Football

[Stirlin]

Kick about.

Chelsea v Leeds: Fouls galore in 1970 FA Cup final at Old Trafford - BBC Sport

[gingerjon]

I don't have an opinion on whether this is true. But it is impressive.

 

[Copa]

On 29/02/2024 at 21:13, gingerjon said:

I don't have an opinion on whether this is true. But it is impressive.

 

Sam Kerr, who is a massive… MASSIVE … soccer sporting hero in the eyes of huge numbers of young Australian girls, and many sports fans in general, has been charged with racially motivated harassment of a police officer in the UK. Football Australia didn’t find out about it until they read it in the media as she’d kept it secret for a long time.

She comes from a notorious family in Australia that has some dodgy history so I hope, for her sake, she isn’t following in her family’s footsteps. Her brother : https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Kerr

[gingerjon]

7 hours ago, Copa said:

Sam Kerr, who is a massive… MASSIVE … soccer sporting hero in the eyes of huge numbers of young Australian girls, and many sports fans in general, has been charged with racially motivated harassment of a police officer in the UK. Football Australia didn’t find out about it until they read it in the media as she’d kept it secret for a long time.

She comes from a notorious family in Australia that has some dodgy history so I hope, for her sake, she isn’t following in her family’s footsteps. Her brother : https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Kerr

There has been a lot of gasping but a moneyed up footballer being offensive because of an issue with a taxi also has a long tradition over here. Unfortunately, it will now be unresolved for at least a year because of the now-standard delays with the UK court system.

[gingerjon]

13 hours ago, Copa said:

Sam Kerr, who is a massive… MASSIVE … soccer sporting hero in the eyes of huge numbers of young Australian girls, and many sports fans in general, has been charged with racially motivated harassment of a police officer in the UK. Football Australia didn’t find out about it until they read it in the media as she’d kept it secret for a long time.

She comes from a notorious family in Australia that has some dodgy history so I hope, for her sake, she isn’t following in her family’s footsteps. Her brother : https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Kerr

I admit that my women's/Australian soccer echo chamber is not necessarily indicative but this appears to have made Kerr's stock rise even higher:

[Copa]

19 hours ago, gingerjon said:

I admit that my women's/Australian soccer echo chamber is not necessarily indicative but this appears to have made Kerr's stock rise even higher:

She’s showing her Western Australian roots. Western Australia makes Queensland look like a case study in racial harmony.

In some parts of Australia many people can be very “casual” with their language and are remarkably naive regarding how that can be viewed in other countries.

Edited March 7 by Copa

[graveyard johnny]

11 hours ago, Copa said:

She’s showing her Western Australian roots. Western Australia makes Queensland look like a case study in racial harmony.

In some parts of Australia many people can be very “casual” with their language and are remarkably naive regarding how that can be viewed in other countries.

western aus 

https://www.realestate.com.au/property/3-bernard-manning-dr-duncraig-wa-6023/

[Josef K]

What has gone on at York City, they are a team i didn’t expect to be battling for their lives in the National League. It is so tight at the bottom anyone up to Dag & Red in 13th could still go down. 

[HawkMan]

12 minutes ago, Josef K said:

What has gone on at York City, they are a team i didn’t expect to be battling for their lives in the National League. It is so tight at the bottom anyone up to Dag & Red in 13th could still go down. 

Well I didn't expect to see another Vinnie Jones  squeezing Gazza testicles moment,  but It happened tonight in Atletico Madrid / Inter Milan game. Hilarious! 

[GeordieSaint]

England under Southgate are utterly dull… 

[Sidi Fidi Gold]

36 minutes ago, GeordieSaint said:

England under Southgate are utterly dull… 

You obviously haven't seen them under Hodgson, Capello, McClaren, Erikson, Keegan, Taylor, Robson then.

[gingerjon]

2 hours ago, Sidi Fidi Gold said:

You obviously haven't seen them under Hodgson, Capello, McClaren, Erikson, Keegan, Taylor, Robson then.

International football friendlies are usually deathly anyway. People tend to forget that as well.

[Gerrumonside ref]

My overall feeling is Southgate has done well by creating a nucleus of a team and staying loyal to them whatever their club form.

I think once we lost Walker there was always a danger the defence might get exposed at the back by pace and it did eventually (even by a non vintage Brazil side).

I still think we lack a scheming playmaker who can open things up with a cute pass when tournament football slows in tempo in the last week.

England have got a group they should win and will probably beat all the teams that they should beat on paper before falling to the first major footballing nation they play in Germany.

Edited March 24 by Gerrumonside ref

[GeordieSaint]

I find Southgate stubborn and inflexible. He continues to pick the likes of McGuire and Henderson for example. He won’t play TAA when he’s at RB. He persisted with the Yorkshire Pirlo despite him not playing at all at Man City. Not convinced by his tactics either… we are dull despite having some top quality talent. 

[gingerjon]

7 hours ago, Gerrumonside ref said:

My overall feeling is Southgate has done well by creating a nucleus of a team and staying loyal to them whatever their club form.

I think once we lost Walker there was always a danger the defence might get exposed at the back by pace and it did eventually (even by a non vintage Brazil side).

I still think we lack a scheming playmaker who can open things up with a cute pass when tournament football slows in tempo in the last week.

England have got a group they should win and will probably beat all the teams that they should beat on paper before falling to the first major footballing nation they play in Germany.

Southgate's credits pretty much outweigh those of any England manager except Alf Ramsay. He has consistently got results out of his players ahead of those achieved by any other England manager.

The annoying part is that it still feels like England fall short.

But, the more annoying part, is all those failures before Southgate and those which will occur after him.

[Route66]

Watched the game hoping to see Cumbrian lad Jarred Branthwaite make his debut , unfortunately even when McGuire was replaced we managed to bring on the aging Lewis Dunk. Will try again Tuesday but not hopeful 

[The Hallucinating Goose]

You've gotta love just how random some international friendlies are. Some examples from today include, 

Central African Republic v PNG

Guinea v Bermuda

Bolivia v Andorra

Games like these just show the astronomical depth of international football. 

[ivans82]

At one time not so long ago England had a decent 11 , a few ready to step in and a few young players coming through the system . At the moment Southgate has a few world class players and a lot of talented players . Problem is He is far to loyal to players past their best and has no idea what is best Team is . So many players play the same way and do the same job , He just can`t find a balance .Certainly missed Kanes all round game the other night.

[wilsontown]

On 13/03/2024 at 22:16, Josef K said:

What has gone on at York City

Oh God, how long have you got?

I guess the short version of this season is that we started with an enthusiastic amateur as manager and got terrible results, hired a former Sheffield Wednesday goalkeeper as head of recruitment, recruited an absolute set of misfits with no coherent idea of how they were supposed to play, and sacked the manager and hired another one with a completely different playing philosophy (twice).

The current manager was previously flying high with Worthing in the National League South, but clearly didn't know anything about any of our players or our league when he arrived. Hopefully he has been learning quickly as we won the last two, but it's going to be a scrap to stay up. All this with one of the biggest budgets in the division. Absolute object lesson in how not to run a football club, but we've been a basket case for years and this kind of #######how has long been coming.

Edited March 27 by wilsontown

[Josef K]

On 27/03/2024 at 13:07, wilsontown said:

Oh God, how long have you got?

I guess the short version of this season is that we started with an enthusiastic amateur as manager and got terrible results, hired a former Sheffield Wednesday goalkeeper as head of recruitment, recruited an absolute set of misfits with no coherent idea of how they were supposed to play, and sacked the manager and hired another one with a completely different playing philosophy (twice).

The current manager was previously flying high with Worthing in the National League South, but clearly didn't know anything about any of our players or our league when he arrived. Hopefully he has been learning quickly as we won the last two, but it's going to be a scrap to stay up. All this with one of the biggest budgets in the division. Absolute object lesson in how not to run a football club, but we've been a basket case for years and this kind of #######how has long been coming.

I think you are safe now wilson the likes of Oxford City have given it a good go but they just haven’t got the squad or the cash to stay up. 

[wilsontown]

1 minute ago, Josef K said:

I think you are safe now wilson the likes of Oxford City have given it a good go but they just haven’t got the squad or the cash to stay up. 

Need at least two more wins, and maybe even one more I think. We'll see. Oxford City are definitely done though.

[Sidi Fidi Gold]

On 27/03/2024 at 13:07, wilsontown said:

Oh God, how long have you got?

I guess the short version of this season is that we started with an enthusiastic amateur as manager and got terrible results, hired a former Sheffield Wednesday goalkeeper as head of recruitment, recruited an absolute set of misfits with no coherent idea of how they were supposed to play, and sacked the manager and hired another one with a completely different playing philosophy (twice).

The current manager was previously flying high with Worthing in the National League South, but clearly didn't know anything about any of our players or our league when he arrived. Hopefully he has been learning quickly as we won the last two, but it's going to be a scrap to stay up. All this with one of the biggest budgets in the division. Absolute object lesson in how not to run a football club, but we've been a basket case for years and this kind of #######how has long been coming.

Are York making a concerted effort to get back in the Football League then.

[Tommygilf]

On 24/03/2024 at 13:47, GeordieSaint said:

I find Southgate stubborn and inflexible. He continues to pick the likes of McGuire and Henderson for example. He won’t play TAA when he’s at RB. He persisted with the Yorkshire Pirlo despite him not playing at all at Man City. Not convinced by his tactics either… we are dull despite having some top quality talent. 

He is immensely risk averse, which to be fair has served him well. Teams go far in tournaments by not losing and he is clearly a fan of playing the percentages at the international level. 

Tactically I think he is very limited, though arguably that is the nature of international football vs club football with the amount of time a coach has with his players. He clearly is defensively minded.

I do find it very frustrating that we can have some incredibly talented players like Bellingham, Grealish and Foden, an embarassment of riches most countries would want, that appear to consistently be stunted by the style of play. 

I don't blame him for being loyal to the players he has been loyal to, they have served him well and are his men. He's clearly also a man who understands that the best on field 11 players or best 24 for a squad don't necessarily equate to most success. He's picked "good tourists" and dumped those who have stepped outside of that - Ben White for example. Talent isn't everything to him, and it has made the England team feel much more likeable than it has appeared in the past 2 decades or so.

Its been more successful than any approach before or since (save one tournament in 1966 or maybe Italia 90). In 2018 he had the benefit of low expectations. In 2020(1) we reached the final and got beat by a similarly defensively minded side, 2022 we only just got beat by arguably the best squad in the world. We also won a penalty shoot out in 2018 - so he's doing something right.

Its difficult to say what happens next really. England are one of the best in Europe and the World, certainly good enough to win international tournaments. Southgate's style seems to get us to these big games, but I'm not convinced it allows us to win them.

[Gerrumonside ref]

2 hours ago, Tommygilf said:

He is immensely risk averse, which to be fair has served him well. Teams go far in tournaments by not losing and he is clearly a fan of playing the percentages at the international level. 

Tactically I think he is very limited, though arguably that is the nature of international football vs club football with the amount of time a coach has with his players. He clearly is defensively minded.

I do find it very frustrating that we can have some incredibly talented players like Bellingham, Grealish and Foden, an embarassment of riches most countries would want, that appear to consistently be stunted by the style of play. 

I don't blame him for being loyal to the players he has been loyal to, they have served him well and are his men. He's clearly also a man who understands that the best on field 11 players or best 24 for a squad don't necessarily equate to most success. He's picked "good tourists" and dumped those who have stepped outside of that - Ben White for example. Talent isn't everything to him, and it has made the England team feel much more likeable than it has appeared in the past 2 decades or so.

Its been more successful than any approach before or since (save one tournament in 1966 or maybe Italia 90). In 2018 he had the benefit of low expectations. In 2020(1) we reached the final and got beat by a similarly defensively minded side, 2022 we only just got beat by arguably the best squad in the world. We also won a penalty shoot out in 2018 - so he's doing something right.

It’s difficult to say what happens next really. England are one of the best in Europe and the World, certainly good enough to win international tournaments. Southgate's style seems to get us to these big games, but I'm not convinced it allows us to win them.

While I agree with most of this analysis,  I think it hard to underestimate that Southgate’s main group is ageing in defence and in particular no outstanding youthful central defenders are emerging nor is there a natural ‘controller’ or playmaker in the centre of midfield to complement Bellingham and Rice.

It’s not that I disagree with Southgate’s emphasis on team chemistry and coherence by picking a similar core every time, just that at the back we are starting to creak (look at what happened in the last week against an average Brazil when we lost Walker’s covering pace) and this is probably a big part of Southgate’s conservative approach.

One unfair criticism levelled at Southgate has been his failure to innovate but to be fair he lead the way with adapting Trent Alexander Arnold into more advanced central positions to take advantage of his range of passing.  TAA had experience of this at a youth level at Liverpool but I think Southgate deserves some credit in this more recent conversion.

 

 

 

 

[gingerjon]

2 hours ago, Tommygilf said:

He is immensely risk averse, which to be fair has served him well. Teams go far in tournaments by not losing and he is clearly a fan of playing the percentages at the international level. 

Tactically I think he is very limited, though arguably that is the nature of international football vs club football with the amount of time a coach has with his players. He clearly is defensively minded.

I do find it very frustrating that we can have some incredibly talented players like Bellingham, Grealish and Foden, an embarassment of riches most countries would want, that appear to consistently be stunted by the style of play. 

I don't blame him for being loyal to the players he has been loyal to, they have served him well and are his men. He's clearly also a man who understands that the best on field 11 players or best 24 for a squad don't necessarily equate to most success. He's picked "good tourists" and dumped those who have stepped outside of that - Ben White for example. Talent isn't everything to him, and it has made the England team feel much more likeable than it has appeared in the past 2 decades or so.

Its been more successful than any approach before or since (save one tournament in 1966 or maybe Italia 90). In 2018 he had the benefit of low expectations. In 2020(1) we reached the final and got beat by a similarly defensively minded side, 2022 we only just got beat by arguably the best squad in the world. We also won a penalty shoot out in 2018 - so he's doing something right.

Its difficult to say what happens next really. England are one of the best in Europe and the World, certainly good enough to win international tournaments. Southgate's style seems to get us to these big games, but I'm not convinced it allows us to win them.

Agree with that - it's also worth saying that Italia 90 (I believe before your time) saw England limp out of the group stage, and then squeak past Belgium and Cameroon before playing 1 (one) good game that they lost on penalties but should have won. They were mostly really not very good in it.