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Harry Newman at the RFL Disciplinary appeal hearing..

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Just Browny

Just Browny

Posted
Posted

I said last week that Leeds as a club get 90% of things right. This, added to the Bentley signing, makes me think I should revise that to 80%.

The very definition of a frivolous appeal. The original not guilty plea was pretty frivolous too. Newman is a classy player and needs to concentrate on that.

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I can confirm 30+ less sales for Scotland vs Italy at Workington, after this afternoons test purchase for the Tonga match, £7.50 is extremely reasonable, however a £2.50 'delivery' fee for a walk in purchase is beyond taking the mickey, good luck with that, it's cheaper on the telly.

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Chrispmartha
Chrispmartha

One thing though, if gobbing off at the ref is worth a two match ban then it should be worth a red card at the time

Just Browny
Just Browny

Well, the good news is that his dad seems like a calm and level-headed influence. 

Chris22
Chris22

I struggle to understand why Leeds appealed. Especially to plead not guilty.  Maybe an appeal that a two match ban was harsh but accepting guilt would have been better. This was always the m

M j M

M j M

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Posted

I think it's quite well known that Harry Newman is very... err... excitable and definitely needs some special attention from the club to control that on the field.

Leeds' appeal I understand was based on challenging the grading rather than pleading not guilty as such - with the aim of reducing the ban to one rather than two games.

To support this they produced multiple examples of what they viewed as comparable scenarios which had been assessed differently. If demonstrating the inconsistencies of the system is frivolous then so be it.

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Tommygilf

Tommygilf

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21 minutes ago, dkw said:

I`m almost certain the term "Frivolous" will be defined within the RFLs rules, and it is based on exactly what you posted. If they turned up with no extra evidence or facts then its frivolous. Leeds of all clubs should know that...

I`m not even sure what more evidence they could give anyway, its an open and shut case and there`s literally nothing they could have presented that would have changed that punishment.

You can turn up and dispute evidence, granted this was televised and presumably the ref mic picked stuff up, but you can dispute evidence.

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Moove

Moove

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6 minutes ago, M j M said:

I think it's quite well known that Harry Newman is very... err... excitable and definitely needs some special attention from the club to control that on the field.

Leeds' appeal I understand was based on challenging the grading rather than pleading not guilty as such - with the aim of reducing the ban to one rather than two games.

To support this they produced multiple examples of what they viewed as comparable scenarios which had been assessed differently. If demonstrating the inconsistencies of the system is frivolous then so be it.

That isn't what the RFL have said. They e specifically said that Newman pleaded 'not guilty' at the tribunal.

https://rugby-league.com/article/60397/disciplinary-|-independent-tribunals

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dkw

dkw

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7 minutes ago, Tommygilf said:

You can turn up and dispute evidence, granted this was televised and presumably the ref mic picked stuff up, but you can dispute evidence.

With what, you cant dispute it by just turning up and saying " I dont agree".

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Dunbar

Dunbar

Posted
Posted
21 minutes ago, M j M said:

I think it's quite well known that Harry Newman is very... err... excitable and definitely needs some special attention from the club to control that on the field.

Leeds' appeal I understand was based on challenging the grading rather than pleading not guilty as such - with the aim of reducing the ban to one rather than two games.

To support this they produced multiple examples of what they viewed as comparable scenarios which had been assessed differently. If demonstrating the inconsistencies of the system is frivolous then so be it.

 

13 minutes ago, Moove said:

That isn't what the RFL have said. They e specifically said that Newman pleaded 'not guilty' at the tribunal.

https://rugby-league.com/article/60397/disciplinary-|-independent-tribunals

The disciplinary page is a little ambiguous.  It says... 

"Newman pleaded ‘not guilty’ to the Match Review Panel’s grade C charge of using aggressive language or body language towards the referee in the same game. The tribunal upheld the Match Review Panel’s two match penalty notice and, finding the challenge to be frivolous, added a further match."

So, he may have pleaded not guilty at the disciplinary but then accepted hus guilt but challenged the grading at the appeal.

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"The history of the world is the history of the triumph of the heartless over the mindless." — Sir Humphrey Appleby.

"If someone doesn't value evidence, what evidence are you going to provide to prove that they should value it? If someone doesn't value logic, what logical argument could you provide to show the importance of logic?" — Sam Harris

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Simon Hall

Simon Hall

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Harry's Dad sticks his oar in...

https://www.leeds-live.co.uk/sport/rugby-league/harry-newman-father-attack-rfl-24349869

Embarrassing.

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Dunbar

Dunbar

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4 minutes ago, Simon Hall said:

Harry's Dad sticks his oar in...

https://www.leeds-live.co.uk/sport/rugby-league/harry-newman-father-attack-rfl-24349869

Embarrassing.

I don't think he should be saying these things but I think it is only fair to point out that this was on a private supporters group and not 'broadcast' as such.

"The history of the world is the history of the triumph of the heartless over the mindless." — Sir Humphrey Appleby.

"If someone doesn't value evidence, what evidence are you going to provide to prove that they should value it? If someone doesn't value logic, what logical argument could you provide to show the importance of logic?" — Sam Harris

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Tommygilf

Tommygilf

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39 minutes ago, dkw said:

With what, you cant dispute it by just turning up and saying " I dont agree".

You can point out problems, disputes and conflicts in evidence. For example if eyewitness testimonies slightly differ, people have gotten off far worse on this sort of point.

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Simon Hall

Simon Hall

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Just now, Dunbar said:

I don't think he should be saying these things but I think it is only fair to point out that this was on a private supporters group and not 'broadcast' as such.

Fair enough if he was saying it on a family Whatsapp group but a supporters page on Facebook isn't really saying it in private, it's basically broadcasting your thoughts around a packed pub full of Rhinos supporters.

 

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RP London

RP London

Posted
Posted (edited)
14 minutes ago, Simon Hall said:

Harry's Dad sticks his oar in...

https://www.leeds-live.co.uk/sport/rugby-league/harry-newman-father-attack-rfl-24349869

Embarrassing.

go back to RU?? is that the same RU that banned Dylan Hartley for 11 weeks for swearing at an official... or that banned Tom Youngs for 4 weeks (reduced to 2 as long as he also attended a refs course and reffed 2 open age games within 6 months AND doesnt re offend)... Yeah i probably wouldn't head there, they have stricter rules (rightly) on how you act towards the ref.

Edited by RP London
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Damien

Damien

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Posted
15 minutes ago, Simon Hall said:

Harry's Dad sticks his oar in...

https://www.leeds-live.co.uk/sport/rugby-league/harry-newman-father-attack-rfl-24349869

Embarrassing.

I'm not sure how an extra game ban warrants Newman to be so crushed, as per the words of his father, or this pretty much irrelevant outburst.

As an aside, does Newman's Dad post on this forum? I think he'd fit in well.

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Damien

Damien

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12 minutes ago, Dunbar said:

I don't think he should be saying these things but I think it is only fair to point out that this was on a private supporters group and not 'broadcast' as such.

Family members sticking their oar in when it comes to a relative's career rarely ends well. It even sees players turfed out of clubs. I get people wish to defend their son or whatever but these players are grown adults and family members need to take a step back.

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Dunbar

Dunbar

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13 minutes ago, Simon Hall said:

Fair enough if he was saying it on a family Whatsapp group but a supporters page on Facebook isn't really saying it in private, it's basically broadcasting your thoughts around a packed pub full of Rhinos supporters.

 

Yes, all fair. I just wanted to make the point that it was in a private supporters group.

"The history of the world is the history of the triumph of the heartless over the mindless." — Sir Humphrey Appleby.

"If someone doesn't value evidence, what evidence are you going to provide to prove that they should value it? If someone doesn't value logic, what logical argument could you provide to show the importance of logic?" — Sam Harris

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Dave T

Dave T

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22 minutes ago, Dunbar said:

I don't think he should be saying these things but I think it is only fair to point out that this was on a private supporters group and not 'broadcast' as such.

Top quality journalism from Bower isn't it? 

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Dave T

Dave T

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It's embarrassing for Newman isn't it, but maybe there is a sign there of why he behaved like he did as there is a real lack of anyone taking responsibility here. 

He behaved like a tool, yet pleaded not guilty. His club then appealed that. And then his dad came out and criticised the RFL and not his son for behaving like an idiot. 

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gingerjon

gingerjon

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2 minutes ago, Dave T said:

It's embarrassing for Newman isn't it, but maybe there is a sign there of why he behaved like he did as there is a real lack of anyone taking responsibility here. 

He behaved like a tool, yet pleaded not guilty. His club then appealed that. And then his dad came out and criticised the RFL and not his son for behaving like an idiot. 

Another similarity with a lot of the 'reporting' that followed the early season crackdown.

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Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. (Terry Pratchett)

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Tommygilf

Tommygilf

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9 minutes ago, Dave T said:

Top quality journalism from Bower isn't it? 

Tbf it is what it is. There is another article about broader Leeds fan responses out now too, with a decent spread of opinion criticising the club too. 

Its perfectly valid journalism in the social media age, indeed its a modern form of vox pops and the like.

It is also the sort of media stuff the game should be engaging in. Being part of a bigger discussion is a universalising concept and is attractive when growing the sport. 

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Just Browny

Just Browny

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, M j M said:

I think it's quite well known that Harry Newman is very... err... excitable and definitely needs some special attention from the club to control that on the field.

 

Well, the good news is that his dad seems like a calm and level-headed influence. 

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I can confirm 30+ less sales for Scotland vs Italy at Workington, after this afternoons test purchase for the Tonga match, £7.50 is extremely reasonable, however a £2.50 'delivery' fee for a walk in purchase is beyond taking the mickey, good luck with that, it's cheaper on the telly.

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fighting irish

fighting irish

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54 minutes ago, Simon Hall said:

Harry's Dad sticks his oar in...

https://www.leeds-live.co.uk/sport/rugby-league/harry-newman-father-attack-rfl-24349869

Embarrassing.

If anybody's looking for a reason why Harry behaves like a d....k there it is. 

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Damien

Damien

Posted
Posted (edited)
31 minutes ago, Dave T said:

It's embarrassing for Newman isn't it, but maybe there is a sign there of why he behaved like he did as there is a real lack of anyone taking responsibility here. 

He behaved like a tool, yet pleaded not guilty. His club then appealed that. And then his dad came out and criticised the RFL and not his son for behaving like an idiot. 

I know its his father and not Harry and that this may well be just a case of a father thinking his son is the bees knees but it is not a good reflection in my opinion. Its not the first time the threat of going to RU or the NRL has been put out there by someone. There is someone that seems to have an over inflated opinion of Newman, whether that is Newman himself or just his family remains to be seen. I hope he has some more calming influences advising him too.

Newman is a good young player with potential but at the end of the day he has had injuries and is now 22 with only 50 SL appearances under his belt.

Edited by Damien
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Ant

Ant

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Posted

Making players attend a refs course is an option the RFL should start following  and making them ref amateur games. 

 

Also, Leeds need to just get used to the fact that bottom teams just don't get the easy breaks top teams do, either on field or at the disciplinary. 

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