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John Drake

Sat 9 Nov: Intl: New Zealand v Great Britain KO 7am (UK Time) (TV)

Who will win?  

62 members have voted

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  1. 1. Who will win?

    • New Zealand by 13 points or more
      14
    • New Zealand by 7 to 12 points
      18
    • New Zealand by 1 to 6 points
      5
    • Great Britain by 1 to 6 points
      14
    • Great Britain by 7 to 12 points
      7
    • Great Britain by 13 points or more
      4

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  • Poll closed on 09/11/19 at 07:00

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I think people look back with rose tinted glasses, in my life we put teams out with so called legends of the game and still lost every series against the Aussies.

Looking back at 80s,90, teams littered with once in a lifetime players and although we may have won an odd game we never looked like winning a series. The team today was poor and tactically inept but we were no closer in the past . A better prepared tour with players picked on form not past reputation and we could easily have won all four games.

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29 minutes ago, Scubby said:

Bateman starred in the NRL from round 1. He wasn't developing as the season went on.

So you don't think playing with and against better players week in week out improves rugby league players in any way, shape or form?

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5 minutes ago, AB90 said:

So you don't think playing with and against better players week in week out improves rugby league players in any way, shape or form?

That isn't what he said , and you know it , he said Bateman was ' starring ' right from the start 

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Just now, AB90 said:

So you don't think playing with and against better players week in week out improves rugby league players in any way, shape or form?

Of course it can improve them, but it can also stifle them. Look at Ben Murdoch-Masilla. He is an absolute beast now with a phenomenal off-loading game. He would have been considered too maverick in the NRL but SL has allowed him to keep that instinct. Bennett would have him playing completion ball if he was at Souths.

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49 minutes ago, Scubby said:

Well Bennett has said everyone who is in the squad will get a game so Williams and Trueman must be in the 17 next week. We could have 6 half backs in the 17 ūüėģ¬†

No problem, just play Truman on one wing and Williams on the other.

Job done!

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7 minutes ago, Scubby said:

Of course it can improve them, but it can also stifle them. Look at Ben Murdoch-Masilla. He is an absolute beast now with a phenomenal off-loading game. He would have been considered too maverick in the NRL but SL has allowed him to keep that instinct. Bennett would have him playing completion ball if he was at Souths.

Fair enough. Personally, I just think Batemans a much better player from the 2018 series. He may of got there if he played for Wigan in 2019 (I beg to differ).

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37 minutes ago, ELBOWSEYE said:

I think people look back with rose tinted glasses, in my life we put teams out with so called legends of the game and still lost every series against the Aussies.

Looking back at 80s,90, teams littered with once in a lifetime players and although we may have won an odd game we never looked like winning a series. The team today was poor and tactically inept but we were no closer in the past . A better prepared tour with players picked on form not past reputation and we could easily have won all four games.

The problem there was the 80's and 90's Aussie team contained some of the best players of all time - Meninga, Kenny, Lewis, sterling, ET, Fitler, Johns, Daley in the halves and backs i could go on it was a conveyor belt not to mention the monsters in the pack like Harrogan, Lazarus, Sironen etc... 

Its all about timing and i don't think the current Aussie team is a vintage one and is there for the taking but it looks like we are back to square one and are going to still be a way behind them come next year.

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1 minute ago, AB90 said:

Fair enough. Personally, I just think Batemans a much better player from the 2018 series. He may of got there if he played for Wigan in 2019 (I beg to differ).

That might just be due to confidence. He has had an amazing year.

The NRL allows you to test yourself for sure. No doubt it is a much higher level competition. Saying that, James Roby is a better hooker than nearly all NRL 9s. We do produce very talented players.

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9 minutes ago, AB90 said:

Fair enough. Personally, I just think Batemans a much better player from the 2018 series. He may of got there if he played for Wigan in 2019 (I beg to differ).

Opinions , completely unprovable , but everybody is entitled 

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6 minutes ago, Scubby said:

That might just be due to confidence. He has had an amazing year.

The NRL allows you to test yourself for sure. No doubt it is a much higher level competition. Saying that, James Roby is a better hooker than nearly all NRL 9s. We do produce very talented players.

Don't be silly 

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8 minutes ago, SilentAssassin said:

The problem there was the 80's and 90's Aussie team contained some of the best players of all time - Meninga, Kenny, Lewis, sterling, ET, Fitler, Johns, Daley in the halves and backs i could go on it was a conveyor belt not to mention the monsters in the pack like Harrogan, Lazarus, Sironen etc... 

Its all about timing and i don't think the current Aussie team is a vintage one and is there for the taking but it looks like we are back to square one and are going to still be a way behind them come next year.

Yes but send your team out scared of the opposition , by basically saying " if we can stop them from scoring any trys we might sneak more penalties and win " 

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21 minutes ago, SilentAssassin said:

The problem there was the 80's and 90's Aussie team contained some of the best players of all time - Meninga, Kenny, Lewis, sterling, ET, Fitler, Johns, Daley in the halves and backs i could go on it was a conveyor belt not to mention the monsters in the pack like Harrogan, Lazarus, Sironen etc... 

Its all about timing and i don't think the current Aussie team is a vintage one and is there for the taking but it looks like we are back to square one and are going to still be a way behind them come next year.

I like many others have been watching past gb tries,  long range efforts from Davies,Offiah, Drummond,Schofield, Hanley etc. But how many spectacular tries do we see week in week out, not many most are scored in the twenty zone. Yet in international games were the defence is usually tighter and games have few chances we still believe we can play the way we did when defence was poorer. The GB squad could have performed well enough to beat all 3 teams on tour but poor selection and poor tactics have nullified any quality we have.

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32 minutes ago, SilentAssassin said:

The problem there was the 80's and 90's Aussie team contained some of the best players of all time - Meninga, Kenny, Lewis, sterling, ET, Fitler, Johns, Daley in the halves and backs i could go on it was a conveyor belt not to mention the monsters in the pack like Harrogan, Lazarus, Sironen etc... 

Its all about timing and i don't think the current Aussie team is a vintage one and is there for the taking but it looks like we are back to square one and are going to still be a way behind them come next year.

One day, this hardy perennial will turn out to be true. But fans have been regurgitating it every year since the Invincibles turned up and gubbed us, and we still keep on losing to them.

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"Men will be proud to say 'I am a European'. We hope to see a day when men of every country will think as much of being a European as of being from their native land." (Winston Churchill)

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2 hours ago, damp squib said:

If it keeps happening with multiple managers over decades, surely at some point you have to start thinking that the players aren't as good as you think they are?

This is exactly right.  Look at the two teams that contested the 2004 tri-nations final at Elland Road that I referenced earlier.

Great Britain: 

Wellens, Carney, Gleeson, Senior, Reardon, Harris, Long, Fielden, Newton, Morley, Peacock, Farrell, Sculthorpe.
Replacements: McGuire, Johnson, Bailey, O'Loughlin.

Australia:

Minichiello, Rooney, Berrigan, Tonga, Sing, Lockyer, Kimmorley, Webcke, Buderus, Civoniceva, Ryan, Hindmarsh, Carroll.
Replacements: Wing, O'Meley, Fitzgibbon, Mason.

That Great Britain side included some of the best players of the Super League era and some of the players (Morley, Peacock, Farrell, Sculthorpe) were in a fair few of the 'best XIII I have ever seen' thread.

And yet that Kangaroo side was 38-0 up at half time!

I'm all for believing that England/Great Britain should throw the ball around show our natural ability but the reality is that no matter how much I want us to win I will take 6-0 loss at the final hooter in the World Cup Final every day of the week over a 38-0 half time score.  At least it is less embarrassing.

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10 minutes ago, Dunbar said:

This is exactly right.  Look at the two teams that contested the 2004 tri-nations final at Elland Road that I referenced earlier.

Great Britain: 

Wellens, Carney, Gleeson, Senior, Reardon, Harris, Long, Fielden, Newton, Morley, Peacock, Farrell, Sculthorpe.
Replacements: McGuire, Johnson, Bailey, O'Loughlin.

Australia:

Minichiello, Rooney, Berrigan, Tonga, Sing, Lockyer, Kimmorley, Webcke, Buderus, Civoniceva, Ryan, Hindmarsh, Carroll.
Replacements: Wing, O'Meley, Fitzgibbon, Mason.

That Great Britain side included some of the best players of the Super League era and some of the players (Morley, Peacock, Farrell, Sculthorpe) were in a fair few of the 'best XIII I have ever seen' thread.

And yet that Kangaroo side was 38-0 up at half time!

I'm all for believing that England/Great Britain should throw the ball around show our natural ability but the reality is that no matter how much I want us to win I will take 6-0 loss at the final hooter in the World Cup Final every day of the week over a 38-0 half time score.  At least it is less embarrassing.

So the Aussies stuck to a tight defensive game plan then ?

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11 minutes ago, GUBRATS said:

So the Aussies stuck to a tight defensive game plan then ?

Well they didn't concede any points did they?

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16 minutes ago, Futtocks said:

One day, this hardy perennial will turn out to be true. But fans have been regurgitating it every year since the Invincibles turned up and gubbed us, and we still keep on losing to them.

How many of the current Aussies will go on to be remembered in the same breath as the names i mentioned?

Halves are nothing spectacular. Smith is still the best hooker in NRL and is retired from rep football. Full back is very good and pack is solid as always will be but no scary names in there.

As said we can't take advantage of that as we have regressed alarmingly from the 2017 WC team who i believe would beat this current aussie team on home soil.

 

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4 minutes ago, SilentAssassin said:

How many of the current Aussies will go on to be remembered in the same breath as the names i mentioned?

Halves are nothing spectacular. Smith is still the best hooker in NRL and is retired from rep football. Full back is very good and pack is solid as always will be but no scary names in there.

As said we can't take advantage of that as we have regressed alarmingly from the 2017 WC team who i believe would beat this current aussie team on home soil.

I'm sure some fans looked at Sterling, Kenny and Lewis and thought "Who are these guys? They aren't a patch on their predecessors - we can handle them." Wins make reputations and, the Tonga test apart, the Kangaroos are still frustratingly hard to beat.

I'll judge the current crop on their Ashes performances next year (if they don't cancel at the last minute).


"Men will be proud to say 'I am a European'. We hope to see a day when men of every country will think as much of being a European as of being from their native land." (Winston Churchill)

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11 minutes ago, GUBRATS said:

If they didn't have to defend any sets they wouldn't need to ? ūüėČ

I realise you are playing a little bit of devils advocate here but let me ask... which was the better performance from Great Britain, 38-0 down at home to Australia at half time and losing 44-4 or losing 6-0 away?

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2 minutes ago, Futtocks said:

I'm sure some fans looked at Sterling, Kenny and Lewis and thought "Who are these guys? They aren't a patch on their predecessors - we can handle them." Wins make reputations and, the Tonga test apart, the Kangaroos are still frustratingly hard to beat.

I'll judge the current crop on their Ashes performances next year (if they don't cancel at the last minute).

They won't cancel , they'd miss out on that big cash ' windfall ' from playing Toronto as a warm up ūüėČ

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