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Well... after 66 days in ICU my sister's fella who was described as being as near to death as can be without dying.... has made it. He's home. Half the fella he was.... and the virus has ravaged his l

I'm not putting up with this goading of a volunteer moderator who does a sterling job on my behalf generally on here, but especially recently when I was ill for almost a month with what might well hav

Well my sister's fella is making very small steps in the right direction. From being described as as near to death without being dead, he's now sat up, off dialysis and yesterday was breathing on

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1 minute ago, Saintslass said:

You see the word 'apparently'?  It refers to the media.  I wasn't claiming anyone wants to leave.  I was claiming 'apparently' everyone wants to leave, because that is what the stupid media is now saying.

You are being deliberately obtuse to create an argument where it does not exist.

Oh, and how is your last sentence NOT political by the way?

Where is gingerjon?

Because it's not, it's not even remotely political.

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4 minutes ago, Saintslass said:

Where is gingerjon?

Hastings. It's lovely. I'm in the garden.

Why do you ask?

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Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. (Terry Pratchett)

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3 minutes ago, Saintslass said:

You see the word 'apparently'?  It refers to the media.  I wasn't claiming anyone wants to leave.  I was claiming 'apparently' everyone wants to leave, because that is what the stupid media is now saying.

You are being deliberately obtuse to create an argument where it does not exist.

Oh, and how is your last sentence NOT political by the way?

Where is gingerjon?

Alison Pearson and Katie Hopkins are journos. Where is the politics in that? 

And I am not being obtuse, the media are not making these claims. One paper today leads with this - The Sunday Times has a headline about Tory Grandees wanting an end to lockdown. Can you provide evidence of the media telling us that everyone wants an end to lockdown? That's what you claimed, you should be able to support that claim. And I'm not saying you are definitely wrong, I just haven't witnessed it. 

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Just now, Dave T said:

That 'evidence' is nothing of the sort. 

It is not direct evidence, or even true. But, people do trust the press as long as it is on their side.

"You clearly have never met Bob8 then, he's like a veritable Bryan Ferry of RL." - Johnoco 19 Jul 2014

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6 minutes ago, Bob8 said:

The Telegraph, as you mentioned.

Sorry to do this but I'm going to be a bit pedantic. But the claim was that the media are stating that everyone wants an end to lockdown. No evidence has been presented. 

Allison Pearson tweeting about two friends being furious about lockdown does not equate to the claim above. 

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1 minute ago, Bob8 said:

It is not direct evidence, or even true. But, people do trust the press as long as it is on their side.

Tbh, I don't think SLs claim is true, but by asking for the evidence I am happy to be educated on this. 

What I see happening is the media asking about the end of lockdown and how that will work. That is very different to stating that everyone wants lockdown to end. But that is how it is being spun to discredit any awkward questions. 

 

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4 minutes ago, Dave T said:

Sorry to do this but I'm going to be a bit pedantic. But the claim was that the media are stating that everyone wants an end to lockdown. No evidence has been presented. 

Allison Pearson tweeting about two friends being furious about lockdown does not equate to the claim above. 

...and you do have me. I confess to a memory of the Telegraph giving the impression that the people were crying out under the yoke. But, I am not certain and have no links to hand.

PS: I also agree it is not true, but I was sympathetic as it was reported in the Telegraph and most people believe what they read in newspapers that they identify with, regardless of their own experience (such is my impression).

Edited by Bob8
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"You clearly have never met Bob8 then, he's like a veritable Bryan Ferry of RL." - Johnoco 19 Jul 2014

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I've said before but the media over the last couple of weeks, with regards lockdown, does not reflect public opinion. There seems to be other agendas at play.  I know barely anyone that wants the lockdown to end and any poll I have seen supports that view too.

Edited by Damien
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1 minute ago, Damien said:

I've said before but the media over the last couple of weeks with regards lockdown does not reflect public opinion. There seems to be other agendas at play.  I know barely anyone that wants the lockdown to end and any poll I have seen supports that view too.

Indeed, I do remember some polling on this:

https://www7.politicalbetting.com/index.php/archives/2020/04/24/yougov-finds-little-evidence-of-people-wanting-to-ease-the-lockdown/

 

"You clearly have never met Bob8 then, he's like a veritable Bryan Ferry of RL." - Johnoco 19 Jul 2014

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2 hours ago, Chrispmartha said:

From what I can gather they've had hardly any restrictions already, I’m quite shocked Australias figures are so low to be honest!

No, the rest of the country is still in lockdown. Our version of this is minimum gathering of 2 people at a time, state borders are closed, only leave the house for exercise and essential outings like groceries etc, most businesses and all hospitality venues closed.

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3 minutes ago, Dave T said:

Tbh, I don't think SLs claim is true, but by asking for the evidence I am happy to be educated on this. 

What I see happening is the media asking about the end of lockdown and how that will work. That is very different to stating that everyone wants lockdown to end. But that is how it is being spun to discredit any awkward questions. 

 

What I see happening is the media asking about the end of lockdown and how that will work.

Yes, they are indeed asking that, time after time, despite being told time after time that it is too early to be able to say, as any easing of lockdown has to be based on a whole range of factors, trends  etc.  Things have come to something when the WHO say on TV that the UK is doing a great job but our media are hunting high and low to find bad news stories.

All reporters such as Kuenssberg are after is a statement that can be used later to trip up the govt. ( Not ALL as bad as her - never thought I'd see the day when I'd say Victoria Derbyshire was shining example of neutrality and independence) The evidence is there for all to see. The whole media tone is one of destructive negativity: a minister announces an intention, an objective, a target and the  media then present it as a promise or a commitment. Grant Shapps stated on TV for all to hear that  "all Brits on cruise ships had now been repatriated" As he was saying this, the BBC ticker said " Govt says all British holidaymakers have been repatriated". Not the same thing at all. Next up, we'll see a reporter saying, "Minister,  yesterday you promised....."  The tone of BBC News is to paint the situation badly: eg PPE. To judge by their reporters, no one has any PPE.  I spoke yesterday to the husband of a senior District Nurse in Lincolnshire, someone who does not share my politics who said that they have to change their PPE after each visit, "full" PPE" and there is absolutely no shortage.  

But that is how it is being spun to discredit any awkward questions

Well, yes, they do ask some searching questions: "Minister, will you apologise to the front line, nurses, doctors, NHS, anybody, everybody yada yada yada..for something or other...."  then follow up on the news or in print "Minister refuses to apologise...."  This is just wasting a valuable time. They would be much better off asking "why was our lockdown not as severe and not as rigorously enforced as those in France, Italy, Spain...."  or "What can we learn from the new lockdown in a Chinse city of 10 million people  to prevent the spread of coronavirus following a surge in cases." 

I've asked around my mates around the country, and not all of them by far share my political views. However, apart from one guy , all of them are fed up with the media's constant denigration of the UKs performance.

We do need an adult conversation about all this,. Pity there are not that many adults in the media. 

 

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, Bob8 said:

It is not direct evidence, or even true. But, people do trust the press as long as it is on their side.

This is it in a nutshell and we see plenty of evidence of it on here. The constant criticism of the media by a few on here is tiresome. This is especially so when they simultaneously seek out, trust and quote from the media that supports their viewpoint, all without a hint of hypocrisy.

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27 minutes ago, JohnM said:

What I see happening is the media asking about the end of lockdown and how that will work.

Yes, they are indeed asking that, time after time, despite being told time after time that it is too early to be able to say, as any easing of lockdown has to be based on a whole range of factors, trends  etc.  Things have come to something when the WHO say on TV that the UK is doing a great job but our media are hunting high and low to find bad news stories.

All reporters such as Kuenssberg are after is a statement that can be used later to trip up the govt. ( Not ALL as bad as her - never thought I'd see the day when I'd say Victoria Derbyshire was shining example of neutrality and independence) The evidence is there for all to see. The whole media tone is one of destructive negativity: a minister announces an intention, an objective, a target and the  media then present it as a promise or a commitment. Grant Shapps stated on TV for all to hear that  "all Brits on cruise ships had now been repatriated" As he was saying this, the BBC ticker said " Govt says all British holidaymakers have been repatriated". Not the same thing at all. Next up, we'll see a reporter saying, "Minister,  yesterday you promised....."  The tone of BBC News is to paint the situation badly: eg PPE. To judge by their reporters, no one has any PPE.  I spoke yesterday to the husband of a senior District Nurse in Lincolnshire, someone who does not share my politics who said that they have to change their PPE after each visit, "full" PPE" and there is absolutely no shortage.  

But that is how it is being spun to discredit any awkward questions

Well, yes, they do ask some searching questions: "Minister, will you apologise to the front line, nurses, doctors, NHS, anybody, everybody yada yada yada..for something or other...."  then follow up on the news or in print "Minister refuses to apologise...."  This is just wasting a valuable time. They would be much better off asking "why was our lockdown not as severe and not as rigorously enforced as those in France, Italy, Spain...."  or "What can we learn from the new lockdown in a Chinse city of 10 million people  to prevent the spread of coronavirus following a surge in cases." 

I've asked around my mates around the country, and not all of them by far share my political views. However, apart from one guy , all of them are fed up with the media's constant denigration of the UKs performance.

We do need an adult conversation about all this,. Pity there are not that many adults in the media. 

 

 

 

 

The media aren't giving the impression that there is no PPE at all. They regularly report that PPE has been delivered, and they were even quoting last week how many days left of each item etc. Certainly not giving any impression that there is no PPE. They are saying there are shortages, which the government has confirmed is true. 

But, tbh, none of that relates to my post. The media are not great overall, but it seems odd to me that they are the talking point here. My point was challenging the point that the media are presenting the view that everyone wants lockdown to end. No evidence has been presented to back up that allegation. 

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2 hours ago, Damien said:

I've said before but the media over the last couple of weeks, with regards lockdown, does not reflect public opinion. There seems to be other agendas at play.  I know barely anyone that wants the lockdown to end and any poll I have seen supports that view too.

Quite enjoying the ‘lockdown’ to be honest.  Spending quality time at home with the family. The pace of life is significantly better and simpler. 

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The exercise  v no sunbathing on a beach rule doesn't count in St Leonard's. Just been for my daily walk, and there were about 30 people sunbathing. I dont count the weekly sea bathing club because they are in the sea whatever the temperature. Plod are not policing Hastings & St. Leonard's  because they are all in Brighton.

Where were you last Thursday?

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13 minutes ago, GeordieSaint said:

Quite enjoying the ‘lockdown’ to be honest.  Spending quality time at home with the family. The pace of life is significantly better and simpler. 

Exactly the same here. I posted on the fitness thread the other day about the positive effect that it has had and completely agree with what you say.

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15 minutes ago, Bleep1673 said:

The exercise  v no sunbathing on a beach rule doesn't count in St Leonard's. Just been for my daily walk, and there were about 30 people sunbathing. I dont count the weekly sea bathing club because they are in the sea whatever the temperature. Plod are not policing Hastings & St. Leonard's  because they are all in Brighton.

It didn't seem so busy when I was on the prom (heading towards Pelham) yesterday but it's always been notable that at the St Leonards end where the beach isn't visible from the road that people hang round there. Not in huge numbers but some.

The police are around. They were busy pointing at people in Alexanrda Park last week and I see from groups on Facebook that they have been stopping people who are driving on the roads outside Hastings.

Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. (Terry Pratchett)

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55 minutes ago, gingerjon said:

It didn't seem so busy when I was on the prom (heading towards Pelham) yesterday but it's always been notable that at the St Leonards end where the beach isn't visible from the road that people hang round there. Not in huge numbers but some.

The police are around. They were busy pointing at people in Alexanrda Park last week and I see from groups on Facebook that they have been stopping people who are driving on the roads outside Hastings.

One aspect of pubs being closed is that open areas are artificially busier.

"You clearly have never met Bob8 then, he's like a veritable Bryan Ferry of RL." - Johnoco 19 Jul 2014

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Latest breakdown of England's hospital figures show a more even spread around the country but Yorkshire appears to be rising (whereas at last in the North West the figures appear to be dropping).  However, caveat of this being a Sunday needs to be borne in mind (even so, it's the lowest number recorded in a month or thereabouts, even for a Sunday):

Deaths in English hospitals increase by 336 - the lowest rise in April

NHS England has announced that 336 people have died from coronavirus, taking England’s total to 18,420.

This is the lowest daily rise announced by the NHS England since the end of March. Lower figures tend to be announced on Sundays when there are fewer staff to verify the numbers.

The victims were aged between 28 and 100 years old. Only 22 of the victims had no known underlying health condition.

At the start of the outbreak, deaths were concentrated in London. Now the deaths are more evenly spread across England. The NHS gave this breakdown:

  • East of England 49
  • London 64
  • Midlands 57
  • North East & Yorkshire 66
  • North West 46
  • South East 43
  • South West 11
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1 hour ago, GeordieSaint said:

Quite enjoying the ‘lockdown’ to be honest.  Spending quality time at home with the family. The pace of life is significantly better and simpler. 

I think a positive of this is lots of people/companies will realise they can do most of their work from home. That plus despite some moaning lots of people are actually enjoying the slower pace of life and extra free time  

 

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