Thur 23rd Jun: SL: St Helens v Leeds Rhinos KO 20:00 (Sky)

[Father Ted]

No, from St Austin's parish of St Helens!

 

[StandOffHalf]

I turned it off at HT, after seeing the Grace dropped ball that trickled out being given by the Video Ref.

Saints are very good, but I couldn't watch another half of such appalling refereeing. 

Just checked back in the closing ten minutes, in time for the melt-downs by Bentley and Tetevano.

I thought there were some positive signs for Leeds in the opening 40, in how they were competing physically. The Grace try killed it though. They weren't going to come back from 10 points down.

Phil Clarke is by far the best aspect of the Sky commentary team IMO. Some very good observations by him tonight that enliven the Sky dreariness.

[Old Frightful]

37 minutes ago, Father Ted said:

The game was reduced to ridiculous levels by the referees. How many points did Saints score after a wrong decision by the officials? I made it 16 maybe 20. Utter farce. Messrs Grant, Hicks, Kendal and Moore were terrible and ruined what could have been a good game. Grace clearly losing the ball and being given the try then the ball being stripped from Hardaker in a 2 on 1 tackle Saints being given possession and scoring. Dreadful and certainly not acceptable.

Can talk about good tries, poor defence and worse discipline but when the scoring team should not have been in possession then when that happens time after time then it becomes farcical.

 Why would fans travel knowing the game is going to be reff'd by an inexperienced man who will give decisions based on keeping the home crowd off his back rather than accurately reflect what's going on in the game.

At least they no longer give the home team the pen advantage of 10-1 after 60 mins then level up in the last 10 mins. That went on for years but at least we no longer have to watch that.   

I can't argue with any of that. I said to my pal who was watching the game in the pub with me, why don't they just bring the SL trophy onto the pitch and give it to Saints during the game.

I'm no fan of Leeds but my word, they got the rough end of the whistle tonight.

As for the Grace VR try, ffs, that was just laughable.

[StandOffHalf]

Welsby is just a different class. For me he was the MOTM by a country mile out there tonight - even allowing for the fact that I missed the first 25 minutes of the 2nd half.

The way he moves, his toughness, his impishness, his ability to draw opponents with timing, and his adeptness with in-play kicks just make him an all-round footballing talent.

The more I see of him, the more I am impressed. I think he can play in the halves for England and add immensely.

 

 

 

 

[MZH]

1 hour ago, Harry Stottle said:

Agree, whatever that means, why on earth do RL people need to quote the round ball game?

Wenger was notorious for claiming he had never seen contentious things that happened on the pitch. If Arsenal ever got a dubious penalty or there was a red card his stock answer after the game was "I didn't see it."

If there was a rugby league equivalent I would have used that

Edited June 23, 2022 by MZH

[Chrispmartha]

Just now, StandOffHalf said:

Welsby is just a different class. For me he was the MOTM by a country mile out there tonight - even allowing for the fact that I missed the first 25 minutes of the 2nd half.

The way he moves, his toughness, his impishness, his ability to draw opponents with timing, and his adeptness with in-play kicks just make him an all-round footballing talent.

The more I see of him, the more I am impressed. I think he can play in the halves for England and add immensely.

 

 

 

 

Welsby is a fantastic player, I don’t think he’s an international half back though, his pass selection isn’t great sometimes IMO, however he’s still young and has lots to learn, should be in the England squad though, id have him at FB over tomkins

[StandOffHalf]

3 minutes ago, Chrispmartha said:

Welsby is a fantastic player, I don’t think he’s an international half back though, his pass selection isn’t great sometimes IMO, however he’s still young and has lots to learn, should be in the England squad though, id have him at FB over tomkins

Yeah, I wouldn't even have contemplated it just a few short weeks ago. I really like what I see from him though, and there was a lovely delayed pass from him for one of the tries.

Interested to see how he goes for the rest of the season alongside Lomax.

[The Mighty Trin]

On 21/06/2022 at 22:40, The Mighty Trin said:

Saints 36-6 Leeds

A 30 point margin as I said, some fans really don't know their Rugby League on here clearly  

[GUBRATS]

58 minutes ago, Father Ted said:

The game was reduced to ridiculous levels by the referees. How many points did Saints score after a wrong decision by the officials? I made it 16 maybe 20. Utter farce. Messrs Grant, Hicks, Kendal and Moore were terrible and ruined what could have been a good game. Grace clearly losing the ball and being given the try then the ball being stripped from Hardaker in a 2 on 1 tackle Saints being given possession and scoring. Dreadful and certainly not acceptable.

Can talk about good tries, poor defence and worse discipline but when the scoring team should not have been in possession then when that happens time after time then it becomes farcical.

 Why would fans travel knowing the game is going to be reff'd by an inexperienced man who will give decisions based on keeping the home crowd off his back rather than accurately reflect what's going on in the game.

At least they no longer give the home team the pen advantage of 10-1 after 60 mins then level up in the last 10 mins. That went on for years but at least we no longer have to watch that.   

Obviously you are correct , and Leeds have never benefitted from anything similar in their favour in the past have they ? , I think the biggest count of forward passes I've counted at Headingley for Leeds in a single game that didn't get pulled by the ref was 11 

It happens , get over it 

[Chris22]

That was a chaotic match! It looks ti be the way with Leeds under Smith!

Liked a lot of what we did tonight, thought Jon Bennison slotted in excellently at full back. If we pick on merit rather than experience, he should be given another chance next week even if Hopoate is fit.

I say it every week and I'll say it this week. Paasi is a beast. The total opposite of Tetevano. As for Bentley, not sure what there is to say that hasn't already been said?

Catalans away, Wigan at Magic and Huddersfield at home in the next three matches so some test coming up!

[StandOffHalf]

2 hours ago, Live after death said:

Never ever a try, in real time you can see he drops it VR should have confirmed it. Its laughable that thats not over turned. 

Extra-laughable how they went super slow-mo to try to hide the slipping out of the ball.

It trickled out and onto the in-goal. Clearly dropped over the line.

[Padge]

1 hour ago, Father Ted said:

The game was reduced to ridiculous levels by the referees. How many points did Saints score after a wrong decision by the officials? I made it 16 maybe 20. Utter farce. Messrs Grant, Hicks, Kendal and Moore were terrible and ruined 

So you don't even know with the advantage of multiple views, slow mo repeats and multiple commentator discussions what the score should have been.

[Faithful1865]

10 hours ago, Desert Skipper said:

Well I can remember on one occasion that two Saints players, Long and Gleeson, were very happy at Saints letting tries in. 

I'll bet you can!!

[hullste]

8 hours ago, StandOffHalf said:

Extra-laughable how they went super slow-mo to try to hide the slipping out of the ball.

It trickled out and onto the in-goal. Clearly dropped over the line.

It may well have come away from his hand but was there any actual evidence of separation from the hand? No! 

So it went up as a try and couldn't be overturned without clear evidence. Refs make mistakes, Walters one for Leeds went up as a try also just that there was clear evidence to overturn that. 

It is more an issue with the rule itself than the decision made, people on here and on Pie Sports only seem to focus on the decisions that go Saints way and ignore any that go against them as that doesn't fit there conspiracy theory

[dkw]

8 hours ago, GUBRATS said:

Obviously you are correct , and Leeds have never benefitted from anything similar in their favour in the past have they ? , I think the biggest count of forward passes I've counted at Headingley for Leeds in a single game that didn't get pulled by the ref was 11 

It happens , get over it 

Even last night they got away with a few high tackles that led to chances for them, at least 2 blatant forward passes and a couple of knock ons that went unnoticed. Strange how those didnt matter though.

[Saint Toppy]

12 hours ago, Chrispmartha said:

Why can’t an onside player attack the arm

 

Always been the rule that the marker can't reach around and grab the arm of the dummy half unless he's already taken a step away from the PTB area

[FearTheVee]

I'll have to rewatch the game as it seems it was the ref that separated the two teams when I thought I was watching a clear chasm in class. despite Saints having a fair few out.

Leeds got a couple of genuinely rough calls - the Grace try and the Grace ball steal, the latter happens all the time in matches and if that is the sort of thing that "beats" a team then maybe the team isn't good enough.

Leeds, like lots of teams, ran out of gas trying to keep up in the first half and eventually were running on empty and getting mullered.

Edited June 24, 2022 by FearTheVee

[Davo5]

1 minute ago, FearTheVee said:

I'll have to rewatch the game as it seems it was the ref that separated the two teams when I thought I was watching a clear chasm in class. despite Saints having a fair few out.

Leeds got a couple of genuinely rough calls - the Grace try and the Grace ball steal, the latter happens all the time in matches and if that is the sort of thing that "beats" a team then maybe the team isn't good enough.

Now your just making things up,literally no one has stated that the Ref was responsible for Saints getting the win,even though the lad had a shocker.

[FearTheVee]

10 minutes ago, Davo5 said:

Now your just making things up,literally no one has stated that the Ref was responsible for Saints getting the win,even though the lad had a shocker.

He missed a ball steal.  The VR could have overturned the try but the reality is he would have been guessing - he had no angle to be certain that the decision was wrong.  It really wasn't that bad.  I'd say that is more a case of bad luck for Leeds than bad officiating.

Just watching the Grace try again - I can absolutely see why the ref gave it initially (the commentators were saying he'd got it down in real time, I thought he had too).  It's clearly not a "shocker" from the ref.  Not even close.

The ball steal isn't a "shocker" either - they happen every game as they are very difficult to call.  What were the other apparently "shocking" decisions?

Edited June 24, 2022 by FearTheVee

[Harry Stottle]

11 hours ago, Futtocks said:

You've got some fine young players who are only going to get better over the next few seasons. A bit of shrewd work in the marketplace plus a settled coaching environment, and Leeds are capable of being contenders.

I would also add they are reputedly the richest club, so that must count for something.

[StandOffHalf]

3 hours ago, hullste said:

It may well have come away from his hand but was there any actual evidence of separation from the hand? No! 

So it went up as a try and couldn't be overturned without clear evidence. Refs make mistakes, Walters one for Leeds went up as a try also just that there was clear evidence to overturn that. 

It is more an issue with the rule itself than the decision made, people on here and on Pie Sports only seem to focus on the decisions that go Saints way and ignore any that go against them as that doesn't fit there conspiracy theory

It fell away from his hand. The way that the ball trickled out was clear evidence to support an over-turning.

The thing that slightly irks me is when the pictures show something and the video ref sticks with and talks through his initial feeling that doesn't match the pictures.

I thought Leeds were OK in the first half, but it caught up with them in the second. This try probably killed the game, but Saints would almost certainly have come home strong anyway.

Edited June 24, 2022 by StandOffHalf

[Harry Stottle]

10 hours ago, StandOffHalf said:

Phil Clarke is by far the best aspect of the Sky commentary team IMO. Some very good observations by him tonight that enliven the Sky dreariness.

Except the one (in my opinion) when he said that Morgan Knowles can do anything that Isaah Yeo can do, don't get me wrong I think Knowles is a good player but Yeo is very very good and so much better probably the best lock I have seen in a long time.

[Wollo Wollo Wayoo]

I couldn't be bothered scanning back last night to check but did something get thrown from the crowd at Bentley as he walked off following his card?

[Harry Stottle]

6 minutes ago, Wollo Wollo Wayoo said:

I couldn't be bothered scanning back last night to check but did something get thrown from the crowd at Bentley as he walked off following his card?

Yes, quite a number of nasty looks.

[redjonn]

8 minutes ago, Wollo Wollo Wayoo said:

I couldn't be bothered scanning back last night to check but did something get thrown from the crowd at Bentley as he walked off following his card?

yes, my wife thinks it was beer and quite a bit... my wife was mrs disgusted of previous of St Helens about it but as she said only to be expected by a few ,,,,,(we moved a while back)...

Edited June 24, 2022 by redjonn