Notre Dame on fire

[Bedford Roughyed]

Help is at hand!

 

[DavidM]

5 minutes ago, Bedford Roughyed said:

Help is at hand!

 

Which of course they just have ready and fully loaded in the off chance 

[Chrispmartha]

28 minutes ago, Bedford Roughyed said:

Help is at hand!

 

Is there nothing that this man can’t be a ##### about.

Really sad to see the footage, I don’t think there has to be a loss of life for something to be a tragedy and in some ways upsetting.

[Saintslass]

22 minutes ago, DavidM said:

Which of course they just have ready and fully loaded in the off chance 

Apparently to douse it with water from the air would ruin the remaining structure due to the force of the water hitting it.  So said someone on one of the news websites anyway.

Yes, nobody has been killed or injured apparently.  But that doesn't detract from a sense of loss at the destruction of such an iconic building.  I am glad I visited it all those years ago.  It was very impressive inside and as with so many historic cathedrals there was a real sense of peace and general awesomeness within the building.

[Chrispmartha]

2 hours ago, Lounge Room Lizard said:

Sorry, but its just an old historic building that is damaged by fire. Yes no doubt some old stuff has been destroyed etc. While sad, its hardly worth in my opinion, the various News Channels spending hours watching it for no real reason. Hopefully nobody is injured or killed. The 30 years since 96 people died is far more interesting. Eight people dead from a Tornado in the USA is far more news worthy, as is the situation in Sudan. Seems people think more of an old historical building than news that is of far more interest and affects peoples lives.

Whilst obviously your entitled to that opinion I don’t agree.

Hillsborough has had massive amounts of coverage for the last 30 years, the fire is happening as we speak so is bound to command some real time reporting and as I say I don’t think an incident has to have loss of life to be relevant or indeed upsetting.

[The Hallucinating Goose]

One of my biggest passions is architecture. My greatest passion is history and the two go hand in hand and it is perhaps that reason I am most heartbroken today. The destruction of a truly iconic and historical building like this is like the death of the history that goes with it. Great buildings are the embodiment of history, of all the millions of people that have been a part of them. I feel their memory lives on within these places. When I walk round a great place in history I am able to imagine the people that were there, what happened there and feel so close to it, almost a part of that history. 

I went to the nazi rally grounds in nuremberg a couple of years ago. There is a huge concrete podium and banking around a massive square. This is where Hitler addressed thousands of his troops with those powerful speeches he gave. I sat looking at that podium and saw Hitler standing there shouting to his troops, waving his arm around as he did. It took courage for me to walk over to the podium and stand on it and place my hands on the railing. I was stood in the exact spot, the exact spot, where Adolf Hitler had once stood. My feet were touching the exact bit of concrete his had done, my hands the exact railing his had done. I saw those troops out there in front of me. At that moment I was so overcome with emotion and I am man enough to admit I cried. If that building wasn't there anymore I wouldn't have had that experience. I would have shrugged my shoulders and walked past without a second thought.

That is just one example of many many similar experiences I have had at these places. My favourite city is berlin. I have walked through the brandenburg gate and down unten den linden like all those great world leaders. I have stood in alexanderplatz and marvelled at that great soviet TV tower. I have touched the last remaining segments of the berlin wall and felt the pain of those imprisoned behind it and visited hohenshonhausen prison where the stasi tortured so many people and in fact met former inmates, listened to their stories and felt a part of that history. I went to devin Castle in Slovakia and stood on the battlements watching napoleon's armies blasting it to pieces. I've been to cologne cathedral and watched the city burn around it as the allies relentlessly bombed it. 

And you know what other piece of history I've lived? I've been there when napoleon I was crowned at notre dame cathedral. History that people like me might not be able to experience, might not be able to be a part of in quite the same way now as the physical embodiment of that truly mind-blowing piece of human history disappears, "like tears in the rain"... 

[bobbruce]

2 hours ago, Kayakman said:

The only church I was ever formally barred entry to....guess I will never see the inside now.

You are the scarlet pimpernel and I claim my £5. 

[Chrispmartha]

10 minutes ago, The Hallucinating Goose said:

One of my biggest passions is architecture. My greatest passion is history and the two go hand in hand and it is perhaps that reason I am most heartbroken today. The destruction of a truly iconic and historical building like this is like the death of the history that goes with it. Great buildings are the embodiment of history, of all the millions of people that have been a part of them. I feel their memory lives on within these places. When I walk round a great place in history I am able to imagine the people that were there, what happened there and feel so close to it, almost a part of that history. 

I went to the nazi rally grounds in nuremberg a couple of years ago. There is a huge concrete podium and banking around a massive square. This is where Hitler addressed thousands of his troops with those powerful speeches he gave. I sat looking at that podium and saw Hitler standing there shouting to his troops, waving his arm around as he did. It took courage for me to walk over to the podium and stand on it and place my hands on the railing. I was stood in the exact spot, the exact spot, where Adolf Hitler had once stood. My feet were touching the exact bit of concrete his had done, my hands the exact railing his had done. I saw those troops out there in front of me. At that moment I was so overcome with emotion and I am man enough to admit I cried. If that building wasn't there anymore I wouldn't have had that experience. I would have shrugged my shoulders and walked past without a second thought.

That is just one example of many many similar experiences I have had at these places. My favourite city is berlin. I have walked through the brandenburg gate and down unten den linden like all those great world leaders. I have stood in alexanderplatz and marvelled at that great soviet TV tower. I have touched the last remaining segments of the berlin wall and felt the pain of those imprisoned behind it and visited hohenshonhausen prison where the stasi tortured so many people and in fact met former inmates, listened to their stories and felt a part of that history. I went to devin Castle in Slovakia and stood on the battlements watching napoleon's armies blasting it to pieces. I've been to cologne cathedral and watched the city burn around it as the allies relentlessly bombed it. 

And you know what other piece of history I've lived? I've been there when napoleon I was crowned at notre dame cathedral. History that people like me might not be able to experience, might not be able to be a part of in quite the same way now as the physical embodiment of that truly mind-blowing piece of human history disappears, "like tears in the rain"... 

What a great post, thank you.

[Kayakman]

2 hours ago, Mister Ting said:

OK, but so far, no one has been killed.

One firefighter seriously injured.

[Mister Ting]

5 minutes ago, Kayakman said:

One firefighter seriously injured.

Hope he'll pull through.

[Kayakman]

15 minutes ago, bobbruce said:

You are the scarlet pimpernel and I claim my £5. 

Where do I pay.

[Kayakman]

I'm serious...they would not let me in because they had some type of special fee to get in that day.  I told them I wasn't paying a fee to go into my fathers home...they had to get this Nun then and she said I had to pay the entrance fee.

I told her I was a formal layperson of the Catholic Church and that I wanted to pray in my Fathers house...I wasn't there for the 'tourist ticket'...I was there to pray in my fathers home, which is also my home...I would never pay a fee  to enter my father's home.

Then security got involved and I had to leave.

It still goes down as the only church (of any denomination) that I was ever barred from.  It reminded me of the old indulgences: "For every penny in the coffer that rings, a soul from purgatory springs!"

I wasn't paying.

[GUBRATS]

1 minute ago, Kayakman said:

I'm serious...they would not let me in because they had some type of special fee to get in that day.  I told them I wasn't paying a fee to go into my fathers home...they had to get this Nun then and she said I had to pay the entrance fee.

I told her I was a formal layperson of the Catholic Church and that I wanted to pray in my Fathers house...I wasn't there for the 'tourist ticket'...I was there to pray in my fathers home, which is also my home...I would never pay a fee  to enter my father's home.

Then security got involved and I had to leave.

It still goes down as the only church (of any denomination) that I was ever barred from.  It reminded me of the old indulgences: "For every penny in the coffer that rings, a soul from purgatory springs!"

I wasn't paying.

Cheapskate

[bobbruce]

7 minutes ago, Kayakman said:

I'm serious...they would not let me in because they had some type of special fee to get in that day.  I told them I wasn't paying a fee to go into my fathers home...they had to get this Nun then and she said I had to pay the entrance fee.

I told her I was a formal layperson of the Catholic Church and that I wanted to pray in my Fathers house...I wasn't there for the 'tourist ticket'...I was there to pray in my fathers home, which is also my home...I would never pay a fee  to enter my father's home.

Then security got involved and I had to leave.

It still goes down as the only church (of any denomination) that I was ever barred from.  It reminded me of the old indulgences: "For every penny in the coffer that rings, a soul from purgatory springs!"

I wasn't paying.

 

17 minutes ago, Kayakman said:

Where do I pay.

If only you’d said that on your visit to Notra Dame you might’ve got in.

[Mister Ting]

16 minutes ago, Kayakman said:

I'm serious...they would not let me in because they had some type of special fee to get in that day.  I told them I wasn't paying a fee to go into my fathers home...they had to get this Nun then and she said I had to pay the entrance fee.

I told her I was a formal layperson of the Catholic Church and that I wanted to pray in my Fathers house...I wasn't there for the 'tourist ticket'...I was there to pray in my fathers home, which is also my home...I would never pay a fee  to enter my father's home.

Then security got involved and I had to leave.

It still goes down as the only church (of any denomination) that I was ever barred from.  It reminded me of the old indulgences: "For every penny in the coffer that rings, a soul from purgatory springs!"

I wasn't paying.

They probably thought you were another American religious nut job.

[Kayakman]

2 minutes ago, Mister Ting said:

They probably thought you were another American religious nut job.

Either that or a penny counter from Yorkshire!

[Mister Ting]

1 minute ago, Kayakman said:

Either that or a penny counter from Yorkshire!

Cheeky sod!

I live in a part of Yorkshire once known for having it's own mint.

[Padge]

1 hour ago, Kayakman said:

I'm serious...they would not let me in because they had some type of special fee to get in that day.  I told them I wasn't paying a fee to go into my fathers home...they had to get this Nun then and she said I had to pay the entrance fee.

I told her I was a formal layperson of the Catholic Church and that I wanted to pray in my Fathers house...I wasn't there for the 'tourist ticket'...I was there to pray in my fathers home, which is also my home...I would never pay a fee  to enter my father's home.

Then security got involved and I had to leave.

It still goes down as the only church (of any denomination) that I was ever barred from.  It reminded me of the old indulgences: "For every penny in the coffer that rings, a soul from purgatory springs!"

I wasn't paying.

I admire your stand.

Cap doffs in your direction.

[17 stone giant]

Very sad. I hope they are able to save as much of it as possible, and can quickly rebuild what has been damaged.

[RobertAM]

4 hours ago, Chrispmartha said:

Is there nothing that this man can’t be a ##### about.

Really sad to see the footage, I don’t think there has to be a loss of life for something to be a tragedy and in some ways upsetting.

Donald really is a berk.

[Lounge Room Lizard]

11 hours ago, Kayakman said:

You have no knowledge or love of architecture.

I find news that sadly people have died from a Tornado more newsworthy and important than a building on fire. The same with the situation in Sudan. Yes its a shame the Notre Dame is badly damaged. But its a building and not people. A building can be restored but  peoples lives cant. Yes the Notre Dame is an important building. But its not going to change the daily lives of people in France or the World and its not really going to change the lives of the locals. I just feel its way over the top how its been reported over other things.

I find the news coverage over the top, especially when its on fire and nothing really is going to change in 30 minutes or so. It comes across as people are more interested in a building than people who have been killed. If a few people had been killed fair enough. But as far as I know nobody has. The sadness of a loss of some history is understandable. But its not the end of architecture or some section of History. A number of things are in Museums. An understanding of life and culture is still with us. So for me its a building thats partially damaged. There are far more serious problems and news in life for me.

[Just Browny]

After Bob8.

Ahem, my dissertation was on medieval Paris, perhaps I can help.

The fire last night is very, very sad. The devastation of such an iconic, beautiful and historic building is very emotive and it must have been very hard to see for local people and the people (firefighters, but not only firefighters) who were working to save the building and its priceless contents.

And yet, we do need to be careful about hyperbole. A thousand years of history was not lost last night. The part of the building that I think of when I think of Notre-Dame, the stunning facade, appears to have survived. More importantly still, the entire history of buildings like that is that they are rased, burned down, bombed out, eroded by time. Many of the great buildings we love in Western Europe have burned, been saved, been improved. If it didn't happen now, it would happen in fifty years' time, or in a hundred.

Whether Notre-Dame is lost will depend on the reaction of the people who love it (a vast number, some of them very wealthy) and the City of Paris. The reaction we have seen overnight suggests that significant resources will be put towards the rebuild: perhaps it will end up stronger than would have been the case under the renovation that was already ongoing.

So yes it is very sad. But the fire and reaction (even Trump's) is a helpful reminder of our common humanity and Notre-Dame will live on.

[Trojan]

Most of the reduntant churches and chapels around here have been turned into flats.  Just a thought!

The one church that "went on fire" after planning permission to turn it into a hotel was refused,  has been left a derelict ruin

 

[JohnM]

12 hours ago, gingerjon said:

It's a thousand years old and it will be burnt out inside two hours.

Not sure there's any hyperbole there.

No hyperbole. That was removed along with many of the treasures prior to the refurbishment,  it serms. 

 

[gingerjon]

12 minutes ago, Just Browny said:

And yet, we do need to be careful about hyperbole.

People like you are worse than Hitler.