Salford to move to Moor Lane?

[dboy]

Wakefield, Cas & Fev are each receiving £2m from WMDC.

WMDC have stood guarantor on a £3m local govt loan, for the purchase of the BV ground. 

These figures are NOTHING compared to the money LCC have chucked into the rugby and cricket grounds over the years.

[Just Browny]

14 minutes ago, Sir Kevin Sinfield said:

I find it bizarre when fans believe the local authority (council tax payers) should pay for their stadium upgrades, you get a similar attitude with Wakefield and Castleford fans as well as at Salford. They are basically asking for their neighbours to subsidise their hobby of watching Rugby League.

This presumably is true of libraries or swimming pools, where a council subsidises hobbies of reading or swimming.

I am being a bit facetious of course and you're right that local authorities shouldn't just be spending public cash on private companies (which RL clubs are). Council support can be appropriate in many cases provided it is proportionate, offers some protection to the taxpayer and is of benefit to the community - there are plenty of stadia in RL where facilities are shared with the local public sector to provide community facilities - health clinics, education centres etc.

[dboy]

2 minutes ago, Just Browny said:

This presumably is true of libraries or swimming pools, where a council subsidises hobbies of reading or swimming.

I am being a bit facetious of course and you're right that local authorities shouldn't just be spending public cash on private companies (which RL clubs are). Council support can be appropriate in many cases provided it is proportionate, offers some protection to the taxpayer and is of benefit to the community - there are plenty of stadia in RL where facilities are shared with the local public sector to provide community facilities - health clinics, education centres etc.

Agree completely and it's worth noting that the £2m to the WMDC clubs is tied to them delivering measurable community outcomes. They aren't give-aways.

[idrewthehaggis]

On 29/12/2021 at 16:34, dboy said:

Will you pay rent at Peninsula?? Shouldn't you be aiming to own your next home?

Peninsula does NOT have the same land footprint associated with Cas - nowhere near.

Salford aren't "well-run and debt free" - you can't afford your rent because you overspend on players and your CVA debt was written off because you didn't pay it and it timed out. That's not a well run club.

Salford decided not to run an academy because they, well, couldn't afford one - despite Billy Big ###### Koukash saying XYZ. The RFL did not "supress" you.

 

 

D boy thanks for the praise.

Just to respond. The 2-3k figure comes from,a statement made by the club a year ago on BBC radio Manchester in response to the then prospect of attendances being restricted to 4000 (stop laughing at the back now) at the AJ Bell of Doom.

The club maintained that after STH and hospitality, ettc, that would leave around 1000 tickets available. Most they presumed for away followers. It is known the stadium company only count literal attendees, not non attending STH. Under Koukash, up to 40% didn't roll up. 

Footprint. It surprises me, but they are roughly the same.

As you can see Castleford trots out at 19,000 sq m

Wakefield register as 20,000 sq m.

And Moor Lane is down at 19,350 sq m.

What the former have and Moor Lane doesn't, are car parks, which I can excuse any one for thinking these grounds lie on bigger footprints. BUT no club is likely to build on such easy access/ revenue boosting land are they

If all three could be developed as modern 12-8k stadiums, run/owned by each respective club, then the whole game would be enhanced for sure.

The jury is out whether the CVa write off was canny or not. 

The club and many others felt the Academy bid was excellent. The RFL had an agenda to restrict Academy for favoured sides, that to a degree was successfully challenged. SRD will be fine next time,  albeit I hope common sense prevails and we go for regional academies.

I hope this helps.

[dboy]

The footprint of Moor Lane is literally the pitch, stands and surrounding walkways.

Cas have a training pitch alongside, and Wakefield has a huge car park and the footprint of the old Theatre Club.

Apart from the fact that it can't be extensively developed, I think you've already conceded that Salford won't own Moor Lane - who are you gonna con, sorry encourage, to put money into any potential development this time?

[dboy]

I've got a bit of mapping software I can use to measure the footprints - and I am bored. I'll have a quick look now.

[idrewthehaggis]

17 hours ago, Robthegasman said:

As a Council Tax payer who has the misfortune to pay my Council Tax to Salford City Council I don’t think one single penny of public money should be spent on that ground.Besides Salford RLFC have had quite a lot of public money given to them and either none of it or very little of it has been paid back.

 

Rob I might agree. If I assume her a "west" Mancunian from Swinton, would you petition your club to refuse if a council the same as offered to SRD. The injustice is Swinton haven't.

3 hours ago, Sir Kevin Sinfield said:

I find it bizarre when fans believe the local authority (council tax payers) should pay for their stadium upgrades, you get a similar attitude with Wakefield and Castleford fans as well as at Salford. They are basically asking for their neighbours to subsidise their hobby of watching Rugby League.

3 hours ago, Sir Kevin Sinfield said:

 

[dboy]

Square metre footprints, measured on Digimap (University of Edinburgh Ordnance Survey mapping tool).

Moor Lane = 17916

Cas = 31936

Wakefield = 29139

[idrewthehaggis]

Fair points Boy. I used the measuring device on Google Earth and included only the land that could be used to build the stands and the pitch of course. In terms of developing the Stands, I purposely did not count the car parks/etc .

We can both agree that each club will hopefully try and squeeze in what is needed and as long as its modern and safe.,

I am optimistic on this score.

As for ownership, currently Salford council own the land at Moor Lane, Salford City FC own and run the facilities. A peppercorn rent is paid.

The current discussions are to¬

Discuss the terms of the sale of the AJ Bell stadium owners Peel and Salford council to a new stadium company (owned by Sale Sharks and Salford City FC).

Negotiate the transfer of the facilities at Moor Lane from Salford City to Salford council.

Agree the ending of SRD contract at the AJ Bell.

And set the terms of using Moor Lane. All options being considered. What is mainly cordial is SRD will run Moor Lane. 

The presumption is SRD will seek to expand the ground to 8000. Going off other examples that would be costed by revenue increases. Industrial loans, community shares and/or bonds, supporters fund.and government grants .

 

 

 

[voteronniegibbs]

.

[Sir Kevin Sinfield]

16 hours ago, dboy said:

You really don't want to go there!

https://democracy.leeds.gov.uk/ieDecisionDetails.aspx?AIId=62171

Leeds city council have not funded the development of Headingley Stadium, I believe they have basically acted as a guarantor on a loan which will be repaid in full and cost the council nothing. 

[CornwallRL]

Just as an outsider, didn't Salford RLFC (1914) go bankrupt, or insolvent recently,  and set up a new company, therefore any contracts that were signed with the previous company are null & void.

[Mattrhino]

20 hours ago, Sir Kevin Sinfield said:

I find it bizarre when fans believe the local authority (council tax payers) should pay for their stadium upgrades, you get a similar attitude with Wakefield and Castleford fans as well as at Salford. They are basically asking for their neighbours to subsidise their hobby of watching Rugby League.

I find it weird that this country is so against using public funds to upgrade sporting facilities or to provide community infrastructure to a sporting club that has been in the community for 130 years. We have always been so behind in this respect compared to other developed countries.

[Scubby]

9 hours ago, voteronniegibbs said:

Whoop whoop, we've won something again at last

I played junior RL on the back field way back. Often wondered why they didn't create a new stadium which utilised the extra space.

[DI Keith Fowler]

21 hours ago, dboy said:

Square metre footprints, measured on Digimap (University of Edinburgh Ordnance Survey mapping tool).

Moor Lane = 17916

Cas = 31936

Wakefield = 29139

Love this, this is exactly the sort of stuff I come here for. 

[dboy]

16 hours ago, voteronniegibbs said:

Whoop whoop, we've won something again at last

Think of it like Monopoly land though - Salford is brown and Wakefield is blue.

Cas = go directly to jail.

Leigh isn't in the game, as it doesn't have a railway station.

[ATLANTISMAN]

7 hours ago, Mattrhino said:

I find it weird that this country is so against using public funds to upgrade sporting facilities or to provide community infrastructure to a sporting club that has been in the community for 130 years. We have always been so behind in this respect compared to other developed countries.

YES we are compared to lets say France, and it works well until some loony council orders you to move in with your arch rivals (Union) 

Paul

 

[CornwallRL]

I had a drink today with a guy who knew the shanty town that was The Willows, he said, & I quote from my notes, the North Stand should've been made all seater, but the yobs disagreed, the shed, Weaste Road side could be demolished, and a new stand & changing rooms, and spectacular Eastern Stand, from Willows Road to join North Stand could be built, without inflicting on residents light, while changing rooms would be one season in a portacabin, then destroy the Kennedy Road Stand, and build a two tier, low tier Stand, 10 meters forward, and leave the Variety club end for 5 more years, as it was the only place you could get a beer, it wasn't making any money, so demolish & build a new covered Stand. There were no houses overlooking to complain about Planning Regs.

A huge 4 sided stadium, would've looked lovely according to Hags.

From the top of the Nirth Stand he said you could see Wales.

[Josef K]

If/when Salford move i hope it works for them and they can get old & new fan’s going to the match. 

[Red Willow]

It wouldn't have been that easy. The ground was small, the pitch wasn't 100m long. There are houses down the shed side, so not sure a 2 tier stand would have been possible, just as it isn't at Headingley. The North Stand seats weren't used that much so don't understand why you would want to create more. 

I believe John Wilkinson looked at the costs of a revamp and the cost was prohibitive. If the original scheme hasn't been called in and delayed by a couple of years then Salford RLFC would have owned the stadium and the revenue. The delay meant the scheme never happened.

[Henson Park Old Firm]

https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/60807170

[redjonn]

On 31/12/2021 at 10:59, Mattrhino said:

I find it weird that this country is so against using public funds to upgrade sporting facilities or to provide community infrastructure to a sporting club that has been in the community for 130 years. We have always been so behind in this respect compared to other developed countries.

Don't disagree in general but which sports should have the privilege.  Especially not if a its only a minimal percentage of the councils population that supports whatever that sport is.

Of course use public funds to upgrade sporting facilities but I question use of such for a professional club. Especially if those facilities are not open to the general public to use for sport playing every day.

 

[idrewthehaggis]

So SCFC will move to the AJ Bell stadium in August 2023.

The questions it raises.

!. Will SRD remain at the AJ Bell Stadium?

2. If no, where to?

3. If the answer is Moor Lane, then-

a. Do SRD vacate the AJ Bell in August or September 23?#

b. In the 18-24 months before the SRD move, how much can the club "re-build" Moor Lane.

Not much time to raise funds, plan, get permission, build and H and S check it..

The fortunate thing is those Meccano stands at Moor Lane are easy to dismantle, extend and build.

4. Or will SRD not move till the end of 2024?

5. Given the swiftness of the possible move, will the RFL/Salford Council do the sensible thing and support the transfer?

[Leyther_Matt]

20 hours ago, Henson Park Old Firm said:

https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/60807170

“Salford City Reds”  

[WSRD]

15 minutes ago, Leyther_Matt said:

“Salford City Reds”  

It is the BBC after all Matt