Are you sure England is better then Samoa?

[Davo5]

4 minutes ago, Mr Frisky said:

Think that's a given but I still think the Saints team of the past 2 years would have ran the NRL champs close if the WCC was played.

England arnt far away - 2017 final was very close and Australia arnt the team they were - can't currently beat Tonga - who England have never lost to.

Unlike the WCC the World Cup isnt played before one side has played a competitive game.

2017 is 5 yrs ago and isn’t relevant to this years World Cup and given the Aussies haven’t played for 3 yrs it’s pretty difficult to judge how good they are or say they can’t currently beat Tonga.

[Mr Frisky]

1 minute ago, Davo5 said:

Unlike the WCC the World Cup isnt played before one side has played a competitive game.

2017 is 5 yrs ago and isn’t relevant to this years World Cup and given the Aussies haven’t played for 3 yrs it’s pretty difficult to judge how good they are or say they can’t currently beat Tonga.

Maybe time for a WC to see then?

[Dunbar]

28 minutes ago, Mr Frisky said:

Think that's a given but I still think the Saints team of the past 2 years would have ran the NRL champs close if the WCC was played.

England arnt far away - 2017 final was very close and Australia arnt the team they were - can't currently beat Tonga - who England have never lost to.

It's a pity that we will never know how those World Club matches would have turned out.

I am a massive fan of Saints but I have to say I think they would have beaten by the NRL champs and probably quite heavily.

It is my view that the England national team are a fair bit closer to the Kangaroos than the Super League teams are to the NRL.

[Mr Frisky]

4 minutes ago, Dunbar said:

It's a pity that we will never know how those World Club matches would have turned out.

I am a massive fan of Saints but I have to say I think they would have beaten by the NRL champs and probably quite heavily.

It is my view that the England national team are a fair bit closer to the Kangaroos than the Super League teams are to the NRL.

Overall yes I agree most current SL teams would get hammered- but this Saints team is as good a SL team as we have seen for a good 10 to 15 years - even the SL teams that won the WCC.

Shame is this squad will mostly break up at the end of this season.

[Chris22]

I'd suggest a Woolf-coached Saints would have a far better shot at winning a World Club Challenge than a Holbrook-coaches Saints. Woolf has out defence very well drilled. We could see that even in his early days, which is probably why pushed Sydney close despite several key players out.

I'd say we would have given Penrith or Melbourn a decent match but lost in recent years. Obviously, if we played them on a more level playing field (i.e. not a pre season warm up for the NRL side), then it would have been a different story.

[Young Blood]

3 hours ago, Mr Frisky said:

Think that's a given but I still think the Saints team of the past 2 years would have ran the NRL champs close if the WCC was played.

England arnt far away - 2017 final was very close and Australia arnt the team they were - can't currently beat Tonga - who England have never lost to.

Well Tonga beat Great Britain which is essentially England and a few Scottish players. 

[FearTheVee]

To answer the original poster’s question - yes I’m sure.

[Damien]

12 hours ago, Dunbar said:

It's a pity that we will never know how those World Club matches would have turned out.

I am a massive fan of Saints but I have to say I think they would have beaten by the NRL champs and probably quite heavily.

It is my view that the England national team are a fair bit closer to the Kangaroos than the Super League teams are to the NRL.

I think this is fair. Ultimately a national team can only play 17 players and England do have a number of quality players. Across a competition that is severely diluted and then you have injuries and a lack of strength in depth in SL on top of that. The NRL has on the whole better players in much greater numbers, you simply dont get that drop in standard in the same way. I think the gap between an average NRL team and a top international team is much less than there would be between an average SL team and a top international team.

[17 stone giant]

Yes, England are better than Samoa. And we'll prove it at the World Cup. I base this on very limited knowledge of the strengths of the two teams, and optimism. I want to reach a World Cup final and win this time. It's only fair after 92, 95 and 2017.

[Eddie]

On 02/07/2022 at 08:08, Just Browny said:

Yes. Apart from when that uncertainty comes from a team having played about three games in five years.

And who is going to play for who, just a few months before a tournament. 

[AB90]

Fox Sports article released today confirming that Jerome Luai will pledge his allegiance to Samoa.

Also reports that Josh Papali will also go with Samoa as well.

That opening game is going to be great for the World Cup.

[hunsletgreenandgold]

3 minutes ago, AB90 said:

Fox Sports article released today confirming that Jerome Luai will pledge his allegiance to Samoa.

Also reports that Josh Papali will also go with Samoa as well.

That opening game is going to be great for the World Cup.

If Luai does then the strong rumours about To'o and Crichton are probably bang on as well. I'd not heard about big Josh but if that also comes off England have a lot to be worried about in those 4 players alone! 

[FearTheVee]

1 hour ago, hunsletgreenandgold said:

If Luai does then the strong rumours about To'o and Crichton are probably bang on as well. I'd not heard about big Josh but if that also comes off England have a lot to be worried about in those 4 players alone! 

Samoa have plenty to worry about too, we'll be fine.

[hunsletgreenandgold]

2 minutes ago, FearTheVee said:

Samoa have plenty to worry about too, we'll be fine.

Agreed - but historically we've not really looked much further than Aus/NZ and more recently Tonga in terms of actually believing we could be beaten. I'm not suggesting we wouldn't have taken Samoa seriously without these players but it certainly changes the level i'd now be regarding Samoa at with these kind of players in the team. I've no doubt England still win. 

[Davo5]

1 hour ago, hunsletgreenandgold said:

If Luai does then the strong rumours about To'o and Crichton are probably bang on as well. I'd not heard about big Josh but if that also comes off England have a lot to be worried about in those 4 players alone! 

Crichton looked out of his depth in Origin & even To’o hasn’t looked the same player this year.

[hunsletgreenandgold]

23 minutes ago, Davo5 said:

Crichton looked out of his depth in Origin & even To’o hasn’t looked the same player this year.

Fair - but again i'd draw on comparisons to how the Tongan boys come together and perform out of their skin once they put on that red jersey. 

[Dunbar]

We could always tell the Samoan players that the England game is the 'Pride tie of the round' and get a walkover. 

In fact, that could be our route to the final!

Edited July 27, 2022 by Dunbar

[DavidM]

2 hours ago, Davo5 said:

Crichton looked out of his depth in Origin

I was surprised Wighton didn’t come back in for him . He was skinned by Ponga and didn’t look to impressive imo whereas Wighton was a standout in Origin 1 for the Blues . Tbh I don’t think Crichton and Burton was a stellar centre combination , nor Staggs 

[DavidM]

I’m sure Australia will be hoping Turbo gets fit and Mitchell doesn’t get banned and with Holmes that’s better

[Dallas Mead]

6 hours ago, hunsletgreenandgold said:

If Luai does then the strong rumours about To'o and Crichton are probably bang on as well. I'd not heard about big Josh but if that also comes off England have a lot to be worried about in those 4 players alone! 

Crikey, tough opener for England that like

[DavidM]

England will beat Samoa

[WN83]

I’m happy that Samoa will be strong. It will make it a tougher game potentially but I do think it helps guard against complacency from England. If we turned up playing a side not looking quite as strong on paper, we could’ve been lax and got ourselves in to trouble and we’ve been known to panic. If these names all line up for Samoa, there’s no way the England lads can look at that team and think it’ll be easy. It should be a big test and that’s fine by me. We need to see where we’re at early doors and could take huge confidence from a victory. 

[Dave T]

10 minutes ago, WN83 said:

I’m happy that Samoa will be strong. It will make it a tougher game potentially but I do think it helps guard against complacency from England. If we turned up playing a side not looking quite as strong on paper, we could’ve been lax and got ourselves in to trouble and we’ve been known to panic. If these names all line up for Samoa, there’s no way the England lads can look at that team and think it’ll be easy. It should be a big test and that’s fine by me. We need to see where we’re at early doors and could take huge confidence from a victory. 

We need to remember what happened to New Zealand at home in the last WC. They were embarrassed by Tonga, and then Fiji and didn't make the semis. 

We need to be focused, professional and start the tournament well. 

A strong win in a tough game with 50k fans in there could really set the tournament up nicely. 

[Mojo]

On 28/07/2022 at 01:50, Davo5 said:

Crichton looked out of his depth in Origin & even To’o hasn’t looked the same player this year.

Crichton yes To'o not so much. He wasn't scoring his flashy tries like he did last origin but he ran the 2nd most meters behind Tedesco, had the 2nd most tackle breaks, one short behind Tedesco, 2nd most line breaks, and ran the most post contact meters throughout the whole series. Trust me he's still the same player

[Mr Frisky]

England were told by the Aussie commentators in the 2017 friendly that they would struggle as Samoa had about 15 NRL players and England only had about 4.... 80 minutes later and a very professional performance from England, showed they don't take teams for granted, as they swep Samoa to one side- NRL superstars and all.

Organisation is the key - as well as very good players and England have both.

Edited July 28, 2022 by Mr Frisky