Sat 18 Jun: England v Combined Nations All Stars KO 17:45 (Sky)

[Dunbar]

1 minute ago, Harry Stottle said:

There are those who say that winning the WC would be the best tonic for the game in this country and it would create more interest in both participation and spectator levels, conversely would a dissapointing tournament have the opposite effect?

I think the good news is that there is more upside than downside when it comes to international success.

If we, as a sport, delivered a very good World Cup - which is what I expect with so many competitive teams now - then the sport will get a boost in this country even if England don't do as well as we hope.

We need to get into the semi's to perhaps keep the attention of the wider sporting public but in a home World Cup I think that is achievable. 

I agree with you though that aspiring for an English win overall is heart over head stuff.

[UTK]

20 minutes ago, arcticchris said:

Of the CNAS 17 I think only Miller, Croft and Leeming have never played full international games.

Several of those out there will be strong contenders to feature in the World Cup squads for Tonga and Samoa.

A fair way from the best they could field but still a lot of quality rugby league players.

Leeming made his debut for England v France last year. 

Miller, Croft, Sio, Edwards, Satae, Tanginoa and Prior have not made their test debuts.

I'm quite surprised by a few of those that haven't to be honest.

[Damien]

43 minutes ago, arcticchris said:

Of the CNAS 17 I think only Miller, Croft and Leeming have never played full international games.

Several of those out there will be strong contenders to feature in the World Cup squads for Tonga and Samoa.

A fair way from the best they could field but still a lot of quality rugby league players.

Like who?

[sfmedusa]

Looking at the names in the CNAS team I was a little worried that we were about to get ####### quite seriously, but also wondering why so many of the names I would expect to see in the team weren't there (everybody from Bevan French and Jai Field to Chris McQueen, Krisnan Inu and Blake Ferguson).  As a Wigan fan I'm quite glad that French and Field weren't in the team, but that was mainly because it's just our luck for them to play in the CNAS and not be available for the rest of the season for us due to injury as a result.

Not the most exciting match, but since there's sod all superleague to watch this weekend I suppose it will do.

[RigbyLuger]

4 hours ago, StandOffHalf said:

Sarge is still in Wane's thoughts.

''Dan Sarginson [of Salford] is injured and knows I will pick him if he is flying over the next few months."

Shaun Wane: England boss says '10 spots' still available for World Cup - BBC Sport

Never believe a coach who says he'll pick on form when you look at the squad from this week.

[arcticchris]

27 minutes ago, Damien said:

Like who?

Mata’utia, Sio, Fonua. Not starting lineup but squad possibilities 

[Ant]

I'll not comment on CNAS, other that they were hamstrung by lack of players. If the strongest CNAS squad is named, they'd have blown that England side away - and I think that lack of players needs to be addressed. 

 

Every time an England coach says they'll pick on form, they are lying. Every time they pick their favourites and club counts more than individual ability.

Leeming should have been the England hooker years ago, for example and I bet he still won't get picked this time, despite being one of the best 9s in the country.

You could have picked pretty much any other English qualified winger over Hall last night and got a better outcome all round, both in last night's game and future development.

Lastly, the commentary was awful. As usual. Genuinely made the game seem poor to watch 

[Davo5]

Have tried to support Wane as England coach but it is worrying that he picked McShane & Mclloram over Leeming & Clark and brought back over the hill Watkins,Hall & Cooper and the fact he’s still talking up Sarginson is bewildering.

The England squad is desperately short of pace,& athleticism the 2 thing that are a must in todays game,we do have young players who have those qualities but I fear Wane hasn’t the courage or foresight to pick them.

[Dunbar]

3 hours ago, Ant said:

I'll not comment on CNAS, other that they were hamstrung by lack of players. If the strongest CNAS squad is named, they'd have blown that England side away - and I think that lack of players needs to be addressed. 

 

Every time an England coach says they'll pick on form, they are lying. Every time they pick their favourites and club counts more than individual ability.

Leeming should have been the England hooker years ago, for example and I bet he still won't get picked this time, despite being one of the best 9s in the country.

You could have picked pretty much any other English qualified winger over Hall last night and got a better outcome all round, both in last night's game and future development.

Lastly, the commentary was awful. As usual. Genuinely made the game seem poor to watch 

The only thing I disagree with here is that the strongest CNAS team would have blown England away.  That England team, while not to everyone's liking, still contained some of the very best players in Super League over the last 4 or 5 seasons... it may have beaten a full strength CNAS team and it may have lost, but it wouldn't have been blown away.

[Ant]

2 hours ago, Davo5 said:

The England squad is desperately short of pace,& athleticism the 2 thing that are a must in todays game,we do have young players who have those qualities but I fear Wane hasn’t the courage or foresight to pick them.

Agreed, and I'm not sure it's limited to Wane - it's been endemic in England coaches for years. 

[Damien]

25 minutes ago, Dunbar said:

The only thing I disagree with here is that the strongest CNAS team would have blown England away.  That England team, while not to everyone's liking, still contained some of the very best players in Super League over the last 4 or 5 seasons... it may have beaten a full strength CNAS team and it may have lost, but it wouldn't have been blown away.

I agree, there is no way England would have been blown away. Yes they had some good players missing and yes you could have picked another good team out of players that were missing. However I'm not particularly convinced that team, or the best of everyone available, would have been far stronger and in many positions its swings and roundabouts. 

[Dave T]

2 hours ago, Dunbar said:

The only thing I disagree with here is that the strongest CNAS team would have blown England away.  That England team, while not to everyone's liking, still contained some of the very best players in Super League over the last 4 or 5 seasons... it may have beaten a full strength CNAS team and it may have lost, but it wouldn't have been blown away.

Agreed. The players selected were good players. Sure they may have become an 8 rather than a 7 as a team if we'd have had first choice, but let's not make out these players missing were legends. 

[LEEDSLADGONE SOUTH]

Having watched Parramatta vs Rooster’s on Saturday morning I don’t fancy Englands chances. 

[yanto]

Maybe late Maybe been discussed. 

England v Combined nations a disaster. 

The other code England v Barbarians a big success.

Where do we fall down in two similar games ?

[Damien]

11 minutes ago, yanto said:

Maybe late Maybe been discussed. 

England v Combined nations a disaster. 

The other code England v Barbarians a big success.

Where do we fall down in two similar games ?

Are they similar though? The Barbarians is full of stars and internationals from all over. The combined nations is a team scrimped together with anyone that'll play. It also contains many fairly average imports that we see play week in, week out in Super League. I would say their appeal is quite different. 

If England played a genuine All Stars team full of star players from elsewhere then I think the appeal would be substantially more. The combined nations is far from that.

Edited June 19, 2022 by Damien

[Tommygilf]

50 minutes ago, Damien said:

Are they similar though? The Barbarians is full of stars and internationals from all over. The combined nations is a team scrimped together with anyone that'll play. It also contains many fairly average imports that we see play week in, week out in Super League. I would say their appeal is quite different. 

If England played a genuine All Stars team full of star players from elsewhere then I think the appeal would be substantially more. The combined nations is far from that.

I think the fact that some serious talent is often missing (Field and French being the obvious examples) doesn't help the CNAS in being taken seriously; then again being paid £500 probably doesn't help a lot either!

[RigbyLuger]

2 hours ago, yanto said:

Maybe late Maybe been discussed. 

England v Combined nations a disaster. 

The other code England v Barbarians a big success.

Where do we fall down in two similar games ?

Was it? What was the crowd like compared to games in the past?

[gingerjon]

9 hours ago, yanto said:

Maybe late Maybe been discussed. 

England v Combined nations a disaster. 

The other code England v Barbarians a big success.

Where do we fall down in two similar games ?

"Brilliant Baa-Baas thump dismal England" is the first headline I can see.

The crowd was 51,385. Obviously higher than RL gets for our internationals but Twickenham holds 82,000 these days so that's a lot of unoccupied seats.

I also didn't even know the match was happening. Who broadcast it?

[StandOffHalf]

28 minutes ago, gingerjon said:

"Brilliant Baa-Baas thump dismal England" is the first headline I can see.

The crowd was 51,385. Obviously higher than RL gets for our internationals but Twickenham holds 82,000 these days so that's a lot of unoccupied seats.

I also didn't even know the match was happening. Who broadcast it?

I also didn't have a clue about the Baa Baas game at Twickers, until I saw that headline this morning on the start page of my laptop.

I think it was on Amazon, so wasn't even on regular TV.

[Toby Chopra]

9 hours ago, yanto said:

Maybe late Maybe been discussed. 

England v Combined nations a disaster. 

The other code England v Barbarians a big success.

Where do we fall down in two similar games ?

I don't really see the games as that similar. The Baa-Baas are a historic, independent club (albeit invitational) with a century of history in their sport, and England have played them on pretty much the same weekend at the same venue every year, for more than two decades.

The CNAS are, well, a short-term wheeze, which ideally we wouldn't even have to play. 

That said, in my mind it could become a regular, useful fixture that showcases the best of what Superleague has to offer - but a/ we'd have to stick with it and b/ it really would have to be the best available. We've been (rightly)  promoting French and Field all year as this remarkable duo shaking up the league, so to not have them play does rather tarnish it.       

[Archie Gordon]

One difference between the RU and RL versions this weekend was the lack of French input in one and a strong French flavour to the other.

If we are to keep this friendly in the calendar, let's get the best 5 French players in - it will help those players and also strengthen their Test team.

Obviously not on the same weekend as France at home.

[Harry Stottle]

12 minutes ago, Archie Gordon said:

One difference between the RU and RL versions this weekend was the lack of French input in one and a strong French flavour to the other.

If we are to keep this friendly in the calendar, let's get the best 5 French players in - it will help those players and also strengthen their Test team.

Obviously not on the same weekend as France at home.

So the addition of 5 French Lads will significantly increase the interest and subsequently the attendance of England v CNAS over here?

[Archie Gordon]

Just now, Harry Stottle said:

So the addition of 5 French Lads will significantly increase the interest and subsequently the attendance of England v CNAS over here?

No. I hate the CNAS idea. 

My point is that at least France (and then England, indirectly) might benefit from having some players involved. 

[UTK]

20 minutes ago, Archie Gordon said:

One difference between the RU and RL versions this weekend was the lack of French input in one and a strong French flavour to the other.

If we are to keep this friendly in the calendar, let's get the best 5 French players in - it will help those players and also strengthen their Test team.

Obviously not on the same weekend as France at home.

In RU the French national team will be playing a dozen tests in a calendar year, I think pushing France RL toward that mark would be more valuable for their development than having the 5 best French players turnout for the CNAS.

Consistent France v England games at Mens, Womens and Juniors levels should be the priority.

[Saint Toppy]

On 18/06/2022 at 21:00, daz39 said:

Forgot Makinson was playing too till he made that tackle at the end.

 

Makinson does a lot of work that often goes unseen - his returns were far more effective than Hall. Watch the lead up to the Williams try. Makinson leaves 2 defenders on the floor by winning the collision which leaves only 1 marker and a huge gap behind the PTB which Bateman brilliantly exploits. If Makinson doesn't win that collision and get the quick PTB then Bateman wouldn't have been able to make that break that led to the try.

He does this week in week out for Saints and is a big contributor to them getting on the front foot.