Proposal put forward to cut SL to 10

[Angelic Cynic]

10 minutes ago, scotchy1 said:

Pretty much all SL players have come from the amateur game. It's a very small minority who were missed at academy level then made it to SL

   I didn't mean the natural progression route.I know that is where they progress through on the pathway,hitherto.

I meant in the future if there is just 2 leagues of 10 Super League clubs and the sport played at amateur level.

Or,will there be 2 x 10 SL and then a Championship League - any with or without reserve and Academies,and then the amateur level?

[owls]

I will be amazed if any tv company has much interest in a  SL2,

the 10 big boys in SL will demand and probably get even more out of the money pot,

 

[RayCee]

This idea is dead in the water and I'm glad it is. Twelve teams can get repetitive. The only thing holding back more teams is money. 

[Bleep1673]

22 minutes ago, owls said:

I will be amazed if any tv company has much interest in a  SL2,

the 10 big boys in SL will demand and probably get even more out of the money pot,

 

Sky will be, if only to stop another company from showing games, such as the Championship Deal

[Kris]

Low baller probably but I reckon 16 teams by the end of 2020

4 more - RL is quite ruthless, if TO and TWP want in they will have to bring something to the party as will the 2 other teams

There will be greater competition for players so the salary cap will have to go up or go all together

The 4 extra will all be from outside the UK if we listen to Lenighan  and he does 'lead' a cohort of SL teams that seem to back his ideas

No cost then to the game and they will come with money to the table to play

Question is then what about promotion/relegation?

I wouldn't pay to play in order to have the rights to develop my own market fully, without certainty of where I am playing and who I am playing

Which begs the question will the teams that have the cash to do so be the only ones to continue in SL anyway?

More cash I David Hughes back pocket than Carters, for instance, could be very interesting if we go that way, there will be a lot of blood spilt one way or another if we do

Means tested clubs - who brings value - and I would probably add develops the stars of the future - there will have to be some sort of criteria to stay in there or get in there as Toronto have suddenly seemingly fallen foul of.

Interesting times

 

[Man of Kent]

36 minutes ago, scotchy1 said:

But is it going to be worth £10m a year? anywhere close? What realistically are the TV companies going to be paying for? When would an SL 2 be played?

Currently, we are showing, on average, 2.5 games per week. Promoting Toulouse and Toronto can get that up to 3.5 per week (if we schedule it correctly) without adding the broadcast costs of filming more games. So we have SL Thursdays and Fridays nights, we have Toulouse/Les Catalans Saturday evening, Toronto Saturday night. what slot does it fill? Sunday up against Super Sunday? not likely. Sunday evenings? Monday/Tuesday/Wednesday? possibly but are those times going to be popular with those who attend?  Saturday afternoons up against football? possibly, it would give a run straight through from NRL/Super Rugby through to Toronto on a Saturday night. But its up against live football, Soccer saturday and the busiest sporting time in the country.

And then we are left with the question of if the slot is popular with the Broadcasters and acceptable to fans, why are we then selling a game or two of SL2 when we would have between 1.5 and 2.5 games in SL1 that need selling.

Thursday night SL1, Friday night SL1, Saturday afternoon SL2, Saturday evening SL1, Sunday afternoon SL2 x2. 

Wouldn’t all be on Sky. I would want one live SL2 game a week on free to air. 

[Lounge Room Lizard]

As per usual its only a plan for a select few and not everybody. No real thought on what this hopes to achieve or how it benefit the game as a whole. Who decide which Clubs are in SL 1 and 2? How long do we have this system until we change again? What happens to any potential New sides that have millions? What happen say if a club like Salford go bankrupt? Any Minimum standards on SL1 or 2?

Before any changes are made all possible questions/possibilities should be note and looked at. We need changes that benefit the game not just a few selfish clubs.

[themainbrace]

For me a 10 team league is a non-starter.  First, it's boring.  Too many repeated games against the same old teams.  Second, a top tier of just 10 teams suggests that the sport is only just able to throw up a competition.

 I don't know why there is this drive to cut back, each new TV contract we get brings in more money than ever before, each time the clubs get more money at each level.

 

[Tom Moore]

If, as the previous calculations would suggest, we are looking at 20 teams and £30m, why not £1.5m per team rather than £2m and £1m? 

More chance then of two sets of competitive teams, rather the Rugby Union model in England, where a team gets promoted, gets royally fisted for a season and goes down again.

[Man of Kent]

46 minutes ago, Tom Moore said:

If, as the previous calculations would suggest, we are looking at 20 teams and £30m, why not £1.5m per team rather than £2m and £1m? 

More chance then of two sets of competitive teams, rather the Rugby Union model in England, where a team gets promoted, gets royally fisted for a season and goes down again.

Seems unlikely because the top clubs would get less than now.  You’d expect the top tier to get the most anyway 

[eal]

The 10-team SL proposal only works if 20 full-time teams can be fielded, with SL2 also being marketed. I don't see this as feasible, and football is the only sport where a lower division would ever be deemed worthwhile to the tv networks. I think a 16-team SL is the way to go with a one-off P/R match at the end of the season.

[Tom Moore]

7 hours ago, scotchy1 said:

Is any broadcaster likely to value the second tier of any sport as valuable as the first? or are we expecting SL 1 to subsidise SL2?

Because if we are it then begs the question that if SL1 are prepared to, and able to put that product out for 15m a year, why would a a broadcaster pay 30m a year for it so it can then give money to a competition it doesnt really want (sl2)

there is then the question of why bother with promotion and relegation if it doesnt really matter. The million pound match suddenly becomes the nothing much really match. Where is the jeopardy?

If the funding is the same why not just for 2 conferences of 10 instead of 2 divisions?

To be honest, I think two conferences would be better.

[The Parksider]

On 19/02/2018 at 1:23 PM, paulwalker71 said:

I do wonder if people bother to read the source before commenting. Many of the points raised are covered in the article! Well, to save everyone the hassle, here goes

I know exactly what you mean Sir, many thanks for setting out the article.

The opening pages went straight into a 20 pro-club Superleague, and onto Conferences as playing at structures (without taking into account playing strength and finance) is a sport itself on here. As the thread has settled down more thoughtful posts have come in as regards how do we run a successful 14 club league, when only a few months ago SL clubs dismissed this as impossible?

Then how do we run 2 tens and actually relegate 2 clubs when all along clubs have agreed how damaging relegation is? We are set to drop a fifth of the top league every year. using "parachute" payments to limit the damage (how well is that going at Leigh?). New York have not even been passed yet and there they are in the structure.

It's impossible to sensibly comment on suggested structures when the details of the plan are sketchy, the details of the finance and financier are non existent (whoever provides the money next contract will call the tune) and even the clubs who said we could not go to 14 a few months ago are reported to be erm....... going to 14!

OK, this could easily just be what's being leaked from SL chairmen "brainstorming" sessions, if you can't get out of the box you are in then at least try to think outside the box and fair enough. I pose two questions  above about 14 clubs in the top league, and relegating a fifth of your top league every year, no need for any glib answers here thanks, because at the end of the day in business there are many issues and problems you cannot solve with the wave of the hand. There are many difficulties to be accepted, and often just trying to survive and accepting it if you do not, ends up being the plan.

In this case what's being mulled about is neither here nor there. Who is actually going to give us our next TV contract, for how much, and what do they want out of it is the real question we need answers to. 

[Dave T]

1 hour ago, The Parksider said:

I know exactly what you mean Sir, many thanks for setting out the article.

The opening pages went straight into a 20 pro-club Superleague, and onto Conferences as playing at structures (without taking into account playing strength and finance) is a sport itself on here. As the thread has settled down more thoughtful posts have come in as regards how do we run a successful 14 club league, when only a few months ago SL clubs dismissed this as impossible? 

Odd that you find this the sensible discussion on a thread about a 10 team SL, but are critical of the 2 x 10 discussion which was exactly what the thread was about.

 

Maybe it is indeed you who needs to sort out your reading skills.

[Big Picture]

SALFORD RED DEVILS AUDITOR ‘CASTS DOUBT’ ABOUT ‘COMPANY’S ABILITY TO CONTINUE’ might be one of the reasons behind the idea of cutting back further.

[Havenwarrior]

If you are a SL supporter you are probably happy, if you are a League 1 supporter you are worried. It seems the top are wanting to all over the lower clubs and keep all the money proably.

 

http://www.totalrl.com/possible-de-regulation-league-1-agenda-clubs-meeting-week/

 

The rich get richer, and who gives a care about the rest.

 

HW

[Scubby]

Do Batley still give away fun packs of Fox's biscuits at the ground? If they do, on that basis, I am happy to award them a franchise given all the #### that is currently floating around. Let's stick to what is important. RL gives Italian politics a run for its money.

[Derwent]

21 hours ago, newbe said:

Talking to a match commissioner last Sunday he said they are finished in league 1 in a month, and not needing to having charted physios now, it looks like the league being slowly being deregulated. Worrying signs,  recond it looks like amateur days for a lot of teams after they have sorted S/L in what ever format they decide. 

Yes there will be no match commissioners at L1 games as from next weekend, a cost cutting measure by the RFL. More worrying is the RFL's proposal that a qualified doctor will no longer be required to be at the ground for L1 fixtures.

[Scubby]

6 minutes ago, Derwent said:

Yes there will be no match commissioners at L1 games as from next weekend, a cost cutting measure by the RFL. More worrying is the RFL's proposal that a qualified doctor will no longer be required to be at the ground for L1 fixtures.

I'm sure they would be putting this money they potentially save aside to defend head injury litigations that may arise in future (or tragedies like Danny Jones)  

[Derwent]

1 minute ago, Scubby said:

I'm sure they would be putting this money they potentially save aside to defend head injury litigations that may arise in future (or tragedies like Danny Jones)  

We can only assume that Ralph was off when they did the "duty of care" course.

[Guest]

On 20/02/2018 at 8:23 AM, Bob8 said:

Which rather ignores that Super League is a TV product for Sky TV.

It ignores the fact that clubs require that income to survive.Some 20 years of a downward spiral should have alerted them,Sky had ran its course. I've said it before,leave SL to SL. Let the rest fend for themselves,they will make more money and have better unrestricted opportunities.

[Bob8]

6 minutes ago, SL17 said:

It ignores the fact that clubs require that income to survive.Some 20 years of a downward spiral should have alerted them,Sky had ran its course. I've said it before,leave SL to SL. Let the rest fend for themselves,they will make more money and have better unrestricted opportunities.

I think you have a good point, in that things move on and we have a deal and arrangement based on the 1990's rather than the 2010's. 

Media is far more international now.  We should be too.

[Mattrhino]

I like to indulge myself in conversation and fantasy on this board. But even I have to say a SL 1 & 2 is ridiculous.

The words polish and ###### spring to mind or pig and lipstick

[Guest]

33 minutes ago, Bob8 said:

I think you have a good point, in that things move on and we have a deal and arrangement based on the 1990's rather than the 2010's. 

Media is far more international now.  We should be too.

Yes Bob,and for that reason the proposals should accommodate accordingly.

[Angelic Cynic]

1 hour ago, Derwent said:

Yes there will be no match commissioners at L1 games as from next weekend, a cost cutting measure by the RFL. More worrying is the RFL's proposal that a qualified doctor will no longer be required to be at the ground for L1 fixtures.

  I am aghast at this.Just as I was when I learned only Super League players were given heart screening

 http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-league/32600605

Just as I was when this was the situation - https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2009/jun/18/rugby-league-heart-scans-scuppered

Just as I was when this was required - https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/rugby-league/super-league-stars-call-for-for-water-859163

To read about cost-cutting,to learn about how the rich want to get richer,following on from the Woods payout speculation,and the scant regard given to the semi-professional players is wholly,utterly and completely depressing.

Bizarre way to grow the sport.