Martyn Sadler

[Padge]

5 minutes ago, scotchy1 said:

We RL fans might only want a placè to stand and a beer but the fact is the game isn't struggling to sell to us. It's everybody else.

What we are willing to accept is obviously a lot less that others because we are already fans of the game. 

And it's not only about attracting different people. Older stadiums are hugely expensive to maintain.

Also people with young families no longer find it acceptable to take their kids to a ground where they have to pay them in and then they can't see the game.

Gone are the days of lifting kids over the turnstile, when that was an option people would make do. Expectations are a lot higher these days, old farts may hanker after the joys of Central Parks River Caves, modern families expect something a lot more civilised.

[David Shepherd]

4 minutes ago, Padge said:

modern families expect something a lot more civilised.

They'll never know the pleasure of peeing on a brick wall behind Fev's Bullock Shed. I can still smell it now.

Nor the joy of seeing a ball kicked over and knocking an old boy into the trough. 

Happy days

[Tommygilf]

14 minutes ago, Michael1812 said:

When I think about the possibility of Toronto getting promoted and the new grounds I could visit, my top pick would be the Jungle. 

Why do people dislike it so much?

I can totally appreciate that. The Jungle away is one of my favourite trips and is one that me and my friends at different Unis always try and get back for; even if the past few visits have been rather depressing for Leeds. However, it would be daft to deny that a lot of it is in a decrepit state. It has a lot of character but it needs refreshing and that is putting it lightly. 

If I was taking a friend from Uni (ie someone who has never seen the game and just wanted to do something on a day out), I would be unlikely to take them to Cas until they'd at least got a bit of a good impression of the game first. Its a great hark back to tradition for RL fans and many of us love it (I only ever call it a dump after we've lost to them), but for most other people it sadly just looks like the 70 year old ground that it is. 

What I find most annoying about the Jungle and Belle Vue for that matter is somewhat ironically the price to get in there. Two of us paid near enough £50 to get into both these grounds (neither accepted student at the time though I believe Cas have changed that) each time. Its substantially less at Headingley and Saints for example for much better facilities. I've seen top 6 Premier League football at Old Trafford for less this year. So not only are you standing in a crumbling stadium with minimal amenities but you're paying over the odds for it. 

Perhaps Cas reckon that they won't increase their matchday crowds significantly by upgrading the stadium as they're happy as it is so its not a priority. 

If I were them and this new ground is pie in the sky, then I would knock down their main stand and build a new all seater stand with proper Corporate facilities.

[Padge]

Cas's ground is a dump and an embarrassment, it is not fit for purpose and should be bulldozed into the ground.

Wakefield's is even worse.

How anyone can think that in this century this standard is acceptable is beyond me.

[Man of Kent]

Not sure Wheldon Road and Belle Vue should be lumped in the same sentence.

I honestly don’t think I’ve been to a worse ground in full-time professional sport than Belle Vue. Only Luton Town’s Kenilworth Road comes close for sheer delapidation. 

[Kayakman]

11 minutes ago, Padge said:

Cas's ground is a dump and an embarrassment, it is not fit for purpose and should be bulldozed into the ground.

Wakefield's is even worse.

How anyone can think that in this century this standard is acceptable is beyond me.

I have never been to the ground in Cas but I have seen it many times on TV...it has an appeal, an aura that we crave in stadiums over here.  The crowd and atmosphere on the screen makes me want to go there...not a newly padded seat or new scoreboard.

I've seen the same dynamic in education though.  A brand new classroom with all the gizmos and enticements...a large outlay of coin.  With a bad teacher it is a tomb.  In rugby the product is the key, not the grounds.  The atmosphere in Cas is second to none on the screen I watch.

Thinking that an all new stadium "new and improved" is better is a false premise in many cases...same as a new technological classroom.   Its what goes on in that classroom and what  happens on the rugby grounds, that is the key.  Odsal looks like, and probably is a dump, but it has an appeal all of its own and I can only imagine what it was like in the glory days of the Bulls.

Don't be so quick to tear down and dismiss old things that have proven their worth.

[Padge]

Just now, Kayakman said:

I have never been to the ground in Cas but I have seen it many times on TV...it has an appeal, an aura that we crave in stadiums over here.  The crowd and atmosphere on the screen makes me want to go there...not a newly padded seat or new scoreboard.

I've seen the same dynamic in education though.  A brand new classroom with all the gizmos and enticements...a large outlay of coin.  With a bad teacher it is a tomb.  In rugby the product is the key, not the grounds.  The atmosphere in Cas is second to none on the screen I watch.

Thinking that an all new stadium "new and improved" is better is a false premise in many cases...same as a new technological classroom.   Its what goes on in that classroom and what  happens on the rugby grounds, that is the key.  Odsal looks like, and probably is a dump, but it has an appeal all of its own and i can only imagine what it was like in the glory days of the Bulls.

Don't be so quick to tear down and dismiss old things that have proven their worth.

You really don't know how much of a $h!t3 hole these places are.

I loved Wigan's old ground, Central Park, but it was a crumbling wreck that cost a fortune to maintain and the attempt to upgrade one stand went from an initial cost of £0.5m to over £2m. Give me our current stadium any day.

 

 

[Kayakman]

1 minute ago, Padge said:

You really don't know how much of a $h!t3 hole these places are.

I loved Wigan's old ground, Central Park, but it was a crumbling wreck that cost a fortune to maintain and the attempt to upgrade one stand went from an initial cost of £0.5m to over £2m. Give me our current stadium any day.

 

 

Yes, but it certainly left an impression on you to this very day...it certainly 'imprinted'!!!!!!!!

P.S. Do they still have those old pee troughs in the washrooms at Leeds?  Reminded me of those old hockey arenas in Northern Ontario.

[Padge]

All things that leave an impression are not good.

Don't know what is left of the Headingley $h!t3 hole since they have been knocking seven bells out of it for the past 12 months.

Headingley may get some nice new stands but access and egress at the ground will still be appalling.

But fair enough they are at least updating the crumbling wreck.

 

 

[MZH]

43 minutes ago, Padge said:

Cas's ground is a dump and an embarrassment, it is not fit for purpose and should be bulldozed into the ground.

Wakefield's is even worse.

How anyone can think that in this century this standard is acceptable is beyond me.

I don't think anyone thinks its acceptable. I know its a complete s**thole, and any complaints people have about the facilities are totally valid, but thats doesn't stop me enjoying my visits. There is just something about the place.

[Padge]

2 minutes ago, MZH said:

There is just something about the place.

Yes, the stench of decay.

[M j M]

30 minutes ago, Padge said:

All things that leave an impression are not good. 

Don't know what is left of the Headingley $h!t3 hole since they have been knocking seven bells out of it for the past 12 months.

Headingley may get some nice new stands but access and egress at the ground will still be appalling. 

But fair enough they are at least updating the crumbling wreck.  

 

Leeds had already spent £12m on the ground in the Hetherington era before they even started the current development. Crumbling it was not.

[David Shepherd]

1 hour ago, Michael1812 said:

When I think about the possibility of Toronto getting promoted and the new grounds I could visit, my top pick would be the Jungle. 

Why do people dislike it so much?

It's a dump. Asbestos in the roof, toilets like a medieval privvy, massive fire hazard of a main stand (Google the Bradford City Fire). Playing surface short by at least 10 metres. 

No trophy cabinet

[David Shepherd]

23 minutes ago, Padge said:

Yes, the stench of decay.

I think that's all the pollution from Hicksons

[Northern Eel]

13 hours ago, David Shepherd said:

Agreed, nothing worse than a soulless empty ground.  Especially if there's an echoing cow bell a la Fartown.

However, as a paying spectator you'd never want to actually visit Cas or Wakey's stadium.  Not unless you'd topped up your life insurance anyway.

What's unsafe about Wakey? I always enjoy a visit there. 

[Ackroman]

9 hours ago, Kayakman said:

I have never been to the ground in Cas but I have seen it many times on TV...it has an appeal, an aura that we crave in stadiums over here.  The crowd and atmosphere on the screen makes me want to go there...not a newly padded seat or new scoreboard.

I've seen the same dynamic in education though.  A brand new classroom with all the gizmos and enticements...a large outlay of coin.  With a bad teacher it is a tomb.  In rugby the product is the key, not the grounds.  The atmosphere in Cas is second to none on the screen I watch.

Thinking that an all new stadium "new and improved" is better is a false premise in many cases...same as a new technological classroom.   Its what goes on in that classroom and what  happens on the rugby grounds, that is the key.  Odsal looks like, and probably is a dump, but it has an appeal all of its own and I can only imagine what it was like in the glory days of the Bulls.

Don't be so quick to tear down and dismiss old things that have proven their worth.

Our sports infrastructure has been proven to have fatal consequences when we don't accept it's passed its sell by date. Can't be sentimental about that.

BTW you've just described the education system in this country. Shiny new academies but rather than having bad teachers, we're teaching a Victorian curriculum.

 

[weloveyouwakefield2]

11 hours ago, David Shepherd said:

What land would WMDC sell?  None of the three stadiums are owned by WMDC.  The three combined stadiums and the land around will come nowhere near £25M.  Belle Vue is owned by Bank of Ireland, what's in it for them?

Belle Vue was sold by the bank of Ireland and Sir Rodney Judas Walker told the club not to bid on it because it would push the price up for York Court. Ended up York court bid peanuts and the 88m group bought it!. Now mr box is trying to elbow the community stadium group HIS council set up from negotiating and talk to a fantasy community trust headed by Rodney walker!!!! Nobody ever believes this will happen because they are all liers and only interested in saving face. 

This Wakefield in no mans land and if you had a billion pounds you would struggle to build a stadium because of the people in power!!

[M j M]

There is nothing to suggest either Belle Vue or Wheldon Road are in any way unsafe. The stadium safety environment has come on a long way since the 1980s.

[Blind side johnny]

12 hours ago, jpmc said:

My understand was that the sale of land in Leigh payed for the LSV Stadium to be built,why cant the same be done in the Wakefield dtstrict ?

Anothe avenue would be to ask other councils for loans repayable at extraordinarily good rates,I believe wigan council do this instead of fixing potholes.

I keep hearing something about austerity. Could these be related?

[David Shepherd]

2 hours ago, weloveyouwakefield2 said:

 

This Wakefield in no mans land and if you had a billion pounds you would struggle to build a stadium because of the people in power!!

This.

In my opinion, WMDC is badly suffering from being a one party state.

This leaves the leadership able to do whatever the hell they like, without fear of losing office.

Lack of effective democracy is the best breeding ground for corruption.

I wish the people of Wakefield would wake up and stop voting for the ruling party.

 

[Tommygilf]

39 minutes ago, David Shepherd said:

This.

In my opinion, WMDC is badly suffering from being a one party state.

This leaves the leadership able to do whatever the hell they like, without fear of losing office.

Lack of effective democracy is the best breeding ground for corruption.

I wish the people of Wakefield would wake up and stop voting for the ruling party.

 

Even as a Labour member I can totally agree with you on that. Its a council in desperate need of a shake up.

[Manx RL]

15 hours ago, Padge said:

Cas's ground is a dump and an embarrassment, it is not fit for purpose and should be bulldozed into the ground.

Wakefield's is even worse.

How anyone can think that in this century this standard is acceptable is beyond me.

They both beat a trip to Beamish for nostalgia and an insight to the country’s industrial heritage.

[Agbrigg]

21 minutes ago, Manx RL said:

They both beat a trip to Beamish for nostalgia and an insight to the country’s industrial heritage.

Belle vue is a dump and as a loyal and lifelong supporter I hate it. 

Trinity is now a good well run club but the stadium is holding us back and seriously effecting crowds.

However it is the world's oldest surviving  rugby le ague ground and one thing I fear is that some well meaning heritage anorak may try and preserve the place

[Mumby Magic]

The point of the OP is that Clubs like Fev and York, to name two have progressed on the ground front. That  is from the "lower leagues". With all due respect, even if it is upgrading their grounds at the moment some work should be done.

[bobbruce]

39 minutes ago, Mumby Magic said:

The point of the OP is that Clubs like Fev and York, to name two have progressed on the ground front. That  is from the "lower leagues". With all due respect, even if it is upgrading their grounds at the moment some work should be done.

Is it still Wakefield that own the ground?.