IMG - Thought's, suggestions and comments to move the game forward

[Man of Kent]

22 hours ago, Henson Park Old Firm said:

https://www.loverugbyleague.com/post/paper-talk-expand-super-league-huge-munster-deal/?fbclid=IwAR3a0cw78myHzNdoJrVQr9V-hF198eN5Gucglw-3jxovcRyQ1EjIB2ms2G0

16 team super league perhaps?

I'm with @Martyn Sadleron this. A 16-club SL populated by the 13 clubs with elite Academies + Leigh & Salford (who are on their way to having elite Academies) + Toulouse (which sort of has an Academy c/o TO Broncos in Elite 1) ticks the geographical footprint and player development boxes.

That's the easy bit, the hard bit is finding the money (!)

[MattSantos]

3 minutes ago, Man of Kent said:

I'm with @Martyn Sadleron this. A 16-club SL populated by the 13 clubs with elite Academies + Leigh & Salford (who are on their way to having elite Academies) + Toulouse (which sort of has an Academy c/o TO Broncos in Elite 1) ticks the geographical footprint and player development boxes.

That's the easy bit, the hard bit is finding the money (!)

Who are the clubs with elite academies? 

[ghost crayfish]

3 minutes ago, Man of Kent said:

I'm with @Martyn Sadleron this. A 16-club SL populated by the 13 clubs with elite Academies + Leigh & Salford (who are on their way to having elite Academies) + Toulouse (which sort of has an Academy c/o TO Broncos in Elite 1) ticks the geographical footprint and player development boxes.

That's the easy bit, the hard bit is finding the money (!)

I think 14 clubs feels right to me for Super League, at least until more of the expansion areas are ready. 

[Man of Kent]

Just now, MattSantos said:

Who are the clubs with elite academies? 

Bradford, Cas, Catalans, Huddersfield, Hull FC, Hull KR, Leeds, London, Newcastle, Saints, Wakefield, Warrington & Wigan.

[MattSantos]

On a personal note, i'd be done if Bradford, Newcastle and London were to be promoted through 'artificial' means.

 

[Guest]

5 hours ago, steve oates said:

You have given us a total fantasy, and then turned it into some sort of suggested plan for the future of the game.

From John O Groats to Lands end and the welsh coast to the North sea coast there should be going on 2,000 junior RL clubs playing Rugby League?????

Then in every county at least one centre of excellence in which the parents of the best kids will ferry their little Rugby League stars to develop their talents and eventually the best will make up RL Academy teams in which only the best again may eventually sign on at Wigan or Leeds.

Meanwhile Soccer and Rugby Union will start to fail as sports because all the kids across the country are playing League.

I'd guess the centres of excellence may be a little unaffordable and bereft of any quality coaching expertise, but let's not linger on any realities when we have a good fantasy going on.....

Steve, you just twisted what he said. Are you just trolling at this point?

[Tommygilf]

1 hour ago, NW10LDN said:

Steve, you just twisted what he said. Are you just trolling at this point?

You've only just noticed?

[The storm]

7 hours ago, MattSantos said:

On a personal note, i'd be done if Bradford, Newcastle and London were to be promoted through 'artificial' means.

 

However some clubs maybe dont deserve super league status. 

The clubs with stong ownership right now are few and far between but some of the real success stories are in the lower leagues with batley,  barrow,  keighlley and featherstone all impressive in recent years. 

But of course i know the value of the big city teams like Bradford,  Hull,  Newcastle, London and leeds,  but then we have others like wigan and saints who are arguably world class teams in fairly large towns. 

I do believe we need to retain that unique mix. 

I work in st helens and live in widnes and regularly drive past the fantastic Fanworth halton hornets with hundreds of kids playing our sport from all over widnes,  runcorn,  even liverpool and north wales. 

These clubs and others like them have achieved a world class standard right in the heart of the community

We need to retain that as lewis dodd,  harry smith and danny Richardson were all produced here and so it is essential that teams like widnes,  batley,  barrow and keighley are fully consulted as we prepare for a brighter future

[MattSantos]

4 minutes ago, The storm said:

However some clubs maybe dont deserve super league status. 

 

Based on the criteria, the 12 there are deserving.

The issue is that the criteria is always shifting. 

 

[The storm]

42 minutes ago, MattSantos said:

Based on the criteria, the 12 there are deserving.

The issue is that the criteria is always shifting. 

 

Or that nobody knows what the criteria actually is. 

Some clubs have endured years of zero progression,  stagnant attendances,  poor community relations and really poor acadamy achievement

[LeeF]

16 clubs in SL or Division 1

14 clubs in Championship or Division 2

4 up, 4 down each season

Bring back the old XIII logo 

Job done

[gingerjon]

25 minutes ago, The storm said:

Or that nobody knows what the criteria actually is. 

Right now, it's to be either promoted to Super League from the Championship or to be in Super League and avoid the relegation place, whilst meeting the minimum standards that are set out in the published operational rules.

Pretty simple.

[Jughead]

12-12-13. 

25 games in Super League and the Championship. Loop games are based on the previous season, so if you finish 1st you play 2nd, 3rd and 4th, if you finish 8th you play 9th, 10th, 11th and 12th. 

League One plays 24, everyone home and away. 

One down from Super League and the Championship with 11th in Super League playing the 2nd team in the Championship, same with the Championship and League One. 

A change to sixteen is too drastic and unrealistic to do. 

[GUBRATS]

20 minutes ago, Jughead said:

12-12-13. 

25 games in Super League and the Championship. Loop games are based on the previous season, so if you finish 1st you play 2nd, 3rd and 4th, if you finish 8th you play 9th, 10th, 11th and 12th. 

League One plays 24, everyone home and away. 

One down from Super League and the Championship with 11th in Super League playing the 2nd team in the Championship, same with the Championship and League One. 

A change to sixteen is too drastic and unrealistic to do. 

That sound about the most sensible structure I've seen in ages 

Are you sure you are you , and you haven't been ' hacked ' ?

[DI Keith Fowler]

OK, structure idea since we're all having a go. 

The Super Eighths.

Every club must have at least an eighth of their team from their own academy, a further eighth under the age of 25, 1/8th who would qualify for a tier 2 international side, and an eighth players who could potentially segue into reality TV.

The next eighth are full of grace (except Regan of course), another made up of former NRL players rehabilitating their reputation, one more eighth for players who've successfully served a ban for something sold in eighths, and the final coterie made up of those unpaid by the Toronto Wolfpack.

Martyn, do I win five pounds?

[welshmagpie]

On 16/08/2022 at 09:43, steve oates said:

You have given us a total fantasy, and then turned it into some sort of suggested plan for the future of the game.

From John O Groats to Lands end and the welsh coast to the North sea coast there should be going on 2,000 junior RL clubs playing Rugby League?????

Then in every county at least one centre of excellence in which the parents of the best kids will ferry their little Rugby League stars to develop their talents and eventually the best will make up RL Academy teams in which only the best again may eventually sign on at Wigan or Leeds.

Meanwhile Soccer and Rugby Union will start to fail as sports because all the kids across the country are playing League.

I'd guess the centres of excellence may be a little unaffordable and bereft of any quality coaching expertise, but let's not linger on any realities when we have a good fantasy going on.....

Base academies at universities whereby kids that are leaving college can go to attend, study but also progress further in the game: we have to expand our footprint. 

It’s happened before in the Midlands and Bristol but neither exist any more. It can be done.

You’ve taken my wish to a fantastical state, one way beyond what I was initially suggesting. There are parts of Britain that aren’t doable - I agree. Places in far-flung parts of rural Cornwall and the Scottish highlands, I get are fantasy. But there’s no excuse for places like Plymouth, Exeter, Worcester, Bournemouth, Swansea etc. 

Create a pathway for all, that’s all I’m asking. 
 

My child lives in a city of around 150,000 people. It requires a near two-hour round trip for them to attend their local RL club. We have to do better as a sport though I’m unsure who’s door the responsibility for this rests at. 

One day I’d love to launch a junior club in our city to serve it and it’s surrounding towns but right now at this time of my life it’s no feasible for me - one day. 

 

Edited August 17, 2022 by welshmagpie

[Jughead]

13 hours ago, GUBRATS said:

That sound about the most sensible structure I've seen in ages 

Are you sure you are you , and you haven't been ' hacked ' ?

I think that was a compliment, thanks!

Why reinvent the wheel is ultimately what I’m getting at. What we have isn’t that bad. There’s more cosmetic changes required than there is drastic, IMO. 

[Dave T]

15 hours ago, Jughead said:

12-12-13. 

25 games in Super League and the Championship. Loop games are based on the previous season, so if you finish 1st you play 2nd, 3rd and 4th, if you finish 8th you play 9th, 10th, 11th and 12th. 

League One plays 24, everyone home and away. 

One down from Super League and the Championship with 11th in Super League playing the 2nd team in the Championship, same with the Championship and League One. 

A change to sixteen is too drastic and unrealistic to do. 

In terms of SL, it sounds like the two changes you are proposing is a reduction in games (2 fewer I think), and a potential 2nd relegation. 

Are those changes necessary do you think? 

[Dave T]

15 hours ago, Jughead said:

12-12-13. 

25 games in Super League and the Championship. Loop games are based on the previous season, so if you finish 1st you play 2nd, 3rd and 4th, if you finish 8th you play 9th, 10th, 11th and 12th. 

League One plays 24, everyone home and away. 

One down from Super League and the Championship with 11th in Super League playing the 2nd team in the Championship, same with the Championship and League One. 

A change to sixteen is too drastic and unrealistic to do. 

In terms of SL, it sounds like the two changes you are proposing is a reduction in games (2 fewer I think), and a potential 2nd relegation. 

Are those changes necessary do you think? 

[Jughead]

37 minutes ago, Dave T said:

In terms of SL, it sounds like the two changes you are proposing is a reduction in games (2 fewer I think), and a potential 2nd relegation. 

Are those changes necessary do you think? 

The second promotion and relegation opportunity is probably more my personal opinion though I’m not sure whether it’s actually necessary, but even so, one place would be fine.

I’d say a couple fewer fixtures a season is probably necessary.

On a slightly related note, we’ve absolutely hung out players to dry the last few years with a backloaded 2020 (that couldn’t be helped), a short turnaround into 2021, a 27 game regular season this year which will lead into a World Cup and then, I fully expect, another early February start in 2023. I think it’s little wonder there was talk of Hull KR having to get Danny McGuire, who retired nearly 4 years ago, out of retirement and there’s been injury crisis’ at Cas, Hull, Saints and probably another club or two along the way. 

As for two fewer games, I’d actively target the Easter Monday game and this bizarre August Bank Holiday game (I know this one is a new advent to the game). Both are unnecessary and I don’t think they do much for the game, the fixtures themselves or the competition. 

I’d hope we could get an actual international weekend fit in somewhere as a result that included three or four international games over a weekend that was statutory but that’s probably wishful thinking. 

[GUBRATS]

6 hours ago, Dave T said:

In terms of SL, it sounds like the two changes you are proposing is a reduction in games (2 fewer I think), and a potential 2nd relegation. 

Are those changes necessary do you think? 

Definitely , shame they weren't already happening , I'd have been able to smell the ' fear ' , or something like it from Wire in Leyth

[Dave T]

9 minutes ago, GUBRATS said:

Definitely , shame they weren't already happening , I'd have been able to smell the ' fear ' , or something like it from Wire in Leyth

Hey, it was never in doubt, we were just playing with you all

[Number 16]

On 16/08/2022 at 10:39, MattSantos said:

On a personal note, i'd be done if Bradford, Newcastle and London were to be promoted through 'artificial' means.

 

So trying to hold together a Championship team and develop players via an academy is 'artificial', yet being in SL but only poaching players from other clubs is 'authentic'. 

[Guest]

8 hours ago, Jughead said:

The second promotion and relegation opportunity is probably more my personal opinion though I’m not sure whether it’s actually necessary, but even so, one place would be fine.

I’d say a couple fewer fixtures a season is probably necessary.

On a slightly related note, we’ve absolutely hung out players to dry the last few years with a backloaded 2020 (that couldn’t be helped), a short turnaround into 2021, a 27 game regular season this year which will lead into a World Cup and then, I fully expect, another early February start in 2023. I think it’s little wonder there was talk of Hull KR having to get Danny McGuire, who retired nearly 4 years ago, out of retirement and there’s been injury crisis’ at Cas, Hull, Saints and probably another club or two along the way. 

As for two fewer games, I’d actively target the Easter Monday game and this bizarre August Bank Holiday game (I know this one is a new advent to the game). Both are unnecessary and I don’t think they do much for the game, the fixtures themselves or the competition. 

I’d hope we could get an actual international weekend fit in somewhere as a result that included three or four international games over a weekend that was statutory but that’s probably wishful thinking. 

23 rounds is enough. I know clubs get two fewer home games but player welfare should come first.

[Jughead]

1 hour ago, NW10LDN said:

23 rounds is enough. I know clubs get two fewer home games but player welfare should come first.

I’d prefer fewer but I think such a drop from 27/28 to 22/23 is highly unlikely.