates aren't great, but I genuinely fear a 2021 WC without Aus and NZ will be a financial disaster. Plenty of people are definitely going to ask for their money back for the Aus and NZ games, and the organisers will probably face refund demands for the rest of the tournament given it just won't be what was promised. They're still running social media ads now featuring Aus and NZ. 

Fans may even boycott Aus and NZ games even if they do come in 2022.

[Toby Chopra]

2 minutes ago, Scubby said:

Fans may even boycott Aus and NZ games even if they do come in 2022.

Then fans would be contributing to the demise of English rugby league. 

We all feel betrayed, and we have been. So it's natural to want to stick it to the Aussies and tell them we can do without them forever. I've felt that too. 

But when tempers have settled we have to find a way back from this. There's no future for international rugby league without Australia, and without international rugby league the English game would be on the fast track to total marginalisation. 

It's a terrible situation, but cutting off our noses to spite our faces will be even worse. 

[DavidM]

We postponed it from last year saying it’ll be better next year . Now theyre saying the same , who knows ? And who knows if they’ll turn up next year , what if there’s another spike here that spooks them , what if they’ve been in the bubble in the NRL again as they’ve COVID zero tolerance and don’t want to be bothered to come again ? We keep kicking it into the long grass with no guarantees everything’s gonna fall into place anyway . To me this is power games and self interest and we’ve got to get this on or we’ve basically surrendered . The arrogance and shifting of goalposts in terms of the reasoning tells a story and should stiffen resolve 

[Toby Chopra]

Just now, DavidM said:

We postponed it from last year saying it’ll be better next year . Now theyre saying the same , who knows ? And who knows if they’ll turn up next year , what if there’s another spike here that spooks them , what if they’ve been in the bubble in the NRL again as they’ve COVID zero tolerance and don’t want to be bothered to come again ? We keep kicking it into the long grass with no guarantees everything’s gonna fall into place anyway . To me this is power games and self interest and we’ve got to get this on or we’ve basically surrendered 

Eh? It's always been scheduled for this year. 

[rlno1]

James Graham was a guest on Sydney radio today. He had some strong opinions on the current situation with the World Cup:

https://omny.fm/shows/triple-m-rocks-footy-nrl/saturday-scrum-hour-1-james-graham-blasts-the-nrl?in_playlist=triple-m-rocks-footy-nrl!podcast

also Peter Sterling:

https://omny.fm/shows/triple-m-rocks-footy-nrl/saturday-scrum-hour-3-sterlos-take-on-the-world-cu?in_playlist=triple-m-rocks-footy-nrl!podcast

[DavidM]

4 minutes ago, Toby Chopra said:

Eh? It's always been scheduled for this year. 

Ha , Ignore that bit . I’m watching the Olympics ….

[Scubby]

9 minutes ago, Toby Chopra said:

Then fans would be contributing to the demise of English rugby league. 

We all feel betrayed, and we have been. So it's natural to want to stick it to the Aussies and tell them we can do without them forever. I've felt that too. 

But when tempers have settled we have to find a way back from this. There's no future for international rugby league without Australia, and without international rugby league the English game would be on the fast track to total marginalisation. 

It's a terrible situation, but cutting off our noses to spite our faces will be even worse. 

Fans are fans. A large portion of fans really don't care about the game too much. It is a fact of life sadly. To them it is entertainment or just their club.

[Dave T]

The Aus and NZ games directly contribute relatively modest numbers to the crowd total. This tournament has already taken the decision to delink England from them. 

Games like Coventry would be a challenge, but I think it will anyway tbh. 

Sponsorship from Aus would take a hit, and tv rights from those territories would be at risk. 

If these things can be overcome, and they may be reasons to have 'rebel' Aus and NZ teams then we should continue. 

[frank]

I know it may seem ridiculous but I think this could be the parting of the ways with the Aussies. It's been building  for some years now and this could be the final straw. 

What with the Denver(no Covid then) game and the last WC in  in Aussie,  which I believe were both  run at a loss. They are just not interested in  furthering the game.

IT's a good bet their interest in the Islands is solely to strengthen the NRL teams and no more. The  reason being the majority of youngsters  no longer want to pay League. There numbers have really dropped off.

I was surprised by the NZRL  decision though.

[RayCee]

11 minutes ago, Toby Chopra said:

There's no perfect outcome now. 

Loathe as I am to let the NRL win, in the cold light of day you have to accept the realities of power. 

I think the least worst option now is postponement to 2022, if we can get binding participation agreements from the Australians. 

The 2022 dates aren't great, but I genuinely fear a 2021 WC without Aus and NZ will be a financial disaster. Plenty of people are definitely going to ask for their money back for the Aus and NZ games, and the organisers will probably face refund demands for the rest of the tournament given it just won't be what was promised. They're still running social media ads now featuring Aus and NZ. 

We all at things differently and I can’t see anything you’ve mentioned having merit. 

Going ahead is the best option IMO and cancelling it altogether is the second best. For me a postponement is the worst option. There are no guarantees for 2022. The cost of postponing will be sizable. Going up against a  Football WC too is foolish. The ARLC don’t seem interested in the RL WC and I that won’t change next year when they find other reasons not to support it. Handing all power to the ARLC is the last thing the sport needs. International RL should not be dictated to by any body within the sport. 

As for the financial situation, the WC organisers are in the best position to make a call on that one. Your assumed pessimism regarding people turning off the tournament is speculation and unproven. Again, the WC committee will consider all such factors and will move forward accordingly. The glass is still half full to me.

[Toby Chopra]

31 minutes ago, Dave T said:

The Aus and NZ games directly contribute relatively modest numbers to the crowd total. This tournament has already taken the decision to delink England from them. 

Games like Coventry would be a challenge, but I think it will anyway tbh. 

Sponsorship from Aus would take a hit, and tv rights from those territories would be at risk. 

If these things can be overcome, and they may be reasons to have 'rebel' Aus and NZ teams then we should continue. 

I agree that the attendance at Aus/NZ games in themselves can be overcome, but do you think the tournament as a whole can still successfully sell itself as a 'World Cup' if two of the best teams - including the overwhelming favourite - aren't there?

Sure, fans want to see the Pacific teams, Jamaica etc, but it's all within the context of it being a world class event producing the best team in the world. This especially matters for the many non-rugby league fans who've clearly been attracted so far. 

I'd be delighted to be wrong, and perhaps I am. Perhaps these casual fans will still find the event worthwhile. Perhaps the English rugby league community will come out in solidarity to make up the difference. It might even be worth the organisers making this pitch explicitly. 

But it's a hell of a gamble, which of it goes wrong has potentially catastrophic financial consequences for the English game. 

[Dunbar]

My view on progressing here.

If we get guarantees that Tonga, Fiji, Samoa, PNG et al are coming (and it's a big if) then we should absolutely progress with the tournament.

They have some of the best players in the world (as do England) and we will probably get some of the elite players who would have played for the Kangaroos or Kiwis as well.

It's a no to any Australian or Kiwi rebel teams for me - a World Cup is a nations tournament and if Australia or New Zealand decide not to participate then that is on them.

Replace them with other nations and get on with it.  I desperately hope that there is some kind of reverse and the Kangaroos and Kiwi's come as I still crave a fantastic World Cup but without them we can still have a celebration of the sport... and maybe give them pause for thought on their decision.

All this being said, all it will take is one PI nation to pull out now under pressure from the NRL and the domino effect will mean they all pull out and then the whole thing is off.  If that happens then some people at the top of the game in Australia and New Zealand will go down in history as saboteurs of our game and they should be ashamed of themselves (as they should be already).

[FearTheVee]

2 minutes ago, Toby Chopra said:

I agree that the attendance at Aus/NZ games in themselves can be overcome, but do you think the tournament as a whole can still successfully sell itself as a 'World Cup' if two of the best teams - including the overwhelming favourite - aren't there?

Yes.  It is all the best teams in the world that want to enter and the interest (until the semi/final) isn't about Oz/NZ etc anyway.

If it's possibel I think the best answer is the Indigenous and Maori playing - any taint is then on the ARLC/NZRL for not coming when the players were clearly keen to do so and the WC would be a brilliant cenelbration of the sport - maybe even more than it would ever have been without these circumstances.

Be positive and roll on.

[Mr Frisky]

13 minutes ago, frank said:

I know it may seem ridiculous but I think this could be the parting of the ways with the Aussies. It's been building  for some years now and this could be the final straw. 

What with the Denver(no Covid then) game and the last WC in  in Aussie,  which I believe were both  run at a loss. They are just not interested in  furthering the game.

IT's a good bet their interest in the Islands is solely to strengthen the NRL teams and no more. The  reason being the majority of youngsters  no longer want to pay League. There numbers have really dropped off.

I was surprised by the NZRL  decision though.

Totally agree- the Aussies just don't care.

There is a reason they are so ignorant about the rest of the world-  they are a small population on the other side of the world off any real travel routes in a country that no one really talks about so don't really know how to handle themselves on the world stage.

 

Love the Ashes Cricket but wouldn't it be great if England cancelled their tour this winter under the guise that they don't want to tour a country that has been so bad at vaccination of their small population.