Fri 23rd Jun: SL: Castleford Tigers v Warrington Wolves KO 20:00

[Old Frightful]

Cas 21 Wire 14.

[Tony_T]

Swede Carrot Lime 

[Old Frightful]

Cas 23 Wire 14, full tarm.

"There's only one Daryl Powell"...

[Padge]

It's not about the 'year', it's about the outcome.

Except when the outcome means it's not your year.

[Dave T]

On the surface, It's odd for fans to be calling for the coaches head based on where we are on the ladder. But too many performances look like 2022. 

[Harry Stottle]

4 minutes ago, Dave T said:

On the surface, It's odd for fans to be calling for the coaches head based on where we are on the ladder. But too many performances look like 2022. 

Wire started like an house on fire, but u fortunately they seem to have run out of fuel to burn, and the head stoker seemingly has nothing else to put on the fire.

[moorside roughyed]

Powell needs to sort this out. For Gods sake Warrington,sort yourselves out.

[WN83]

3 minutes ago, Dave T said:

On the surface, It's odd for fans to be calling for the coaches head based on where we are on the ladder. But too many performances look like 2022. 

That early season run was never going to last forever but the drop off in performance level has been pretty drastic. Wasn’t it 8 on the spin at the start? So that now makes it 3 wins in the last 8 games, with a cup exit thrown in.

 

I get that last season was a shocker for Powell and it must’ve been tough and then he must’ve been as relieved, as he was pleased with your start but I don’t think things like his pub visit did him many favours. After a season like last year, have a good start but just stay level and keep your head down. 

[Gates1]

Powell was given six games to turn it round at the start of the season abd he did that in the short term.

Today he lost to an Andy Last coached team with Nathan Massey at hooker, might take some surviving that

[DEANO]

Warringtons year?

[Fevrover]

8 hours ago, DEANO said:

Warringtons year?

Next year ?

[getdownmonkeyman]

Quite the response to going out of the cup.

[northamptoncougar]

Why’s he sent his junior half out on loan for a season when he’s missing a half?

Matautai will never be a halfback as long as I’ve a hole in my …….

[Dave T]

45 minutes ago, getdownmonkeyman said:

Quite the response to going out of the cup.

I think this is the bit that worries me. We never really got a reaction last year, we're not getting one this year, is Powell capable of turning a struggling team around, did he ever do that at any other clubs? 

One of the things I struggle with somewhat, and it ain't just down to him is that I don't really feel any real affinity with the players at the club at the moment. I find the atmosphere at the club all a bit serious and grumpy, and I do think a lot of that comes from him. 

2022 to me was one of the most brutal cullings I have ever seen at a club - particularly one that had finished 3rd in the ladder, and tbh it still doesn't feel like we are in a better place in the slightest, with the likes of Matautia and Minikin gracing the field for us. 

I can't help but feel there was a lot of gaslight ing going on last year "we NEED a clear out to get rid of the toxicity at the club" yet are we any better now we offloaded Cooper, Hill, Charnley and King, who broadly are doing well elsewhere and I always felt were scapegoats. 

I'm interested in what his next move is. 

[Dave T]

1 minute ago, northamptoncougar said:

Why’s he sent his junior half out on loan for a season when he’s missing a half?

Matautai will never be a halfback as long as I’ve a hole in my …….

He's obsessed with PM. He was singing his praises in local media this week. 

He has been given a weirdly prominent role in our squad which is just baffling. He seems to think he's the new Ellery Hanley. 

[Gates1]

1 hour ago, Dave T said:

I think this is the bit that worries me. We never really got a reaction last year, we're not getting one this year, is Powell capable of turning a struggling team around, did he ever do that at any other clubs? 

 

He took Cas from 3rd bottom of superleague to 4th (and one win away from the league leaders shield at that) in a season if that counts!

If i was a wire fan, my  concerns around Powell would be more around whether he can sustain a team at the top in terms of the pressure and managing a roster to churn the right players at the right time and bring in the right replacements (in my opinion Cas are still suffering now from some of his last year recruitment decisions), albeit this might be less of an issue with the budget Wire have.

I also felt under Powell when Cas were going well it was down been able to blow teams away in attack, 2017 especially Cas were killing games off in 20 minute spells.  Was never that confident in a grind.

 

 

 

 

Edited June 24, 2023 by Gates1

[LeeF]

3 hours ago, Dave T said:

He's obsessed with PM. He was singing his praises in local media this week. 

He has been given a weirdly prominent role in our squad which is just baffling. He seems to think he's the new Ellery Hanley. 

He did the same at Castleford. PM can do no wrong in DP’s eyes

Edited June 24, 2023 by LeeF

[Gates1]

Just rewatching the highlights.   Think Harrison was lucky to get away with a yellow.  Clear hip drop which has done Masseys ligaments apparently.

[meast]

How many games have Warrington lost now since the "Can Warrington go the season unbeaten" stuff on here and in the media?

[GUBRATS]

7 hours ago, Dave T said:

I think this is the bit that worries me. We never really got a reaction last year, we're not getting one this year, is Powell capable of turning a struggling team around, did he ever do that at any other clubs? 

One of the things I struggle with somewhat, and it ain't just down to him is that I don't really feel any real affinity with the players at the club at the moment. I find the atmosphere at the club all a bit serious and grumpy, and I do think a lot of that comes from him. 

2022 to me was one of the most brutal cullings I have ever seen at a club - particularly one that had finished 3rd in the ladder, and tbh it still doesn't feel like we are in a better place in the slightest, with the likes of Matautia and Minikin gracing the field for us. 

I can't help but feel there was a lot of gaslight ing going on last year "we NEED a clear out to get rid of the toxicity at the club" yet are we any better now we offloaded Cooper, Hill, Charnley and King, who broadly are doing well elsewhere and I always felt were scapegoats. 

I'm interested in what his next move is. 

Mulhern 

[corvusxiii]

19 hours ago, Tony_T said:

Swede Carrot Lime 

OMG, it's taken me 19 hours to get that. I apologise to all forum members!!!!

[Dave T]

1 hour ago, GUBRATS said:

Mulhern 

There's plenty others but the ones I listed were described as the toxic problem players. I never got it, they were aways amongst our best when finishing 3rd and heading to Wembley etc. 

[Kenilworth Tiger]

Warrington's squad is as good as any in the league, no question. Quite what is going wrong to get beaten by a Cas team missing 7 players and no recognised hooker is beyond me.

[Saint Toppy]

On 24/06/2023 at 17:36, Dave T said:

There's plenty others but the ones I listed were described as the toxic problem players. I never got it, they were aways amongst our best when finishing 3rd and heading to Wembley etc. 

I get what Powell was saying about a toxic culture when he took over, though nobody outside that playing group will ever know for sure exactly what was going on, but that excuse must be starting to wear pretty thin now. The culture in the playing group comes from and starts with the coaching team. He's had 2 full pre-seasons and 1 1/2 playing seasons to change things and to get his team playing exactly how he wants them to and approaching games as a top team should be week after week.

Every team has an occasional bad week. Sometimes its just down to being outplayed by your opposition on the day, sometimes its down to injuries and sometimes you just get bad calls against you. I dont think its the fact Wire are losing games, its the way they're losing them. They just dont look like they're playing as a team, just a group of individuals, some of which are giving everything and some who look like they're going through the motions.

Wire have probably spent more than any other club in the SL era in constantly brining in new players and all its got them is a few cup wins. I've said this many times on here before, they need to learn from the clubs who have been consistently winning trophies. Forget about trying to buy instant success year after year, build from within, consistently promote your youth, build that culture from the ground up, then supplement that team with the highly paid superstars.

More importantly, have a coach who buys into that philosophy - for me that isn't Powell !!!

[Dave T]

2 minutes ago, Saint Toppy said:

 

Wire have probably spent more than any other club in the SL era in constantly brining in new players and all its got them is a few cup wins. I've said this many times on here before, they need to learn from the clubs who have been consistently winning trophies. Forget about trying to buy instant success year after year, build from within, consistently promote your youth, build that culture from the ground up, then supplement that team with the highly paid superstars.

More importantly, have a coach who buys into that philosophy - for me that isn't Powell !!!

We've disagreed on this before, and no doubt we will again in future - but it is easy for a Saints fan to say you just simply need to promote from within. How does that work when you have this cycle of decades of legacy leading to the best youth players joining the strongest clubs? How does a club overtake Saints and Wigan. And then we look at Leeds who have always been one of the best at the model you describe and they are a bit of a car crash. They'd be better making better signings. 

Promoting from within sounds lovely, but it's a bit idealistic. If your players are fourth choice behind Wigan. Saints and Leeds, then you are never going to overtake them!

Between 2009 and 2019 we:

Won 2 LLS

Lost 4 Grand Finals (by 6pts, 8pts, 8pts and 14 pts)

Won 4 Challenge Cups

Lost 2 Cup finals

The games we lost in that list were all very close games, and were lost due to pure rugby reasons rather than any kind of underlying club issues, or how we got those players together. On another day, we could easily have won some of those games and the record been even better. 

IT may be humorous for fans to laugh at Wire and it being their 'year' but they basically smashed into the top players during that decade, and that was through making quality signings, getting coaching right and winning some great RL games (as well as losing a few epics too!).

We shouldn't describe their model as a failure because they lost a few games by one try, in the same way we didn't dismiss Saints' approach when they went 7 straight years without winning SL, including 5 consecutive defeats at OT, or the 12 years they went without a cup win.

Wire's leadership are not covering themselves in glory right now, but that doesn't mean the model doesn't work.