25 Nov: RLWC2017 (Semi Final): England v Tonga - Match Thread

[flyingking]

6 minutes ago, JohnM said:

I don't know how you find the time to post on here, what with you being the video ref over in Auckland at the same time.   

That's why I am the flyingking!

[stevereed100]

Thought we were well led by our captain. His ball handling display, line breaks and general domination of game management stood out.

All that pre match concern put to rest?

Still one last chance for him next week...if he plays more minutes next week we are doomed.

On reflection did he play today?

Seems we do have an alternative.

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, stevereed100 said:

Thought we were well led by our captain. His ball handling display, line breaks and general domination of game management stood out.

All that pre match concern put to rest?

Still one last chance for him next week...if he plays more minutes next week we are doomed.

On reflection did he play today?

Seems we do have an alternative.

He did play. He played very well and we could have done with him being on the pitch for those last 10 minutes as we do seem a lesser team without him.

[Mattrhino]

58 minutes ago, Adelaide Tiger said:

I don't know if someone else has mentioned it but I just want to say what a great effort by Whitehead to stop Fifita - a real try saving effort.

Just as good as Danny Houghton's effort in the CC Final.

No thanks to the awful Union style tackle Kev Brown put in on Fifita

[Mattrhino]

18 minutes ago, Maximus Decimus said:

Here's where it becomes even more of a mess than it is now. The defending player basically cannot go near the ball for fear of touching it and it coming loose. After all, had it happened in the middle of the pitch Fifita would have another 6 tackles. 

I think we'd see even more knock ons ruled incorrectly causing even more frustration. 

At least the way it is now the player is made responsible for ball possession. It's quite hard to strip a ball that is well protected. If a player moves the ball to a position where it is more likely to come out that is his decision and any 50/50 call goes against him.

NFL players are taught to tuck the ball under thier armpit while also putting pressure on the point of the ball, and when running in to a collision they wrap up with two hands so it is very hard to knock free. I know it is not a perfect analogy but in today's game we have players running the ball with one hand flailing it about looking for a pass or to ground a try, you can't then have them getting an advantage if a tackler dislodged the ball in the act of a tackle.

[Maximus Decimus]

7 minutes ago, Mattrhino said:

NFL players are taught to tuck the ball under thier armpit while also putting pressure on the point of the ball, and when running in to a collision they wrap up with two hands so it is very hard to knock free. I know it is not a perfect analogy but in today's game we have players running the ball with one hand flailing it about looking for a pass or to ground a try, you can't then have them getting an advantage if a tackler dislodged the ball in the act of a tackle.

The alternative would be to do away with the stripping rule altogether and make it a free for all.

You wouldn't see Fifita doing a one handed carry then.

[Mattrhino]

1 minute ago, Maximus Decimus said:

The alternative would be to do away with the stripping rule altogether and make it a free for all.

You wouldn't see Fifita doing a one handed carry then.

If he had the ball tucked into his chest like you are coached to do from school days, he would have probably scored the try. I think this interpretation is the best way.

[MattSantos]

Cant sleep. Outside is bedlam and i thought id join them . 

Some of the wifes takeaways.. it was her 3rd ever game; 1st being the PNG game

Graham is deservedly my favourite player. He was everywhere.

We dont pass the ball enough.. especially conpared to Aus. Interesting!

We did the same kick everytime and i moaned at nearly everyone

Ouch. Massive ouch

It was really cold. 

 

 

[Mattrhino]

1 minute ago, MattSantos said:

Cant sleep. Outside is bedlam and i thought id join them . 

Some of the wifes takeaways.. it was her 3rd ever game; 1st being the PNG game

Graham is deservedly my favourite player. He was everywhere.

We dont pass the ball enough.. especially conpared to Aus. Interesting!

We did the same kick everytime and i moaned at nearly everyone

Ouch. Massive ouch

It was really cold. 

 

 

Well our two centres don't pass the ball at all which is a slight issue.

[henage]

If the people that run rugby league cant build on todays game (plus others) then well I will be very disappointed .

The skill , speed , aggression , commitment and that's just the crowd .

Always thought England didn't have enough points in the bag , didn't expect that in the last few minutes , maybe  the games finest few minutes ?

The atmosphere coming out of the TV was fantastic , the Hyms wow , can league apply to copyright them    

[yanto]

3 hours ago, Northern Eel said:

Great effort from Tonga in the competition. Probably the third best rugby league team in rlwc17.

Heres the 2nd try forward pass. ?

 

Check out the grounding for Tonga's first try .From behind the goal it looks short of the line .

[deluded pom?]

17 minutes ago, MattSantos said:

Cant sleep. Outside is bedlam and i thought id join them . 

Some of the wifes takeaways.. it was her 3rd ever game; 1st being the PNG game

Graham is deservedly my favourite player. He was everywhere.

We dont pass the ball enough.. especially conpared to Aus. Interesting!

We did the same kick everytime and i moaned at nearly everyone

Ouch. Massive ouch

It was really cold. 

 

 

When we attended the Samoa v Tonga game our motel was only a couple of hundred yards from the stadium. I took ear plugs with me 

[deluded pom?]

1 minute ago, yanto said:

Check out the grounding for Tonga's first try .From behind the goal it looks short of the line .

That was my first thought too. I thought Thaler would give a DM. Popped to the loo came back and they're taking the conversion. 

[Damien]

3 minutes ago, yanto said:

Check out the grounding for Tonga's first try .From behind the goal it looks short of the line .

Yeah I thought that at the time.

[Adelaide Tiger]

58 minutes ago, Mattrhino said:

No thanks to the awful Union style tackle Kev Brown put in on Fifita

Without looking at any stats I thought Brown was pretty good defensively.

[Dave T]

1 hour ago, Wellsy4HullFC said:

But the carrier has knocked on. He's dropped the ball forwards because he wasn't holding it securely. That's what a knock on is, whether it was accidentally touched or not in the process. The onus is in him to keep hold of the ball.

This is consistent with my view of the Wigan no try in the CCF.

You can't just release the ball because there's a hand in it and play on. The game would be a mess. Ball control is essential, especially under pressure. Under your interpretation, you'd be able to squeeze the ball out in any tackle situation and it wouldn't matter which way it went. 

The knock on rule is not in place if a ref deems it is stolen by the defender so there is a precedent for it.

[Dave T]

1 hour ago, Maximus Decimus said:

Here's where it becomes even more of a mess than it is now. The defending player basically cannot go near the ball for fear of touching it and it coming loose. After all, had it happened in the middle of the pitch Fifita would have another 6 tackles. 

I think we'd see even more knock ons ruled incorrectly causing even more frustration. 

At least the way it is now the player is made responsible for ball possession. It's quite hard to strip a ball that is well protected. If a player moves the ball to a position where it is more likely to come out that is his decision and any 50/50 call goes against him.

My solution removes this. No knockons - if a defender goes for the ball intentionally it is a penalty no matter how the carrier is holding it. 

My change would be if the defender hits the ball accidentally then just play on. No offence either way.

[Dave T]

But anyway, ive said my piece on the controversy, i need an afternoon nap and then im cracking open the booze!

[Wiltshire Rhino]

In a local union club bar and most of the pre-match talk is about this mornings game and most of the chat is positive and most are looking forward to next week. Even though most in the bar have already watched the game, they're looking forward to watching the highlights in 15mins. 

 

However one bloke found it "boring" but was told "I know it's not rugby rugby, but that was a great game even before the last 5 minutes." He was surprised no-one else felt the same. 

 

It all gave me a warm glow inside, which I'm cooling off with another pint of Thatchers Gold.

 

I'm having a great day!!! 

[GeordieSaint]

2 hours ago, flyingking said:

The relevant law of the game is

Broken tackle Where the player in possession is brought to the ground, a tackle is not effective if the hold on the player in possession is broken before he is grounded. 

The clue is in the rule... hold. Simply touching somebody isn’t holding them. 

[DavidM]

What the f&£@?!£g hell was going on there ? For 75 minutes we smashed them physically , up front , outstanding Aussie like defence ... then what ? I honestly thought we were gonna do it again I couldn’t believe it !!our forwards and defence was outstanding until then , whitehead graham etc really strong and Widdop great out the back . I still don’t know where the man of steel has gone ... looks shot for confidence , just struggling to impose himself on games with to much poor quality and execution and several big missed tackles . Overall good for nine tenths and then our best effort to do an English sport moment again , but not quite succeeding this time !!!! By the way FIFITA always drops the ball and should never get penalties for it , refs must know their players . Same with Sam

[Cumbrian Fanatic]

1 hour ago, yanto said:

Check out the grounding for Tonga's first try .From behind the goal it looks short of the line .

I thought that in real time but the referee said he'd seen it over the line so they didn't seem to look for it when referred to the VR

[Futtocks]

Watching the highlights now and, even though I know the result, I'll probably still need a couple of tranquillisers near the end.

[DavidM]

1 minute ago, Futtocks said:

Watching the highlights now and, even though I know the result, I'll probably still need a couple of tranquillisers near the end.

Wonder how many people said ‘ even we can’t mess it up from here ‘?

[chuffer]

just saw the highlights, awesome game and plenty of positives ....however, I think we invited that come back, we looked dead on our feet for the last 10mins....no line speed, ball watching, falling off tackles....bit worrying going into next week's game