IMG Grading System (Many Merged Threads)

[JohnM]

28 minutes ago, Damien said:

I wouldn't be expecting huge things from any RFL President. I would though expect expect them to be an ambassador for the game and to talk it up. In particular I would expect them to talk about how it is poised to grow and develop in the future due to the direction the RFL and its clubs have chosen.

Yes, I agree. I was just indulging in the age-old tradition of disparagement I think maybe he was victim of a sting. His personal view will now be used as if it were expressed in his position as President, not as a private individual,  by the usual suspects to justify their position

Edited September 3, 2024 by JohnM

[Liverpool Rover]

He says it’s not about money but the ability of the players, but if you want the players of the required ability than it is about the money.

[Tommygilf]

2 minutes ago, Liverpool Rover said:

He says it’s not about money but the ability of the players, but if you want the players of the required ability than it is about the money.

Yeah exactly, again the corinthian spirit rears it's ugly head in the professional game.

[Hopie]

1 hour ago, Damien said:

In particular I would expect them to talk about how it is poised to grow and develop in the future due to the direction the RFL and its clubs have chosen.

So the president should just make stuff up?

[Damien]

1 minute ago, Hopie said:

So the president should just make stuff up?

That's a weird take.

[Jill Halfpenny fan]

52 minutes ago, Damien said:

That's a weird take.

How about he should lie?

[Damien]

1 hour ago, Jill Halfpenny fan said:

How about he should lie?

No one said he should lie, again that is daft.

Like it or not the RFL and the clubs have agreed to this strategic partnership and the path the game is taking. The aims and goals should be obvious to him, and are obvious to all unless you didn't bother to read the press releases. You may not like them, or disagree with them, but they are certainly to grow and develop in the future (amongst others).

[RP London]

1 hour ago, Jill Halfpenny fan said:

How about he should lie?

why would it be a lie?

"The sport aims to grow with this new plan building on firm foundations of good, strong clubs with a base in its traditional heartlands." would be a nice little statement and is neither a lie nor made up but paints everything positively rather than negative takes on it.. 

[Hopie]

6 minutes ago, Damien said:

No one said he should lie, again that is daft.

Like it or not the RFL and the clubs have agreed to this strategic partnership and the path the game is taking. The aims and goals should be obvious to him, and are obvious to all unless you didn't bother to read the press releases. You may not like them, or disagree with them, but they are certainly to grow and develop in the future (amongst others).

Noted that you have changed from saying what the game is poised to do, to what the game is aiming to do. These are different.

[Damien]

Just now, Hopie said:

Noted that you have changed from saying what the game is poised to do, to what the game is aiming to do. These are different.

I'm not changing anything.

If he was speaking I would absolutely expect him to express the goals by talking up the game and saying things like the game is poised to do, is going to do etc through its changes and improvements.

I really thought people wouldnt need that explaining to them.

[phiggins]

Not been on this thread for a few days. Have we all reached an agreement yet?

[Wollo Wollo Wayoo]

33 minutes ago, phiggins said:

Not been on this thread for a few days. Have we all reached an agreement yet?

Only that London are out.

[Hopie]

1 hour ago, Damien said:

I'm not changing anything.

If he was speaking I would absolutely expect him to express the goals by talking up the game and saying things like the game is poised to do, is going to do etc through its changes and improvements.

I really thought people wouldnt need that explaining to them.

I don't expect the president to do anything, as has been shown by various holders of the role, they are free to do and say what they want, and may know nothing about Rugby League, may use the role to prioritise something they are bringing from their past outside the game to the role, or to shed light on an area of the game they are passionate about which may be a different priority to the leaders at the RFL.

No point acting indignant that people didn't get the content of your second comment from  the content of your first when you made two different points.

[Damien]

19 minutes ago, Hopie said:

I don't expect the president to do anything, as has been shown by various holders of the role, they are free to do and say what they want, and may know nothing about Rugby League, may use the role to prioritise something they are bringing from their past outside the game to the role, or to shed light on an area of the game they are passionate about which may be a different priority to the leaders at the RFL.

No point acting indignant that people didn't get the content of your second comment from  the content of your first when you made two different points.

What you expect is your prerogative. I do suspect your view would be very different if he was saying how wonderful the process is and talked up the direction the game is talking.

I didn't make two different points, don't try and pretend I did because you didn't understand and just wanted a moan about IMG.

[Damien]

2 hours ago, RP London said:

why would it be a lie?

"The sport aims to grow with this new plan building on firm foundations of good, strong clubs with a base in its traditional heartlands." would be a nice little statement and is neither a lie nor made up but paints everything positively rather than negative takes on it.. 

Yeah it's all pretty straightforward, unless you are being disingenuous because you've an axe to grind that is.

[Hopie]

20 minutes ago, Damien said:

What you expect is your prerogative. I do suspect your view would be very different if he was saying how wonderful the process is and talked up the direction the game is talking.

I didn't make two different points, don't try and pretend I did because you didn't understand and just wanted a moan about IMG.

I read both comments and understood them, maybe you could try reading them again?

That you are trying to put my comments down and projecting opinions onto me because I have critiicised aspects of the IMG grading criteria elsewhere shows who has the agenda here. 

[Damien]

1 minute ago, Hopie said:

I read both comments and understood them, maybe you could try reading them again?

That you are trying to put my comments down and projecting opinions onto me because I have critiicised aspects of the IMG grading criteria elsewhere shows who has the agenda here. 

So stop wittering on about people needing to make stuff up then.

[MattSantos]

There's been chat in here about clubs taking legal action and the merits / likelihood of that happening. 

Looking over the fence at football and it's PSRs in play, i do wonder, especially now that Leicester have pulled their pants down. A lot of reading on this today and a pertinent quote from the Athletic: "If there is a lesson here it is that rules made in haste, or without proper stress-testing, tend to be bad rules."

IMG 'appear' to have changed the language and the rules 'appear' to be organic rather than cast iron at this stage which could result in a very interesting off-season.

 

 

[gingerjon]

29 minutes ago, MattSantos said:

There's been chat in here about clubs taking legal action and the merits / likelihood of that happening. 

Looking over the fence at football and it's PSRs in play, i do wonder, especially now that Leicester have pulled their pants down. A lot of reading on this today and a pertinent quote from the Athletic: "If there is a lesson here it is that rules made in haste, or without proper stress-testing, tend to be bad rules."

IMG 'appear' to have changed the language and the rules 'appear' to be organic rather than cast iron at this stage which could result in a very interesting off-season.

 

 

Leicester did use an existing appeal mechanism that stayed, essentially, within the game. They may have had lawyers involved but it wasn't to take anyone to an outside court or process. It was independent arbitration within football.

[MattSantos]

15 hours ago, gingerjon said:

Leicester did use an existing appeal mechanism that stayed, essentially, within the game. They may have had lawyers involved but it wasn't to take anyone to an outside court or process. It was independent arbitration within football.

And do we trust that a robust appeals process as been established 'within the game'?

I don't.

[RP London]

15 hours ago, gingerjon said:

Leicester did use an existing appeal mechanism that stayed, essentially, within the game. They may have had lawyers involved but it wasn't to take anyone to an outside court or process. It was independent arbitration within football.

Was it not also about jurisdiction. they changed their accounting period (which is allowed) and when this changed happened it mean that it fell outside of their tenure as a premier league club.. therefore the premier league had no jurisdiction to punish them. The EFL could, if they wish, now go after them.

 

[gingerjon]

57 minutes ago, MattSantos said:

And do we trust that a robust appeals process as been established 'within the game'?

I don't.

It's set out in the agreed plan so who knows. It is there though.

[gingerjon]

47 minutes ago, RP London said:

Was it not also about jurisdiction. they changed their accounting period (which is allowed) and when this changed happened it mean that it fell outside of their tenure as a premier league club.. therefore the premier league had no jurisdiction to punish them. The EFL could, if they wish, now go after them.

 

Yes. It's a jurisdiction issue. No one appears to be disputing that Leicester broke the rules just that no one has the ability to charge them for it.

[MattSantos]

15 minutes ago, gingerjon said:

Yes. It's a jurisdiction issue. No one appears to be disputing that Leicester broke the rules just that no one has the ability to charge them for it.

Because of the language and holes in those rules.

IMG (and/or) the RFL have to be massively comfortable that they're watertight in their documentation. 

Alternatively, the clubs are so tinpot, they won't notice or be able to take advantage even if there were to be any holes.

[RP London]

47 minutes ago, MattSantos said:

Because of the language and holes in those rules.

IMG (and/or) the RFL have to be massively comfortable that they're watertight in their documentation. 

Alternatively, the clubs are so tinpot, they won't notice or be able to take advantage even if there were to be any holes.

the Leicester case is a poor example as that is about 2 different bodies running the leagues and who has jurisdiction to "prosecute"... a better example would be chelsea getting away with it because they amortised the transfer figures by the contract length which PSR hadnt taken into consideration.